Your idea of a challenge.

[Karbuncle]

"It was time consuming!" It's a game, thats what they're for.

Technically games are designed to be fun, not a time consuming job.

However, if you said "Its an MMO, that's what they're for" I agree >___>

MMO's are time sinks, but fun !

[Ravenmore]

Most older players didn't see the time sink drop rates as a challenging, some seen out claiming others as the challenge.

[Seriha]

While i agree, I must ask. What does pose a challenge to you?

While I'm sure people would just brush it off as gimmicks, I'm mainly looking at it as various objectives within a fight other than just taking a mob's HP to zero.

Let's say there's a really, really, really effin' big Ironclad mob, like one foot is the size of a tower. Players could technically enter the inside of the mob, but would possibly face environmental hazards like electrical currents or moving pistons on top of possible internal security mechanisms. Now, you'd want a small party on the outside to be keeping this NM busy since it'd otherwise be able to focus more on ousting intruders. Those on the inside, however, could seek out its power source, whatever "brain" it has, and other possible objectives with the interior itself being randomized enough that every fight can be new enough.

None of this should require an exceptionally rigid party structure like CoP did, but just something sensibly balanced like a tank, healer, a couple DDs, then some support.

As much as some people have creamed their pants over CoP's airship fights, I actually felt they were pretty lame. We had no "feeling" like were in air, but instead it was just your usual stationary battlefield with a pretty background. Now, what if you introduced turbulence, or a means to knock the mob off and win more easily? Protect the engines? Fend off other airborne attackers? Use your imagination.

In a nutshell, I'm seeking more complex fights, not necessarily more difficult.

[Duelle]

heroic raiding in wow: cataclysm

I'll see your heroic Cataclysm and raise you Firefighter. >.>;

[Arlan]

While I'm sure people would just brush it off as gimmicks, I'm mainly looking at it as various objectives within a fight other than just taking a mob's HP to zero.

Let's say there's a really, really, really effin' big Ironclad mob, like one foot is the size of a tower. Players could technically enter the inside of the mob, but would possibly face environmental hazards like electrical currents or moving pistons on top of possible internal security mechanisms. Now, you'd want a small party on the outside to be keeping this NM busy since it'd otherwise be able to focus more on ousting intruders. Those on the inside, however, could seek out its power source, whatever "brain" it has, and other possible objectives with the interior itself being randomized enough that every fight can be new enough.

None of this should require an exceptionally rigid party structure like CoP did, but just something sensibly balanced like a tank, healer, a couple DDs, then some support.

As much as some people have creamed their pants over CoP's airship fights, I actually felt they were pretty lame. We had no "feeling" like were in air, but instead it was just your usual stationary battlefield with a pretty background. Now, what if you introduced turbulence, or a means to knock the mob off and win more easily? Protect the engines? Fend off other airborne attackers? Use your imagination.

In a nutshell, I'm seeking more complex fights, not necessarily more difficult.

I actually like this idea...
Making the environmental an important part of strategy within a fight would make the game even more fun.

Example: Fighting a giant Turtle NM Monster, and the monster hits hard, you can have a NIN kite the Turtle while the DDs have to attack 3 special Switches to activate a canon Beam, The NIN needs to guide the NM near the cannon so the beam hits the NM. When the NM gets hit by the beam, The Turtle NM falls on its back, struggling to get up, and DDs can get the GREEN LIGHT to attack the NM while it trys to get up slowly. Then Repeat for 5-10 times. Also, if the NIN gets hit by the Cannon beam by mistake while trying to guide NM to the cannon beam, It will ONE SHOT the player that is in the way of the beam. That way NIN kiting the Turtle NM needs to not only watch out for the NM but also watch out not to get killed by the beam his trying to guide the NM.

HA!
Tell me what you guys think of that! =) That sounds like a fun Strategy imo.

[Arlan]

Oh ya.. and the NM Turtle is Invincible when it is not flipped over.
So you have no choice but to execute this stategy in order to win.
Making soloing impossible, muhaha!

The NM should hit really hard so u have to kite it. And you have to have a WHM or a healer to heal while DDs try to activate switches to start up the beam! God now I wish SE would so do this. I wana see this kinda Battle field strategy in this game.

The Switches should have HIGH HP so DDs should do higher WSs on it in order to trigger the switch.
So Heavy DDs are highly recomended.. yup.. I can see this being fun already.

[noodles355]

I agree that Salvage was a bit of a challenge. I didn't like being the only one without any gear though, haha.

Was? It still can be if you want. Last salvage I cleared SSR including Long-Armed Chariot duo Sam/War and Thf/Nin. That was a good challenge.

[Arlan]

Was? It still can be if you want. Last salvage I cleared SSR including Long-Armed Chariot duo Sam/War and Thf/Nin. That was a good challenge.

Check out my idea above your post >.>.. plz I want to know what others think including yourself. I put time and imaginations coming up with it lol

[Akujima]

In a nutshell, I'm seeking more complex fights, not necessarily more difficult.

Seriha has got it right, except I'd say add both the complexity and difficulty. Don't give us one and sacrifice the other. More situations that deal with the environment and more complex mob reactions.

Tank and Spank gets extremely boring after awhile.

[Seriha]

I emphasize complexity over difficulty in the sense that we really shouldn't see content where only the smallest fraction of the playerbase can hope to finish. Being better geared could help finish more quickly and safely, but the moment you basically introduce the equivalent of "gear checks" that other MMOs have, you start alienating people who are either unlucky with drops or simply don't have the time to hunt them with any level of expediency. Now, this isn't to say people wearing level 1 RSE should be able to beat everything, but a little bit of common sense should go a long way.