High Traffic Empyrean Seal Notorious Monster's

[Glamdring]

it's ffxi, it's NMs, there's competition, especially during peak times, deal with it. It sux, we all know it sux, don't expect it to change. Best thing you can do is out-claim them once and take your time, trying 1 proc at a time, hopefully the "bot"-who may or may not be-will get sick of it and run off to do something else.

[Valaris]

Oh, okay. Can you direct us to them?

Not even kidding, last time it was seriously asked on BG no one had any idea what the hell kind of "??? bot" people were talking about. And it's BG, if someone knew they'd say something. 90% of people just use trade macros, and 9% occasionally add a windower plugin which allows people to see and target despawned ???'s. Of course, you still have to trade macro even if you can target a despawned ???.

I'm not saying it's impossible for them to exist. But to say that they're anywhere close to common/widespread is just funny.

did i say they were common? id like you to quote me where i said they were. I simply said they are out there so far ive seen about one or two. they are uncommon just because once reported they are banned pretty quickly. and just an fyi if you can make a bot that can fish for you, claim nms for you then you can certainly create a bot that can perform the simple action of trading a item to a ??? during the 1 second lag time that the server ??? pops and the data transmission to the players where the ??? becomes visible/targetable. people need to actually read these kinda posts carefully its not that they "need to learn to use a trade macro" they already do obviously when they state they are spamming it for the ???. what they are saying is the ??? is poped before the ??? physically appears. luckly for me ive done all my +1s for my jobs so i dont have to deal with it but not everyone has.

[Karbuncle]

did i say they were common? id like you to quote me where i said they were. I simply said they are out there so far ive seen about one or two. they are uncommon just because once reported they are banned pretty quickly. and just an fyi if you can make a bot that can fish for you, claim nms for you then you can certainly create a bot that can perform the simple action of trading a item to a ??? during the 1 second lag time that the server ??? pops and the data transmission to the players where the ??? becomes visible/targetable. people need to actually read these kinda posts carefully its not that they "need to learn to use a trade macro" they already do obviously when they state they are spamming it for the ???. what they are saying is the ??? is poped before the ??? physically appears. luckly for me ive done all my +1s for my jobs so i dont have to deal with it but not everyone has.

:Safeface:

I'm pretty sure ??? Bots don't exist, Every player I've come into contact with, Forum or in game, Has simply advocated the macro posted on page 1.

If this "bot" exists, Its very well hidden. And to be perfectly frank, bad players accuse everyone and everything of botting when they fail at something, So I'll really need some hard evidence before i believe a new super-rare underground ??? bot exists.

Really, You just had some really fast people, chances are they were speed-popping that, or that they popped so quickly your game didn't have time to register it, or it appeared/disappeared so fast you didn't catch it (its happened to me before with people in my own party, So i know it happens without the aid of a bot).

It was either probably just lag on your side or bad luck, Popping an NM before the ??? even loads would definitely throw up a red flag.

[Seriha]

and 9% occasionally add a windower plugin which allows people to see and target despawned ???'s. Of course, you still have to trade macro even if you can target a despawned ???.

This is actually the more worrisome item, as unless you're about to profess having first-hand experience with it, if people using what I believe has been called Allseeingeye (not exactly openly distributed, so you might liken this to knowledge of Salvage duping where only those who "deserve to know" might have it), if they can see it (and you don't actually "see" ???s, you have to target them), they could feasibly prep multi-trade pops in the trade screen and just spam ok when it's due to reappear a minute after death. Granted, multi-pop NMs are rarer relative to single pop, and KI NMs could function differently, but simply being able to have the target prepped is an advantage even if spamming /target macros.

Regardless of this item's existence, all popped mobs deserve the 3 iteration treatment as "go check another NM" might not be an option.

[Greatguardian]

This is actually the more worrisome item, as unless you're about to profess having first-hand experience with it, if people using what I believe has been called Allseeingeye (not exactly openly distributed, so you might liken this to knowledge of Salvage duping where only those who "deserve to know" might have it), if they can see it (and you don't actually "see" ???s, you have to target them), they could feasibly prep multi-trade pops in the trade screen and just spam ok when it's due to reappear a minute after death. Granted, multi-pop NMs are rarer relative to single pop, and KI NMs could function differently, but simply being able to have the target prepped is an advantage even if spamming /target macros.

Regardless of this item's existence, all popped mobs deserve the 3 iteration treatment as "go check another NM" might not be an option.

Google it. Allseeingeye is nowhere near "Exclusive". It's just a windower plugin that doesn't sit on the front page. I know it's mentioned countless times over at FFXIAH (including download links), and people on BG have no problem bringing it up if asked about it. I'd liken it more to SMN burning. Sure, your random player who doesn't read forums may not know about it, but anyone who read BG, FFXIAH, or even asked about it could get a straight answer no matter who they are. I haven't even used it myself (though I know about it because, like I said, it's not exclusive) and I was able to pull up all relevant information on it and download links to it within like 2 minutes of googling.

As for Valaris, how do you know these people were botting? Because they beat little ol' you? That's not proof of anything other than they were faster than you. Find a screenshot of a player's desktop with the bot open over their FFXI screen, or admissions including .exe names by the people who are using it, else you're just throwing out strawmen for the sake of strawmen.

Did I say a bot that traded things would be impossible to make? No way, I'm sure it could be done. Is it being done? If it is, probably only by actual programmers. There's no market for bots in FFXI any more. Developers only distribute when they are able to make a reasonable enough profit from the actual distribution of the product to offset the profit they'd make from having exclusive rights to the product (yes, some people still sell gil for money). Fewer people are willing to drop $20 on a bot any more, so there is no viable market.

As for the whole JP server-side issue deal, unless your internet or computer are crap that should not really be an issue. It is not like JP players are seeing things a full second before we are. The differences are not static, and have a tendency to be too small for us to even perceive. I've beaten people to pops, JP or otherwise. I've been beaten to pops, JP or otherwise. The best tools you have at your disposal are still focus and a good macro.

[Eeek]

Does anyone really consider Allseeingeye as any sort of advantage? It sure won't let players trade items to a ??? any sooner than anyone else. A simple /trade macro and good ol' fashioned button mashing is all that's required. That's how other players are outpopping the OP.

I much prefer working with other groups and sharing ??? spots and NMs, but I will start actively trying to outpop other players who approach us with a rude attitude or start complaining about 'trade bots.'

I guarantee you that 95% of the people complaining these days about 'trade bots' are the same ones who complained years ago about a supposed 'Campaign Lot Bot' that 'guaranteed' high lots on Union drops when that system was new.

/shrug

[Izzybella]

IMO the problem isn't trade macros or not having multiple ??? spawns. The problem is rude players who refuse to alternate even when they drop in on a party already farming seals on a NM. There's no reason to be rude (or greedy) like that but it happens all too often.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Because you have exclusive rights to a NM? It's a courtesy, not a rule.

[MarkovChain]

And to be perfectly frank, bad players accuse everyone and everything of botting when they fail at something,

Because being unable to claim a ??? makes you a bad player. Watchout BG elitism guyz.

[Tamoa]

Because being unable to claim a ??? makes you a bad player. Watchout BG elitism guyz.

"Boohoo I got banned from BG."

What Karbuncle says is very much spot on. The bad players gets outpopped (and 9/10 times the bad players aren't even using a trade macro) and cry "OMG U BOTTER!". Everyone else shrugs it off and try again. It's such a nice excuse for your own fail to say the competition is botting.