Thief's knife upgrade

LOL I TROL U

I know this has died out by now, but i couldn't post because i had cancelled my account lol. Anyway, i thought we had agreed in the old thread that solutions that excluded TK completely were winners. After all, unless SE went out of its usual way and made TK godly, it will always be a gimp dagger. We will always have something better to use in our offhand.

The 3 solutions i remember were (was there anything else?):

1- a piece of armor with TH+1 that only activates with TK unnequiped
2- removing tp loss from weapon swaps
3- a TH+ cap on equipment, followed by the addiction of new TH+ pieces so TK is excluded

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...-Thief-s-Knife.

Also, SE actually addressed Thief's Knife in a JP Update to a JP Thread.

Basically they told us no. Because the JPs, who were as misguided as we were when we first made the thief's knife upgrade request, only seem fixate on replacing the dagger with a better dagger, not the idea of ridding ourselves of the weapon. Anyway, As Laphine said, since my thread was locked the best and simplest solution with the least time required all while ridding us of the Thief's Knife is!

----Give us a Piece of armor with Latent Effect: Treasure Hunter +1, This latent will only activate when your Treasure Hunter is less than or equal to 6 (Meaning TH3 base, Gloves(+2), Feet(+1)), or It will only activate without a Thief's Knife equipped. Either solution works, though he Less than or equal to TH6 might be easier to program.

Point being, there is a solution that doesn't involve upgrading the Knife, and its stupidly simple.

Basically here a translation:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kincard

In Regards to Equipment with Treasure Hunter



There was an error in the previous post, so I wish to correct it.

In regards to increasing levels of treasure hunter becoming less effective, that was in reference to items that regularly drop frequently.

In regards to the high-value items that players may be more concerned about, "Increases in the level of Treasure Hunter will results in an almost consistent increase per level (Although each level is small)" would be more accurate.

I apologize for the lack of specification in the previous post.

I have expressed the thoughts of "It is difficult to let go of my Thief's Knife when considering party play and reaching TH12" to the development team.

We have discussed the possibility of adding a higher-level Thief's Knife to the game, but we fear this may turn into a situation where Thieves are stuck forever wearing "High-Level Thief's Knife + Thief's Knife", further narrowing the choices of weapons that is already present. We also wish to avoid having to weaken the original Thief's Knife.

In order to solve this problem, we are considering introducing a hard cap to the total amount of Treasure Hunter players can gain through equipment.

It would become a situation where you would feel comfortable saying "Since I have reached the cap, I don't have to worry about bringing my Thief's Knife anymore! (Similar to a situation we wish to create with haste)" I should add that such a cap would not be below the level of what is currently possible for players.

I cannot promise an exact timeframe for implementation yet- I simply wished to convey our current plans to the players.

---

So, they're basically reliving all the mistakes and debates we disgussed and solved years ago in my locked thread. I mean, its almost word for word the discussions we had in that thread I made, and they're replying as if this is the first time anyones even brought up Thief's Knife too them or anything. I know its an old thread and old, but seriously, can they not see how "Dual wielding Thief's Knifes" wouldn't be a problem if they went with the accessory solution?

Looks like they're considering a hard cap on TH from gear, another solution we already came up with years ago in a different TH thread, so I'm glad at least on of the solutions we came up with made it into the heads of one of the dev team.

I can't help but feel jaded, seriously, I'm not angry at anyone in specific, Dev of Community reps, it just hits me in the wrong spot that after years of threads popping up here on the Thief's knife, it finally gets a response in some JP thread and its addressed like the 4-5 or more threads here full of discussion and solutions never existed. Cause theres more than the one I linked, I Passed at least 3 of them when I dug around for mine. I'm grateful we have a response, I just wish the response was made with the knowledge we here in the NA department had accumulated and discussed as well.

Greetings,

First off, I would like to apologize for making any English speaking players feel that their requests and feedback were not answered. I can assure you that this was not the case and that threads that are unanswered are communicated to the development team. Unfortunately, sometimes we are unable to answer certain topics, and there are cases where when the team decides to answer, it is first on the Japanese side as that is their native language.

Now then, on to the actual topic at hand.

Though Karbuncle has summarized and posted a translation of what was communicated I would like to give a slightly more official response about this.

The response from Lomloon, as pointed out, contained incorrect information about the way treasure hunter works. It was mentioned in his first post that once you reach a certain level of treasure hunter, the drop rate would not be affected much even if you continue to stack more treasure hunter. This, however, is only talking about common drops, and continuing to add treasure hunter will boost the drop rate for rare items, though it will be a very slight increase.

We’ve informed the development team again about the feedback mentioning that it’s hard to let go of Thief’s Knife while playing in a party as players want to increase the treasure hunter effect to 12.

The development team was looking into a higher-tier version of Thief’s Knife; however, they felt it would result in thieves equipping both the new knife and the original which would further limit their weapon selection. In order to solve this issue, they are currently looking into placing a cap on treasure hunter from equipment in the future.

With this as well as the addition of other equipment with treasure hunter, we are aiming to make it so you can reach the equipment cap and no longer need to use Thief’s Knife. Please also know that we will not be reducing the value of treasure hunter obtainable with current equipment.

While I can’t make any promises as to when this adjustment will take place, we will be sure to keep you updated as there is progress!

Seriously, how hard would it be to make a new dagger that is the following:

Thief's Better Knife

Dmg: 97 Delay:200 DEX + 10 AGI + 10
Attack + 10 Evasion + 20 Steal +2
Dagger Skill + 188
Parrying Skill + 188
Magic Accuracy Skill + 146
Latent Effect: Treasure Hunter +1 (Active whenever Thief's Knife isn't equipped)

99 THF Item Level: 115

There are already items that the latent activates whenever another specific peice of equipment is equipped, they're very common! So how hard would it be to create the opposite?

Also: We realize the Dev team focuses replies on JP posts because their native language is JP, but we feel like the NA community team often ignores very important and relevant posts about things that the JP portion has responses to.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

First off, I would like to apologize for making any English speaking players feel that their requests and feedback were not answered. I can assure you that this was not the case and that threads that are unanswered are communicated to the development team. Unfortunately, sometimes we are unable to answer certain topics, and there are cases where when the team decides to answer, it is first on the Japanese side as that is their native language.

Now then, on to the actual topic at hand.

Though Karbuncle has summarized and posted a translation of what was communicated I would like to give a slightly more official response about this.

The response from Lomloon, as pointed out, contained incorrect information about the way treasure hunter works. It was mentioned in his first post that once you reach a certain level of treasure hunter, the drop rate would not be affected much even if you continue to stack more treasure hunter. This, however, is only talking about common drops, and continuing to add treasure hunter will boost the drop rate for rare items, though it will be a very slight increase.

We’ve informed the development team again about the feedback mentioning that it’s hard to let go of Thief’s Knife while playing in a party as players want to increase the treasure hunter effect to 12.

The development team was looking into a higher-tier version of Thief’s Knife; however, they felt it would result in thieves equipping both the new knife and the original which would further limit their weapon selection. In order to solve this issue, they are currently looking into placing a cap on treasure hunter from equipment in the future.

With this as well as the addition of other equipment with treasure hunter, we are aiming to make it so you can reach the equipment cap and no longer need to use Thief’s Knife. Please also know that we will not be reducing the value of treasure hunter obtainable with current equipment.

While I can’t make any promises as to when this adjustment will take place, we will be sure to keep you updated as there is progress!

---

I know you're doing your job and stuff, seriously I do. Which is why I did make a note to mention I'm not upset at your or the devs, I know a game company has thousands of people all barking different orders and its more than easy for you or anyone else to lose stuff in the process of exchanging information and so on. It does kinda suck when things like this happen, even though gaming companies are still very much run by humans, and you guys yourselves, are humans, and to error is to human so things like this getting through the cracks happens often enough, its understandable.

I mean, trust me when i first made the post people reading it would probably be going to hell because of the hate-by-associating coming off it, but I edited it... heavily... after I did some brief relaxing.

Camate. Maybe It doesn't need to be said, But i feel like one sentence in my post maybe didn't make the point too clear. I know you guys do your best, and just because I or we sometimes feel left out or unheard, I think most of us here on the forums know at least you guys are doing your end of the bargain and sending the info over. Plus, now you guys have to translate stuff for FFXIV, and I've been to the FFXIV forums, its a dangerous pit of anger and hell.... good luck with that. Tried XIV and saddly it wasn't for me.

Got the SMN Zenith relic though, It was nice for the time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Selindrile

Seriously, how hard would it be to make a new dagger that is the following:

Thief's Better Knife

Dmg: 97 Delay:200 DEX + 10 AGI + 10
Attack + 10 Evasion + 20 Steal +2
Dagger Skill + 188
Parrying Skill + 188
Magic Accuracy Skill + 146
Latent Effect: Treasure Hunter +1 (Active whenever Thief's Knife isn't equipped)

---

Please no. No, no no... no... nonono. Cause if they raise the I.lv again, in another couple months even this dagger will be gimp and useless. It needs to either be a piece of easily removable armor, or the hard-cap solution is the best :)

Quote:

---

Also: We realize the Dev team focuses replies on JP posts because their native language is JP, but we feel like the NA community team often ignores very important and relevant posts about things that the JP portion has responses to.

---

This also causes the effect of NA's praising games like, say WoW, for having great customer feedback and support, and ripping on games like this. Because WoW devs are NA, so they often easily get information to NAs, I'm sure if we were JP we'd have the opposite opinions of certain gaming companies. Its an unfortunate reality and theres really not too much they can do about it, SE or the Community reps. But it is a sad after effect of Multi-national MMOs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

Please no. No, no no... no... nonono. Cause if they raise the I.lv again, in another couple months even this dagger will be gimp and useless. It needs to either be a piece of easily removable armor, or the hard-cap solution is the best :)

---

If they raise the iLv again, they can print a new dagger with the same Latent: Treasure Hunter +1 that only activates if you don't have another of these weapons, etc.

That said, the Hard-Cap _IS_ the best solution, but that may not be the easiest to implement programming wise (not that I have any clue what their code looks like) I was just saying, what I put forth seems like it would be a rather easy thing to implement, and easy-to-do means we fix the problem faster.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Selindrile

If they raise the iLv again, they can print a new dagger with the same Latent: Treasure Hunter +1 that only activates if you don't have another of these weapons, etc.

---

Which seems silly to have them endlessly recycle the crap tier dagger every time they want to raise the i.lv cap. Why worry about them reprinting a dagger over and over having a pile of outdated reprint daggers when a piece of armor or accessory will flat out do the job well and never have to be replaced?

One item one fix done and done.

Quote:

---

That said, the Hard-Cap _IS_ the best solution, but that may not be the easiest to implement programming wise (not that I have any clue what their code looks like) I was just saying, what I put forth seems like it would be a rather easy thing to implement, and easy-to-do means we fix the problem faster.

---

While I don't think its the best solution, the accessory clearly is to anyone willing to admit it, the hard cap is the second best solution and one I'm glad they're at least addressing.

If you mean an accessory that functions the way the proposed dagger did? (ie: latent that activates without thiefknife equipped) sure, otherwise, people will just wear both.

As to worrying about them creating new options, this game is moving to a more vertical gear system with iLevels, /shrug, it's going to be an issue either way with things getting outdated, but yes, fair enough, that would be less hassle for Thfs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Selindrile

If you mean an accessory that functions the way the proposed dagger did? (ie: latent that activates without thiefknife equipped) sure, otherwise, people will just wear both.

As to worrying about them creating new options, this game is moving to a more vertical gear system with iLevels, /shrug, it's going to be an issue either way with things getting outdated, but yes, fair enough, that would be less hassle for Thfs.

---

Yes, the one that function the same way the dagger did with a latent only working when the dagger isn't equipped, or @/below a hard cap.

Regardless, they're really hesitant on adding just 1 new dagger, the idea of them adding a new one every time the I.lvl cap raises is unlikely at best, which is why I'd like a solution that didn't involve a temporary upgrade is all. If they could implement a permanent solution it would be nice.

While the hard cap isn't my first go to, it works, and I appreciate them addressing or at least acknowledging that its garbage THF is glued to a 10 year old weapon.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

I'm grateful we have a response, I just wish the response was made with the knowledge we here in the NA department had accumulated and discussed as well.

---

What, this is NA-only now!? ^^;

Sorry, I couldn't resist. Just sort of joking about comments in general that have the feel of only Japanese and American people playing the game. Who cares about the minority of the minority, et al., huh.


Anyblue, it is interesting to see this issue finally getting some time! I don't think the current direction looks bad either, so keep it up!

If only we had more of it. Time, I mean.

Why not make a Thief Knife set, with a 'set bonus' of TH+1~2?
Or add a Magian path so that anyone can have a "TH+" Weapon. (Bst: Pet Th+" Solves that issue)
Make them worth it.

I mean it makes sense now that Thief has native Dual Wield.
Hell, make it a combo deal, Two Knives and a Throwing weapon.

Because that exacerbates the problem they're trying to solve even further and is exactly the opposite of what they're asking for.

Idk, personally, I liked the "old" thief knife. When it was rare. A status symbol for the people who took the job seriously. Now it's usually relegated to a naked mule who acts as some sort of F'd up sacrificial lamb. I don't see the Dev's suggestion fixing that really.

It wouldn't fix that, someone using a mule to achieve "max TH" in the cheapest/easiest way possible.... but that's not something I see, mules are pretty much exclusively mages that I've seen.

But that's not what they're trying to fix, they're trying to fix Thfs who care about their DD and contribution to the fight of the party being funneled into using a knife that does approximately 1/10th the damage an updated knife would do in that hand, the problem is they feel like they have a lack-of-choice, making a combo set with TH on it, just makes them have even less choices.

Some of the crazy solutions offered are ridiculous. This can be done very easily with low effort from the dev team.

Make a magian quest to upgrade it. Make stops at 105, 119, and whatever upgrades come our way down the road. At worst, at 119, it will be a huge improvement over what we have now.

The dagger will still be called "Thief's Knife," but with improved stats and still R (or R/E now). You won't be able to or forced to dualwield just TKs.

The magian quest could ever been rather creative. Something like adding a new item to some coffers (or a reward from coffer RoE). Turn in so many to upgrade the knife.

Wow, let's not make this incredibly unlikely by asking for ridiculous fixes guys.

How about Treasure Hunter scaling according to the ilevel of the weapon in your mainhand? That way we won't have to equip TH gear anymore, and devs won't have to update it whenever the ilevel gets raised again (we all know it's going to happen)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zhronne

How about Treasure Hunter scaling according to the ilevel of the weapon in your mainhand? That way we won't have to equip TH gear anymore, and devs won't have to update it whenever the ilevel gets raised again (we all know it's going to happen)

---

This is a pretty elegant solution but, it doesn't actually fix the problem unless you remove Thief's Knife which they don't seem to want to do, or make it weirdly like that hidden iLevel TH adds one less if you've got Thief's Knife in your offhand.

Or make it so that both hands count in some way (since thf has native dual wield now) formula could be something like the following:

Total iLevel of Weapons, 200 = TH+1 (Meaning any 2 iLevel weapons)
239 = TH+2 (119 + 120, so whenever they start the next phase.)
??? = TH+3 (The ??? here is 2x the max iLevel in the current phase +1)

Why not average the TH between the hands rounding down or they could lock out off of the weapon's TH with a lower level (in a kind of priority system like the debuffs).

Depending how traits are calculated my first might not be good, but im sure they can do second

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Selindrile

This is a pretty elegant solution but, it doesn't actually fix the problem unless you remove Thief's Knife which they don't seem to want to do

---

Simply make so other form of TH+ do not work if you have an ilevel weapon equipped mainhand, or just remove the TH+ from all the items that have it. They're not many, not like it would take them that long, and aside the new 109/119 reforged relic hands it's all old pieces so I doubt there would be an overload of complaints from people (especially because they would get an equal amount of +TH simply by a ilevel weapon in mainhand)

It seems the same as the macc thing, altough this should apply exclusively to THF only.
If anything, the only classes hurt by this change would be those going /THF to reach TH3 with the La'theine sash.
And again, doubt it would matter THAT much.



I mean, this is the only possible way to solve the solution completely. If they don't this, the problem will raise up again in the future. Today it's the turn of Thief's Knife and, to a lesser degree, AF3+2 feet. Tomorrow it will be the turn of Reforged Relic Hands 119, when the ilevel will be 149 and people will feel "forced" to use an ilevel 119 item.
This is a *crucial* aspect.
We do not level anymore past 99.
Our "levelup" comes from items.
If you're "forced" to equip an item lower the level of what you could equip, it would be like capping your level at 73 when the cap was 75. It's just an example, but a powerful one to convey the right concept.
They cannot possibly think to release new items, and new items, and new items, and updated ones, and new updates. They don't have the manpower to address stuff like this that affects a single job.
Just remove the problem at the root and make it scale with your average ilevel or weapon ilevel or whatever else, problem solved.

The only issue I see in this solution is, again, how do they handle the "tiers" or the "conversion rate"?
Because if they put a conversion that makes "119 = TH+4" then what's gonna happen when there will be 139 ilevel weapons? Could become TH5 or TH6 I guess, like if in the old model they had added a TH+1 legs, for instance.

And TH past that has such a minimal impact that's more a placebo than real noticeable differences, so I guess it wouldn't impact too much the game's balance in a negative way (and not like ilevel cap raise are going to happen every month anyway)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

The development team was looking into a higher-tier version of Thief’s Knife; however, they felt it would result in thieves equipping both the new knife and the original which would further limit their weapon selection. In order to solve this issue, they are currently looking into placing a cap on treasure hunter from equipment in the future.

---

This is an acceptable solution, but Camate, please pass on our suggestion for an accessory (ring, earring, etc.) with a Latent effect: Treasure hunter +x, activated by not having a Thief's knife equipped. I and many others feel that this is the best solution.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

First off, I would like to apologize for making any English speaking players feel that their requests and feedback were not answered. I can assure you that this was not the case and that threads that are unanswered are communicated to the development team. Unfortunately, sometimes we are unable to answer certain topics, and there are cases where when the team decides to answer, it is first on the Japanese side as that is their native language.

Now then, on to the actual topic at hand.

Though Karbuncle has summarized and posted a translation of what was communicated I would like to give a slightly more official response about this.

The response from Lomloon, as pointed out, contained incorrect information about the way treasure hunter works. It was mentioned in his first post that once you reach a certain level of treasure hunter, the drop rate would not be affected much even if you continue to stack more treasure hunter. This, however, is only talking about common drops, and continuing to add treasure hunter will boost the drop rate for rare items, though it will be a very slight increase.

We’ve informed the development team again about the feedback mentioning that it’s hard to let go of Thief’s Knife while playing in a party as players want to increase the treasure hunter effect to 12.

The development team was looking into a higher-tier version of Thief’s Knife; however, they felt it would result in thieves equipping both the new knife and the original which would further limit their weapon selection. In order to solve this issue, they are currently looking into placing a cap on treasure hunter from equipment in the future.

With this as well as the addition of other equipment with treasure hunter, we are aiming to make it so you can reach the equipment cap and no longer need to use Thief’s Knife. Please also know that we will not be reducing the value of treasure hunter obtainable with current equipment.

While I can’t make any promises as to when this adjustment will take place, we will be sure to keep you updated as there is progress!

---

Camate, Is it okay to ask is there any plans in the future to assist in increasing Thiefs damage output in possibly increasing SA/TA damage or reducing timers on them since the battle speed in fights now a days has increase so much more and Thiefs are not able to keep up with said abilities?

I posted that translation of the JP dev post on BlueGartr as some of you probably know (Sorry for stealing your job Camate!). When I read it I actually thought it was a great solution to the problem myself, although I guess I wouldn't mind the latent: TH when no Thief's Knife thing if it wasn't too hard to implement. I was under the impression though, that when they referenced how haste has changed in recent gear design they were basically implying that in the future, Thief gear may be largely filled with TH enough so that in most situations you can cap on gear TH without sacrificing a huge amount of stats (Assassin's Armlets and Raider's Poulaines arn't exactly good pieces themselves, and Plunderer's Armlets still pales compared to Pillager's). This would make an accessory that carries a latent boost a bit superfluous.

I have to think you could be on to something with the haste/TH comparison, But I'm going to file it next to "Pet treasure hunter" until theres more conclusive information on it. Still, as I said, Capping it is a good solution... one we came up with nearly 3 years ago... and I'm glad its making its way into the game, though I imagine its going to cause more backlash from people who don't fundamentally understand how very little they're losing, and if they're capping TH from gear, it negates the possibility of having a higher tier TH in the future, we'll be forever glued at TH6 as a base, instead of possibly TH8 or so in the future if they add more TH+ gear, or even give Raiders-Reforged +2 TH.

This is unless they raise the cap of TH gear to go along with each new addition, which seems like a lot of work.

So, Its a double edged sword adding in a cap, because it stalls the jobs only real use in the eyes of the community. It fixes the immediate problem of THF knife sucking, but as a long term solution it might not serve the better good, which is why I still think an accessory type option that completely replaces Thief Knife would instead be good.

Otherwise, again, they're stunting the growth of TH through gear if they impose a cap, solving one problem and creating another, where as an armor-based replacement solution creates no new problems.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Catmato

This is an acceptable solution, but Camate, please pass on our suggestion for an accessory (ring, earring, etc.) with a Latent effect: Treasure hunter +x, activated by not having a Thief's knife equipped. I and many others feel that this is the best solution.

---

and I double this so, pretty please.

In my humble opinion, Treasure Hunter should've just been abolished entirely and Thief have its development focus changed (The combat control/DPS idea works pretty well, part of me thinks they should've given SCH's SP2 to THF, possibly even as a 10-minute ability or something). Having a job solely dedicated to making items drop is really dumb for an MMO. It's a works fine for like, a single player game (which is basically how they were designing it in the early days, as a "Final Fantasy, Except Online" for real), but nowadays I really wouldn't mind if they just removed it entirely.

I have a thread dedicated to the idea of THF becoming a master of Enmity control, the jist of my ideas are something like.

Separating Collaborator/Accomplice timers. Reducing Accomplice to 3 minutes, and adding new abilities to fit the theme.

Blame - 1 minute timer
Puts 25% of your current enmity onto a target.

Frame - 3 Minute timer
Puts 50% of your current enmity onto a target.

Plead = 3 minute timer
remove 25% of your enmity.

Innocent - 5 minute timer
Dumps 99% of your enmity into nothingnes.

(All named in theme with the Collaborate/accomplice style of naming). This gives THF multiple options of enmity control. Take 50% of the WHMs enmity, dump it onto the PLD. Or take 25% of a DDs enmity and dump it into nothigness, so on, and so forth. This will give enmity control a real value, and THF would likely find its way welcomed into some of the "If you get hate as a DD, you die" fights, like Ark Angels. Well, at least good geared Thieves.

I think at least 1 "Give Enmity" and "Shed Enmity" Ability should be given to THF.

Personally I'd rather have stances over having more JAs. Where one stance was all about Enmity transfer and another was about enhancing evasion and others with things like counter on evaded hits.

Stance 1 (Enmity)

Reduces recast times for Collaborator and Accomplice.
Adds a 25% of Enmity transfer to Trick Attack.
Allows Hide to shed all Enmity for a slightly longer time and also work on sound aggro mobs.
Grants an additional 25% Enmity transfer to Trick Attack when used with Sneak Attack (SATA)

Stance 2 (Evasion)

Adds a chance to counter hits after evading.
Enhances Triple Attack rate and evasion for a short time after using Sneak Attack or Trick attack.
Enhances success rate of Steal abilities while under the effect of Hide.


And things like that.

Could see that working, in facts it not a bad idea.. I do recall SE wanting to not add a lot more stances to the game, but i do feel those would be interesting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

The development team was looking into a higher-tier version of Thief’s Knife; however, they felt it would result in thieves equipping both the new knife and the original which would further limit their weapon selection. In order to solve this issue, they are currently looking into placing a cap on treasure hunter from equipment in the future.

With this as well as the addition of other equipment with treasure hunter, we are aiming to make it so you can reach the equipment cap and no longer need to use Thief’s Knife. Please also know that we will not be reducing the value of treasure hunter obtainable with current equipment.

While I can’t make any promises as to when this adjustment will take place, we will be sure to keep you updated as there is progress!

---

They could also easily prevent a DW thief's knife situation by keeping it R/Ex but with an upgrade quest. so the upgraded knife still blocked using a 2nd original version

All you have to do is equip your TH set and poke any mob 1 time and your TH is on it. Afterwards put on what you want. Is it really that difficult to make a macro for these few pieces of gear, and to carry them in your 80 slot inventory. "But I lose my TP" ; ; boo hoo WS first then equip it, or if TH is more important don't. If damage is more important to you then don't use it at all. So you proc TH 1 level lower it won't hurt your drops on anything you're looking to do damage on that it's inappropriate or inconvenient for you to swap daggers for 1 swing. Please do not cap TH in gear, and continue making more pieces with it on it for those situations where we want the highest TH possible, and we're willing to change every piece of gear necessary to achieve this goal. If you don't like TH knife then don't use it. If you do like it then who cares what level it is, or how outdated it is put it on smack once and change gear for one of the newer much better daggers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilbittythang

All you have to do is equip your TH set and poke any mob 1 time and your TH is on it. Afterwards put on what you want. Is it really that difficult to make a macro for these few pieces of gear, and to carry them in your 80 slot inventory. "But I lose my TP" ; ; boo hoo WS first then equip it, or if TH is more important don't.

---

Pretty sure they said awhile ago that if you take off any TH gear your TH goes down in effectiveness on the target, even if you hit them with higher level TH

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Olor

Pretty sure they said awhile ago that if you take off any TH gear your TH goes down in effectiveness on the target, even if you hit them with higher level TH

---

Meaning your TH becomes gimped like a lesser TH or meaning you're less likely to proc a higher TH lvl? If it's the first then that's where their system is broken and should be fixed not on worrying about the crappy dagger. If it's the latter then back to my original post if it's more important for a higher quality TH than DD then put your gear on and suck it up. If you need more DD accept the lesser TH and put on DD gear.

The absolute main problem THF has right now is not TH gear, its the THFs that continuously want to make a fight as long as possible to proc TH up. Even if dev's go with this TH Gear cap solution, I can promise everyone that the new weapons of choice are going to be Twilight Knife/Merc. Kris, to purposely make NMs last as long as possible. If this is going to be implemented PLEASE make it so iLvl weapons affect the chance of procing TH. On higher difficulty fights a THF would choose a higher lvl weapon so that would be moot point, but the main reason players use THF are to farm fodder NM drops. Please tie in TH procs with ilvl!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilbittythang

Meaning your TH becomes gimped like a lesser TH or meaning you're less likely to proc a higher TH lvl? If it's the first then that's where their system is broken and should be fixed not on worrying about the crappy dagger. If it's the latter then back to my original post if it's more important for a higher quality TH than DD then put your gear on and suck it up. If you need more DD accept the lesser TH and put on DD gear.

---

Wow. What job do you play that you're afraid of THF doing a little more damage? These suggestions really don't hurt anyone. Actually, they help everyone with more damage and higher TH.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilbittythang

Meaning your TH becomes gimped like a lesser TH or meaning you're less likely to proc a higher TH lvl? If it's the first then that's where their system is broken and should be fixed not on worrying about the crappy dagger. If it's the latter then back to my original post if it's more important for a higher quality TH than DD then put your gear on and suck it up. If you need more DD accept the lesser TH and put on DD gear.

---

I agree. They should take it a step further and do this for all jobs though. Let's make it so martial arts only works if you full time brass knuckles and warcry / berzerk/ double attack only work if you equip a level 60 axe. Let's have dual wield tied to level 70 katanas.

Let's really make the game interesting for all the jobs!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Syhrie

The absolute main problem THF has right now is not TH gear, its the THFs that continuously want to make a fight as long as possible to proc TH up. Even if dev's go with this TH Gear cap solution, I can promise everyone that the new weapons of choice are going to be Twilight Knife/Merc. Kris, to purposely make NMs last as long as possible. If this is going to be implemented PLEASE make it so iLvl weapons affect the chance of procing TH. On higher difficulty fights a THF would choose a higher lvl weapon so that would be moot point, but the main reason players use THF are to farm fodder NM drops. Please tie in TH procs with ilvl!

---

Tying TH upgrade rate to your average iLv actually isn't a bad idea. Let TH gear decide the starting level and iLv the upgrade rate.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Olor

Pretty sure they said awhile ago that if you take off any TH gear your TH goes down in effectiveness on the target, even if you hit them with higher level TH

---

I thought it was like so, for example:

• Engage (and/or attack/use an ability against) a target while possessing treasure hunter level 5.
• Remove any equipment that enhances the effect, resulting into the level being 5 still, but the chance of it going higher from that will be lower.

its as you described Dragoy.

Trreasure hunter cannot be lowered on the enemy. If you hit with 7, then switch to 3, its still 7. Your chances of raising it past 7 will be based on a TH3 though.

See, the further you are from your current TH level in gear/JT, the harder it is to upgrade TH - Stupid design personally - but thems the breaks.