So there's only 5 jobs that work now?

To the OP - Don't listen to anyone who says certain jobs are no good anymore. Yes, there are huge advantages in Abyssea to certain jobs, but you don't HAVE to be one of those jobs. Play they job you like the most and make friends. Chances are, someone in your circle will have the jobs you need to get things done. In the process, you might become fond of one of those more "useful" jobs in Abyssea, and level that up too.

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Originally Posted by Leonlionheart

Tahrongi Canyon, probably the most desired Empyrean Weapon zone

Not to mention WAR is by far the best DD in the game (even outside Abyssea)

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OP, is this the problem? Cookie cutter elitists?

There are only a few mobs in the game that can only die to a war, and they all exist in solo war bcnm.

I'm just stating fact. You can argue that something is better, but you can't beat out simple math.

WAR might not have utility like MNK and NIN do, other than red procs, but there's no possible way to beat it in terms of DD (except MAYBE Ryunohige DRGs).

There's no way around this fact. It's not like I'm telling you to play WAR, just letting you know that it is indeed the best at dealing damage, and that this fact is indisputable.

In abyssea you can play whatever you want, as long as somewhere in your party you have a WAR+NIN+WHM and, depending on your goal, a MNK, or a BLU+BLM/BRD or BLU+BLM+BRD. With just those jobs you can complete any task, and get the most efficiency out of your time spent. Can SMNx3 do the same thing? Yes. It will just take significantly longer.

I believe you have told me to switch to WAR several times. I dare say, you can't shut up about the job our your weapon. Getting you to talk about another job? Not gonna happen.

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Originally Posted by Dallas

I believe you have told me to switch to WAR several times. I dare say, you can't shut up about the job our your weapon. Getting you to talk about another job? Not gonna happen.

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Quoted for massive hypocrisy.

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Originally Posted by Dallas

I believe you have told me to switch to WAR several times. I dare say, you can't shut up about the job our your weapon. Getting you to talk about another job? Not gonna happen.

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Switch to the job that fills the role you need done, don't just use the same job on everything I think is what you're trying to put into my mouth.

I.E. WAR to DD
SMN to Kite+Kill
PLD to tank Voidwatch,
etc.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Quoted for massive hypocrisy.

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That word doesn't mean what you want it to.

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Originally Posted by Dallas

I dare say, you can't shut up about the job or your weapon.

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Best. Joke. Ever.

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Originally Posted by Dallas

That word doesn't mean what you want it to.

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He means that you can't shut up about SMN or Hvergelmir either.

I understand, I like my emp.

but I switch to WHM when we need heals, or BLM when we need stun/nukes/yellow, or MNK when we need tank/blue.

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Originally Posted by Leonlionheart

Switch to the job that fills the role you need done, don't just use the same job on everything I think is what you're trying to put into my mouth.

I.E. WAR to DD
SMN to Kite+Kill
PLD to tank Voidwatch,
etc.

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Except that WAR is not needed to DD. WAR is what you prance around on in forums. Prance for us!

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Originally Posted by Dallas

Except that WAR is not needed to DD. WAR is what you prance around on in forums. Prance for us!

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:\ well in that case nothing is NEEDED to DD is it?

WAR, on the other hand, is needed for the lowest-manned red procs.

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Originally Posted by Leonlionheart

He means that you can't shut up about SMN or Hvergelmir either.

I understand, I like my emp.

but I switch to WHM when we need heals, or BLM when we need stun/nukes/yellow, or MNK when we need tank/blue.

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When you were a kid, you only chewed on the red, yellow, and blue crayons, huh?

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Originally Posted by Leonlionheart

:\ well in that case nothing is NEEDED to DD is it?

WAR, on the other hand, is needed for the lowest-manned red procs.

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Because "lowest-manned" is a need, not a sign of a lack of friends.

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Originally Posted by Dallas

Because "lowest-manned" is a need, not a sign of a lack of friends.

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You can take in 10 people to do the job of 5, if you really wanted to.

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Originally Posted by Karinya_of_Carbuncle

PLD and COR would like a word with you. Being useful for one thing is much better than being useful for zero things, because people will sometimes still let you get drops when you're only there for one thing.

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It isn't that PLD is bad, it is that WAR is better. People need to notice the small details like this. It isn't like PLD has a global blood pact timer or something holding them back, it is that they don't wield a Great Axe empyrean. Same with COR, it is a great job, but if you are going to get a support you might as well take a BRD since it is better.

Which is kind of why this topic exists. You only need the 3-5 best jobs, all other jobs could be removed because nobody likes "inefficient" jobs that aren't best.

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Originally Posted by Malamasala

It isn't that PLD is bad, it is that WAR is better. People need to notice the small details like this. It isn't like PLD has a global blood pact timer or something holding them back, it is that they don't wield a Great Axe empyrean. Same with COR, it is a great job, but if you are going to get a support you might as well take a BRD since it is better.

Which is kind of why this topic exists. You only need the 3-5 best jobs, all other jobs could be removed because nobody likes "inefficient" jobs that aren't best.

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while I agree with the post in general, it's not necessarily Ukon that makes WAR great, but rather the incredibly high attack. Berserk is the most potent attack-related ability (you could argue that Impetus is better considering it's other effects) and it's really what makes WAR shine. Also having high innate DA, Crit DMG bonus, easy accuracy, and Blood Rage doesn't hurt the job either.

I dont think a WAR is going to out tank a PLD on VM NMs so comparing them from a DD standpoint makes no sense.

Also, COR brings different thigns to the table than BRD does atm. Regain roll is more hopeful for VW than marches. (though brd is still great for the tank party)

Well, I haven't done any voidwatch because nobody wants to do voidwatch on my server because it has negligible rewards compared to abyssea. It certainly does seem possible that some of the worst balance problems right now are abyssea-specific (e.g. BLM having a truckload of proc spells and RDM and SCH having literally no job-specific ones), so non-abyssea content could have uses for more jobs that are unwanted in abyssea parties (especially the nm hunting that seems to take up 90% of most players' time right now).

Empy-specific balance problems, on the other hand, are likely to spill over into the post-90 content no matter what it is, unless SE makes empyreal WS only usable in abyssea, which would piss off a lot of people so they're very unlikely to do it. (Even without the WS, the weapons would still be strong, but a lot less game-breaking.)

Also, I partly agree with Leon about WAR -- it's a strong job even with an ordinary weapon -- but it wouldn't have the game-dominating status it does without the proc system. The difference between WAR and another DD in damage terms is just not that large or significant; the difference between WAR and another DD in proc availability terms is enormous.