FINAL FANTASY XI Job Adjustments Manifesto: Paladin

[Cursed]

Argument was an AH perle WAR will outperform a decked out PLD Almace/Ochain.
That depends on the player.
We've seen parses on Itzipapa, turul, Bukhis, Sobek, Amhuluk where a Ukon WAR came behind an Almace PLD.
Ukon WAR was a retarded Taru that full timed 28% haste and ws'd in Bullwhip. Almace PLD had the absolute ideal cdc and tp set. Being a WAR and having a Ukon doesn't compensate for being an idiot. That's my point.
Almace is a great weapon, and some Lv.90 Perle AH WARs CAN be outparsed by a PLD depending on a lot of things.

I'm not saying PLD is a great DD. I'm saying WAR isn't God Mode in FFXI.

[Zagen]

Argument was an AH perle WAR will outperform a decked out PLD Almace/Ochain.
That depends on the player.
We've seen parses on Itzipapa, turul, Bukhis, Sobek, Amhuluk where a Ukon WAR came behind an Almace PLD.
Ukon WAR was a retarded Taru that full timed 28% haste and ws'd in Bullwhip. Almace PLD had the absolute ideal cdc and tp set. Being a WAR and having a Ukon doesn't compensate for being an idiot. That's my point.
Almace is a great weapon, and some Lv.90 Perle AH WARs CAN be outparsed by a PLD depending on a lot of things.

I'm not saying PLD is a great DD. I'm saying WAR isn't God Mode in FFXI.

The argument was about gear comparison not player skill. You know how a PLD requires 2 Emp items to compete with a non Emp wielding DD.

[Cursed]

The argument was about gear comparison not player skill. You know how a PLD requires 2 Emp items to compete with a non Emp wielding DD.

Ochain does nothing for a PLD's dmg output if they're not tanking 10-20 mobs at the same time, which in all likelihood they won't be unless soloing or capping amber. So its really just 1 empyrean.

[Zagen]

Ochain does nothing for a PLD's dmg output if they're not tanking 10-20 mobs at the same time, which in all likelihood they won't be unless soloing or capping amber. So its really just 1 empyrean.

Are you honestly arguing that a near 100% block rate shield won't increase a PLD's damage output in anyway against 1 mob? Sure it isn't the same as 10 trash mobs feeding you TP but it will do a lot more than a non-relic/emp shield. Also Ochain allows PLD to /WAR on a lot more monsters increasing damage potential from the DA, Berserk, and Fencer. So no it is 2 Emps vs. 1 because an Almace/Ochain PLD will be better than an Almace PLD.

[Cursed]

Are you honestly arguing that a near 100% block rate shield won't increase a PLD's damage output in anyway against 1 mob? Sure it isn't the same as 10 trash mobs feeding you TP but it will do a lot more than a non-relic/emp shield. Also Ochain allows PLD to /WAR on a lot more monsters increasing damage potential from the DA, Berserk, and Fencer. So no it is 2 Emps vs. 1 because an Almace/Ochain PLD will be better than an Almace PLD.

First - you don't seem to get it. If a PLD is fighting a mob solo, there's no one to parse against.... If the PLD has any other melee in the pt with them, fighting a mob, it won't be 40-50 seconds before either or both of them are capped on hate, in which case the mob is just going to be twirling around, if it lives that long. In which case, the 5-10 extraTP the ochain PLD gets from blocking 1-2 attacks isn't worth mentioning.

Second - dunno why we're talking about subs. /WAR or gtfo if you're asked to come PLD. /DNC if you're soloing shit. This topic isnt about soloing.

Third- not worth it. never mind, carry on.

EDIT: If you waiting for an ochain to sub /war... i don't even ..

[Zagen]

First - you don't seem to get it. If a PLD is fighting a mob solo, there's no one to parse against.... If the PLD has any other melee in the pt with them, fighting a mob, it won't be 40-50 seconds before either or both of them are capped on hate, in which case the mob is just going to be twirling around, if it lives that long. In which case, the 5-10 extraTP the ochain PLD gets from blocking 1-2 attacks isn't worth mentioning.

Second - dunno why we're talking about subs. /WAR or gtfo if you're asked to come PLD. /DNC if you're soloing shit. This topic isnt about soloing.

Third- not worth it. never mind, carry on.

EDIT: If you waiting for an ochain to sub /war... i don't even ..

First I didn't say I don't /WAR or that I'm waiting for Ochain to /WAR I said it makes it an option on some NMs that /NIN just favors due to En-effects (hi Adzaja). That said PLD isn't an option and won't be even after Ochain for the current events I do because I have other jobs that tank better. Maybe when we're bored I'll pull out PLD/WAR but even then that's a stretch.

You started by contesting that a WAR/SAM with AH gear wouldn't beat an Almace/Ochain PLD. You then go back on what you said and that it depends on the player. You then decide to argue a PLD benefits almost nothing from Ochain yet your initial argument was that Almace/Ochain would beat an AH WAR/SAM... You're all over the place with your arguments. Not sure where you'll go next honestly, but I don't care, you jump around too much to have a nice discussion with.

[Cursed]

First I didn't say I don't /WAR or that I'm waiting for Ochain to /WAR I said it makes it an option on some NMs that /NIN just favors due to En-effects (hi Adzaja). That said PLD isn't an option and won't be even after Ochain for the current events I do because I have other jobs that tank better. Maybe when we're bored I'll pull out PLD/WAR but even then that's a stretch.

You started by contesting that a WAR/SAM with AH gear wouldn't beat an Almace/Ochain PLD. You then go back on what you said and that it depends on the player. You then decide to argue a PLD benefits almost nothing from Ochain yet your initial argument was that Almace/Ochain would beat an AH WAR/SAM... You're all over the place with your arguments. Not sure where you'll go next honestly, but I don't care, you jump around too much to have a nice discussion with.

I'm sorry its not a black and white world and the amount of scenarios where something might or might not be true are too numerous to sum up in a post. You can understand my posts to read that if you want, if that's how simple you need things to be. yes,no.
my responses covered several scenarios because you raised different scenarios.
An ochain can be useful or be useless for increasing dmg output.
to spell it out for you; when you're soloing and you are the only target with hate, it WILL increase your dmg output.
when you are in a party with a half decent lv90 melee on anything that will live longer than 40-50 seconds, ochain is useless in increasing dmg output because the pld won't be benefiting from the tp gain or lack of it due to not being in possession of hate long enough.

Do you understand engrish?

"Ochain does nothing for a PLD's dmg output if they're not tanking 10-20 mobs at the same time, which in all likelihood they won't be unless soloing or capping amber. So its really just 1 empyrean. "

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

Cursed is trolling. /blist and move on.

[Alerith]

How about something as simple as a weaponskill?

Phantom Blade: Absorb (reset) your party's emnity and deliver a five-fold attack. Attack power varies with party emnity.

You're lowering everyone else's emnity, you're gaining that emnity and you're dealing damage based on that. It's perfect for when you have a heavy DD party.

You keep emnity down and your party just needs to "recharge" their emnity in order to get the best effect of this ability.

[Zagen]

How about something as simple as a weaponskill?

Phantom Blade: Absorb (reset) your party's emnity and deliver a five-fold attack. Attack power varies with party emnity.

You're lowering everyone else's emnity, you're gaining that emnity and you're dealing damage based on that. It's perfect for when you have a heavy DD party.

You keep emnity down and your party just needs to "recharge" their emnity in order to get the best effect of this ability.

When it takes a DD 30-90 seconds to cap hate from melee/WS this won't actually do anything. Also completely screws up Co-Tank Situations as you'd reduce the other tanks Enmity.