Do Relic, Mythic, and Empyrean staves lack utility?

[Greatguardian]

Magic Attack Bonus/Magic Defensive Bonus comes to mind. They are the only type of buffs you can get outside of rolls. No other job except a Diffusion BLU can give you anything near it.

I know that there is not a situation where a SMN's buffs would make/break a kill, but we are talking about situations where a SMN can help. DNC can give one type of buff, SMN can adapt to a multitude of buffs. If the mob is evasive enough where the DDs need to have more accuracy, you can give the DDs a Ecliptic Roar and have the DDs eat meat instead of sushi or pizza.

Any buff a SMN can give will increase the kill speed and/or decrease the death speed. DNC too, but DNC's buff only on both the DD's ability to hit the mob and the DNC's ability to hit the mob, a wiff from a DD and they lose the buff.

SMN can definitely buff a mage party pretty well, no argument there. I'm pretty sure SMN/RDM is still king for most party refresh in a single party slot as well. I was speaking solely in terms of SMN in a DD party.

[Cream_Soda]

I don't know of any other job that can solo Onvi.....

Wow, every time, every forum you prove just how much you suck at this game.

You can solo Ovni on a lot of jobs including but not limited to bst, thf, mnk, pup, dnc, etc.

[Greatguardian]

I'm just pissing off everyone else by mentioning solo. A realistic scenario is somewhere in between. I needed the numbers to the value of buffs. Thank you.


So, quick calcs:

4x WAR is 1400 damage, 1 WAR buffed by 3 people is 1000 damage. Seems pretty stupid to buff a WAR unless you assume those buffers are also dealing damage. Argument pro-melee SMN, melee DNC, etc.

Splitting:

The WAR is contributing little more to a party, but I will give him credit for bringing 35% haste out of 80%. I'll split 650 (WAR buffs) and 125 (SMN buffs) accordingly.

WAR (35% self, no party haste) : 284 (self) + 0 SMN + 350 unbuffed = 634
SMN (48% self, 15% party) : 122 (WAR) + 75 self + 275 unbuffed = 472
DNC (10% party): 81 (WAR) + 16 (SMN) + ??? = 97 + ???
BRD (up to cap): 167 (WAR) + 34 (SMN) + ??? = 201 + ???

Obviously, SMN would get more contribution if the DNC and BRD meleed as well. Someone needs to melee, because one meleeing WAR isn't enough.

Rhetorical question: Are you dumb?

The DNC has to melee period, Samba doesn't just magically appear on the mobs. They're also damn good at it. White mages and Bards are in decent parties anyways. 3x DD, BRD, WHM, DNC is a perfectly solid, common party setup for groups that, well, don't suck and are actually bringing 6 people. Hell, it's not uncommon to just do 4x DD, BRD/NIN, DNC, with a WHM outside the party because they're perfectly capable of Accessioning Cures and Shell if they need to. The only reason you don't see it more often in high-end groups is that they don't always bring 6 people, or they're bringing 6 people but including Grellow triggers.

Summoner is the weakest link. Putting them in a group means ditching a WAR, and receiving no new buffs of any value from the Summoner (herp you think they don't have a WHM for Haste?).

[Korpg]

Wow, every time, every forum you prove just how much you suck at this game.

You can solo Ovni on a lot of jobs including but not limited to bst, thf, mnk, pup, dnc, etc.

Hey Dallas, I got a friend for you.

Besides that, you obviously don't read later on and see that I already stated that I didn't know that a THF or DNC have solo'd Ovni also. I knew a RDM could at level 85, but with brew, so I didn't count that.

How about reading everything before typing? K?

[Cream_Soda]

Hey Dallas, I got a friend for you.

Besides that, you obviously don't read later on and see that I already stated that I didn't know that a THF or DNC have solo'd Ovni also. I knew a RDM could at level 85, but with brew, so I didn't count that.

How about reading everything before typing? K?

If you were an idiot on page 2, then I'm going to call you an idiot. If someone came and told you differently later and you realized you were wrong, you were still wrong. I don't need to read 17 pages to tell you a statement you made on page 2 was wrong.

Whether or not you corrected it later is of no concern to me.


Edit: Also you I didn't need to read you saying you didn't know other jobs could solo it when i already knew you didn't know that based on what you said from page 2

[Korpg]

If you were an idiot on page 2, then I'm going to call you an idiot. If someone came and told you differently later and you realized you were wrong, you were still wrong. I don't need to read 17 pages to tell you a statement you made on page 2 was wrong.

Whether or not you corrected it later is of no concern to me.


Edit: Also you I didn't need to read you saying you didn't know other jobs could solo it when i already knew you didn't know that based on what you said from page 2

I was corrected, and unlike you, I accept my mistakes.

It is not my fault you refuse to read past the first sentence, and like to point out every little mistake everyone else makes just to boost your ego.

Besides, why are you here anyway? You have nothing to contribute to this thread. Unless you are here to show your support to Dallas. I see you got your pompoms out for him already.

[Greatguardian]

RDM could solo Ovni at 80 without brew, but that's not really the point. Besides, who wasted 2,000,000 cruor on Ovni at 85? I legitimately did not know that someone actually did something so ... dumb.

[Cream_Soda]

I was corrected, and unlike you, I accept my mistakes.

It is not my fault you refuse to read past the first sentence, and like to point out every little mistake everyone else makes just to boost your ego.

Besides, why are you here anyway? You have nothing to contribute to this thread. Unless you are here to show your support to Dallas. I see you got your pompoms out for him already.

Korpg, worst assumption in the land

[Razushu]

SMN can definitely buff a mage party pretty well, no argument there. I'm pretty sure SMN/RDM is still king for most party refresh in a single party slot as well. I was speaking solely in terms of SMN in a DD party.

I can give 15% haste, 8% attk bonus and 35~dmg enfire full time with room for another buff in the cycle

[Dallas]

(herp you think they don't have a WHM for Haste?).

You're talking to the SMN who hastes their pets. It's the only way. The SMN hastes that party. You also have a WAR/SAM, which (last I read) was not the tank option (WAR/MNK was). The WHM will be healing the WAR a lot and needs to be free to do so.