Gratification to Matsui

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Originally Posted by OmnysValefor

You did, when you said you talked about your WK experience.

And that wasn't an attack on you, you just honestly seem to have less experience with the recent content than a lot of the people you're vehemently arguing with.

I've only played XI since 2007, with 2 breaks totally about 2 years. If you wanna talk about old endgame and old mechanics, I can't even begin to fairly represent anything. What I'm talking about is what your OP is praising: current content. And, currently, all they seem to want us to be doing is delve and skirmish, no matter the objections.

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Praising for the work they did in the past 2 updates. Which 2 months ago I was disappointed just as everyone else. But through the last 2 updates shows improvement and how can anyone deny that is what I'm wondering??

Had there been no updates, no improvements I could be on the hate wagon too.

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Originally Posted by Daemon

Actually he did.


I've only taken 2 weeks off. But I guess 2 weeks is a lot of experience to miss out on.

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Ha. You know, I probably said it too now that I think about it. He did say recent experience though, so whether you've been playing from day one really isn't relevant.

How much of Adoulin have you experienced? I feel like you'd tried a couple of Wildskeeper reives, done some Skirmish, and farmed some Delve. Have you tried to farm a JSE cape for yourself? Have you beaten any of the Delve mega bosses? I know you haven't done enough Wildskeeper to be completely frustrated with it yet. Have you kept up on your imprimaturs or done the GEO/RUN AF?

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Originally Posted by detlef

Ha. You know, I probably said it too now that I think about it. He did say recent experience though, so whether you've been playing from day one really isn't relevant.

How much of Adoulin have you experienced? I feel like you'd tried a couple of Wildskeeper reives, done some Skirmish, and farmed some Delve. Have you tried to farm a JSE cape for yourself? Have you beaten any of the Delve mega bosses? I know you haven't done enough Wildskeeper to be completely frustrated with it yet. Have you kept up on your imprimaturs or done the GEO/RUN AF?

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I've attempted Tojil, fought all other bosses. I've helped several do Taxet and other bosses to help others get Ki although I already have it. I've started Geo AF and read many comments how NM sucks. I don't have inventory space to hunt JSE capes right now. Yes I've done Hurkaan, seen others shouting in town how Yumcax HP dropped 4% in less than 3 minutes.

Point is in 11 years, adding new content is the same thing. Yeah they add a new boss, new conditions. Sure they added a new quest, but technically they all come to the same conclusion, conditions, difficulty, time, reward for completing the objective.

Which doesn't take higher education to know that.

New expansion comes with new bugs and eventually after SE lays down the base, then they always work on top of that making adjustments. I've seen it more times enough to know that waiting for them to work out the kinks before I complain will only save unnecessary headaches.

Complaints, and feedback are 2 different things.

How many times did they shift the people from 1 area to another? Or make adjustments to jobs to get people to play them until they nerf it? These don't look like mistakes to me. I see them as smart thinking.

Lets release scholar. Not many people play the job ok let's give embrava and Kaustra. After people hop on to it, we'll nerf it.

Details I see every time. Lets make RDM popular. Ok too many people play the job, lets nerf it. Ok now with new expansion we will bring these jobs back into the light.

The same conclusion every time. New content, lets make this area popular and give people a reason to play it. Lets make this quest in hopes to stall them 2 months while we work on the next project. Lets add this to give them a feeling of hope. Lets nerf this to take attention away from it.

Video game creation is all about adding and taking away. Shifting people to do one thing to another.

It makes it very difficult to reply to you when you keep editing your posts. Please try to get all your ideas in there before you hit post.

To be more sophisticated in my explanation? WR require bald, Ki to purchase. Drop rate effects of how many items need to be in circulation. X amount of people play under these conditions. Casuals, undergeared will play the event X amount of hours vs Well geared players taking down boss in X amount of hours.

Conditions alter based on time of peak hour, X amount of players, type of player.

Time factor of obstacles. Reives in the way, farming Bayld. Overview of X amount of days, weeks months this event will last.

Conditions met when X amount of people have these gears Vs power of items will have effect on the overall ease of the current content.

I'm saying try to get it all in the first time before you hit post. It's no fun writing a response and then seeing that the original post to which I am responding has changed.

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Originally Posted by detlef

I'm saying try to get it all in the first time before you hit post. It's no fun writing a response and then seeing that the original post to which I am responding has changed.

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Well you have to give me a few minutes. Small screen on a cellphone.

No matter how many people build a rollercoaster. Technically all of them will be a rollercoaster. Just different lengths, swirls, turns, and design.

But still its a rollercoaster...

A boss will be a boss
A quest will be a quest

Just different obstacles, conditions, length of time, difficulty, reward upon completion.

See I can relate to video game programming because as a Remix producer. We lay down beats and bass down first. We go through different sounds and listen to thousands of instruments, FX.

These take time because sound is very complicated. Sometimes you get Ear Fatique where your ears will adjust to a sound over time so if you are listening to a bad sound, after awhile your ears will trick you into believing its a good sound. Therefore we constantly take breaks in between.

Add in melodies only to come back later and think the melody sucks. But we are constantly overlaying sounds, adjusting, tweaking, eqing, adding and taking things out of the arrangement.

Which is how I see DEV Team programming code. And doing projects. That's why I gave thanks for the last 2 updates. I know its not easy.

My work is visual and audio.

Their work is that on top of math, physics, algorithms, mechanics, etc.

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Originally Posted by Daemon

No matter how many people build a rollercoaster. Technically all of them will be a rollercoaster. Just different lengths, swirls, turns, and design.

But still its a rollercoaster...

A boss will be a boss
A quest will be a quest

Just different obstacles, conditions, length of time, difficulty, reward upon completion.

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I was wondering what you meant by your past roller coaster comment, and now I understand.

My analogy was in Six Flags taking all their other rides away. No matter much fun R/Cs might be, the Giant drop and the things that mess with gravity, as well as the the things that spin you around and around on a giant pendulum... they're quite fun.

I can relate to video game programming too. I have experience in large scale programming and understand the coordination and understand how quality projects usually rely on multiple people.

That being said, people still give them too much leeway, always using the same excuses and some of the glitches that arise are just... baffling. Other glitches that they offer no concern twards, like the near-untargetable-ness of reive targets.. Personally, if it were an application I were working on, such a widespread bug would never fly.

Ever.

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Originally Posted by OmnysValefor

I was wondering what you meant by your past roller coaster comment, and now I understand.

My analogy was in Six Flags taking all their other rides away. No matter much fun R/Cs might be, the Giant drop and the things that mess with gravity, as well as the the things that spin you around and around on a giant pendulum... they're quite fun.

I can relate to video game programming too. I have experience in large scale programming and understand the coordination and understand how quality projects usually rely on multiple people.

That being said, people still give them too much leeway, always using the same excuses and some of the glitches that arise are just... baffling. Other glitches that they offer no concern twards, like the near-untargetable-ness of reive targets.. Personally, if it were an application I were working on, such a widespread bug would never fly.

Ever.

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True but I'm sure if they had a bigger team, things would be much better. I just don't see them putting out more than they are doing right now.

Updates now before the recent ones shows better improvements from how I see it.

I just think they did enough work in 2 months. That's why I keep saying DEVs are not robots.

They cannot alter something without seeing the results of what they implemented first. That's why I think it takes time.

Also they probably have other unreleased projects in the works behind the scene. Stuff we don't see but find out later like Skirmish. Which also shows they are constantly working. We just don't see it.

So that's why I can't make complaints like REM because that would be poking at someone who most likely has plans but cannot give anyone a definite word on it yet as it could cause conflicts if they need to change something later.

It's not about keeping us in the dark. But community reps can't rush Devs to tell them information on projects that are not done.

I'm also sure he will keep his word on REM upgrades. I mean almost 100,000 fans on the English site alone complained. He did say don't throw away REM and that he understands how much time people spent on these.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...nd-WoE-Weapons

To not carry out his word would only be a major disaster. It would only be common sense to follow through on this promise.

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Originally Posted by OmnysValefor

I'm glad you know me and no that I have no interest in several VW fights, nor Odin II, nor old salvage, and new.

Oh wait, I do.

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I didn't know you want to do all that old content like assaults, dynamis, city mission, old and new salvage, sky, sea, etc... If you do, then why go and announce that it's all dead to people? It makes you sound like you think it's dead and that it should stay dead. Pessimism brings negative thoughts, and those negative thoughts fester until you say something like "All the old stuff is dead so don't bother doing it."

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Originally Posted by Bamph

I didn't know you want to do all that old content like assaults, dynamis, city mission, old and new salvage, sky, sea, etc... If you do, then why go and announce that it's all dead to people? It makes you sound like you think it's dead and that it should stay dead. Pessimism brings negative thoughts, and those negative thoughts fester until you say something like "All the old stuff is dead so don't bother doing it."

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Yeah I misunderstood too. I want both of you to know that a good portion of my ideas relate to old content. And how SE could give us interest to go back and do them.

Voidwatch and WR
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...E-Point-System

AF quests Limbus/Dyna/Abyssea
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/36059-AF4

Sky/Ein/PW/VW
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...ation-Exchange

I try to think of ideas that a good portion of the community can benefit from it.

Other comments I've made throughout other threads like allowing us to have restrictions removed off Nyzul, NNI, Salvage but doesn't look like that will become a reality.

Then there's the 2 guides I wrote with the intention of helping people.

Beginners Guide
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...eginners-Guide

Guide for Returning players
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...egy-Guide-FFXI

So I do care. Just I try to look at all perspectives that can help everyone including new players just starting. But also from the POV of the Devs and the obstacles they face.

So yeah that's why I can be stubborn. Looking at things from all perspectives and not just a certain side.

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Originally Posted by Daemon

Yeah I misunderstood too. I want both of you to know that a good portion of my ideas relate to old content. And how SE could give us interest to go back and do them.

Voidwatch and WR
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...E-Point-System

AF quests Limbus/Dyna/Abyssea
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/36059-AF4

Sky/Ein/PW/VW
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...ation-Exchange

I try to think of ideas that a good portion of the community can benefit from it.

Other comments I've made throughout other threads like allowing us to have restrictions removed off Nyzul, NNI, Salvage but doesn't look like that will become a reality.

Then there's the 2 guides I wrote with the intention of helping people.

Beginners Guide
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...eginners-Guide

Guide for Returning players
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...egy-Guide-FFXI

So I do care. Just I try to look at perspectives that can help everyone including new players just starting. But also from the POV of the Devs and the obstacles they face.

So yeah that's why I can be stubborn. Looking at things from all perspectives and not just a certain side.

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I'm totally down with all the stuff... There was so much stuff to do when I first started a couple years ago, and the jobs I love to play (BLM and RNG) get 0 love whatsoever from the playerbase... It was all about trying to get quests and missions done. I play with my wife, but there was only so much we could do with only the 2 of us. Now that the level has been increased, and with all the Adoulin Gear, I'm finally able to get out and enjoy this game for the storyline. I don't want to be able to solo everything, but at least with the main storylines, I figured any well-balanced group of any jobs should be able to go through it and get it done.

I'm finding that SE is putting in little hints to go back to old content, like popsets in flotsam. I also know how much pressure they're under because of both games working at the same time. I hope that they can keep both of them afloat...

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Originally Posted by OmnysValefor

I was wondering what you meant by your past roller coaster comment, and now I understand.

My analogy was in Six Flags taking all their other rides away. No matter much fun R/Cs might be, the Giant drop and the things that mess with gravity, as well as the the things that spin you around and around on a giant pendulum... they're quite fun.

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As for this I understand and all I was saying is that not all rollcoasters have the same conditions, but technically it is a rollercoaster.

I just appreciate no more waiting 1 entire week real time staring at sand all day. Drinking coffee and redbull, popping caffeine pills and asking a friend to take turns watching to see if HMN popped lol.

No more 6 months to over a year questing and doing missions to obtain powerful weapons. Thank Delve for that.

No more rage quit anger over greedy HNMLS fighting over who gets the drops from HNM.
Thanks to Wildkeeper Reives, I don't have to get cheated, lied to for wasting 1 week killing myself watching for spawn only to have it stolen, tricked of getting to play the event by rude, elitist only to say "Sorry we lied, now go run off and cry"

And how Japan could see spawn before us so it popped already claimed before sprite appeared.

That's why I can't complain about the new direction. I'm glad.

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Originally Posted by Bamph

I'm totally down with all the stuff... There was so much stuff to do when I first started a couple years ago, and the jobs I love to play (BLM and RNG) get 0 love whatsoever from the playerbase... It was all about trying to get quests and missions done. I play with my wife, but there was only so much we could do with only the 2 of us. Now that the level has been increased, and with all the Adoulin Gear, I'm finally able to get out and enjoy this game for the storyline. I don't want to be able to solo everything, but at least with the main storylines, I figured any well-balanced group of any jobs should be able to go through it and get it done.

I'm finding that SE is putting in little hints to go back to old content, like popsets in flotsam. I also know how much pressure they're under because of both games working at the same time. I hope that they can keep both of them afloat...

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Yeah I'm seeing a lot of good improvements. I love that they added DD stats to Mage Bayld gears :) STR!!!

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Originally Posted by detlef

I'm saying try to get it all in the first time before you hit post. It's no fun writing a response and then seeing that the original post to which I am responding has changed.

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I've pointed this exact thing out to him multiple times. In his mind making changes and adding points to a post 15+ minutes later isn't a big deal. I've even gone so far as to explain how to edit a post properly so he doesn't come off looking like a revisionist but he has chosen to ignore that.

Daemon - Stop posting from work when you don't have the time to fully respond and wait until you do. The OF won't melt down if you don't post 10+ times a day (not including your extensive edits).

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Originally Posted by Slaxx

I've pointed this exact thing out to him multiple times. In his mind making changes and adding points to a post 15+ minutes later isn't a big deal. I've even gone so far as to explain how to edit a post properly so he doesn't come off looking like a revisionist but he has chosen to ignore that.

Daemon - Stop posting from work when you don't have the time to fully respond and wait until you do. The OF won't melt down if you don't post 10+ times a day (not including your extensive edits).

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Uh if you know I edit my post and I already said this over and over then you'd know by now I never turn around and change my words to make me look right. I just add on than start a new reply. The only thing I do change is if I misspelled or used broken English or if spell correcting from iPhone placed a word that was incorrect.

If he said he was in the middle of writing something but saw that I added on to my post. Then that should tell you that I never go back and change my words to make it look like something was said and they are wrong. Obviously he never posted anything for me to go back and change something I said.

It's just I type from a cellphone and because I can't preview what I wrote without posting first I have no choice.

Then there is spacing paragraphs so it doesn't look like 1 huge chunk of words. And if I post first and edit, I have to add it fast before someone else posts a reply or else my entire response will come out different.

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Originally Posted by Daemon

Uh if you know I edit my post and I already said this over and over then you'd know by now I never turn around and change my words to make me look right. I just add on than start a new reply. The only thing I do change is if I misspelled or used broken English or if spell correcting from iPhone placed a word that was incorrect.

If he said he was in the middle of writing something but saw that I added on to my post. Then that should tell you that I never go back and change my words to make it look like something was said and they are wrong. Obviously he never posted anything for me to go back and change something I said.

It's just I type from a cellphone and because I can't preview what I wrote without posting first I have no choice.

Then there is spacing paragraphs so it doesn't look like 1 huge chunk of words. And if I post first and edit, I have to add it fast before someone else posts a reply or else my entire response will come out different.

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This is all easy to say, but here's the thing - you do add points to your posts and those additions do alter the points you are trying to make and how you make them.

My basic point still stands. Stop posting if you can't put your thoughts out in a coherent manner regularly. There's no reason to be constantly posting from you phone. Whatever you have to say can wait. The OF will not disappear without your contribution.

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Originally Posted by Slaxx

This is all easy to say, but here's the thing - you do add points to your posts and those additions do alter the points you are trying to make and how you make them.

My basic point still stands. Stop posting if you can't put your thoughts out in a coherent manner regularly. There's no reason to be constantly posting from you phone. Whatever you have to say can wait. The OF will not disappear without your contribution.

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Adding points to my response doesn't alter what I'm saying. It's just adding on to what my overall point was about.

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Originally Posted by Daemon

Adding points to my response doesn't alter what I'm saying. It's just adding on to what my overall point was about.

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Except it does, but you'll never understand that so I'm wasting my time on this point. You will notice, however, that I'm not the only person to point this out to you and express irritation over it.

And none of this (again) addresses my basic point. Whatever you have to say can wait. Your contribution isn't so important that it absolutely must be made before you can get to a place where you have the time and hardware to post a single, coherent reply, without having to edit yourself in nearly every post you make.

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Originally Posted by Slaxx

Except it does, but you'll never understand that so I'm wasting my time on this point. You will notice, however, that I'm not the only person to point this out to you and express irritation over it.

And none of this (again) addresses my basic point. Whatever you have to say can wait. Your contribution isn't so important that it absolutely must be made before you can get to a place where you have the time and hardware to post a single, coherent reply, without having to edit yourself in nearly every post you make.

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Well I'm sorry you take it that way but that's never my intention to begin with and assuming I do rub off as you say, I'm sure you have seen me post enough times to know how I post my responses. Not like I've been on the forums 1 day.

Way off topic, gents. :)

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Originally Posted by Daemon

Well I'm sorry you take it that way but that's never my intention to begin with and assuming I do rub off as you say, I'm sure you have seen me post enough times to know how I post my responses. Not like I've been on the forums 1 day.

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Just because you always do something one way doesn't make it right. There's a word for someone who does something wrong over and over again while ignoring the people telling them they are doing something wrong (well several words depending on context).

Again ignoring my basic point, but again that's par for the course.

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Originally Posted by Slaxx

Just because you always do something one way doesn't make it right. There's a word for someone who does something wrong over and over again while ignoring the people telling them they are doing something wrong (well several words depending on context).

Again ignoring my basic point, but again that's par for the course.

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Uh your logic does not make sense. People edit all the time. Maybe not the way you want everyone to. But I'd rather post a quick reply to let the person know I'm paying attention to them than make them wait 20-40 minutes to respond back especially when conversing with several people at the moment.

I'm merely trying to avoid this.

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Also, there are cases it might feel this way when you don't receive an answer to certain things you were expecting and the subject continues to shift.

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How does praising devs counter that "you might feel like we're not responding to you"?

Just to end this discussion on editing posts: The ability to edit your post is so you can make editorial changes and/or correct ambiguities. Adding major revisions 5 or 10 minutes later with major additions is discourteous.

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Originally Posted by detlef

Just to end this discussion on editing posts: The ability to edit your post is so you can make editorial changes and/or correct ambiguities. Adding major revisions 5 or 10 minutes later with major additions is discourteous.

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I dont make revisions. I add things on to my post that I didn't finish what I said. Because I respond to a person at the very moment. First post does not allow "Preview option" until I post something first. Then I have to build on top of it.

I've even had to cut what I was writing under edit mode after seeing someone post a reply only for me to respond faster creating a new response under the person who replied.

Meaning if you posted before I finished I'd cut and paste under to keep editing what the 1st reply was splitting the original reply into 2 separate comments.

When speaking with more than 2 other people at the same time it was done to quickly reply to everyone before the subject shifted.

Yes there were times I spent 30 minutes only for the subject to evolve into something else therefore It was more convenient for me to respond the way I do now.

This also prevents splitting 1 post into 5-10 replies for 1 response. Which I find unnecessary and wasting forum space.

Try typing on a 4 inch smartphone then you'll see what I mean.

I'm curious if the FFXIV team and FFXI team ever get together and discuss design.

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Originally Posted by Rekin

I'm curious if the FFXIV team and FFXI team ever get together and discuss design.

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How do you think the ideas for Cait Sith and Pet:Treasure Hunter gear was so quickly implemented! Oh wait... :(

Is this even about expressiing gratitude to Mr. Matsui anymore?

No, its not, if I am correct at one point it went from being out being grateful to him, to why he does not deserve gratitude.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

No, its not, if I am correct at one point it went from being out being grateful to him, to why he does not deserve gratitude.

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saw little bit about forum ettiqute on the end there too lol...

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Originally Posted by Umichi

saw little bit about forum ettiqute on the end there too lol...

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Well Umichi it's the truth as to why Matsui doesn't deserve it: He does not listen to NA or EU, in fact let's just add in the rest of the globe because the only players he listens to are his JP players. He does not care about what we think, he only accepts ideas from the Japanese, which typically are things we don't typically agree on because their way of thinking is different than ours simply because of culture. Because of this, NA/EU/SA will butt heads with JP BECAUSE OF THIS. Matsui works hard there is no doubt about that, and yes some of the things he's done has been good, but he needs to step up his game or else he's going to be remembered as a horrible developer to FFXI's history.

Truth be told, he's got things to fix, and he needs to stop focusing on the new content to fix these issues. In short: Stop trying to pacify the playerbase, stop being lazy, and get s--t done. If I was his supervisor and I saw this kind of conduct being done, I would personally get on his case because that's not how one conducts themselves, idc what the terms of service says about us only having the right to quit, we also have the right to be talked to like the JP players and know wtf is going on with a game we're shelling out a monthly fee for, and find out why they are putting the more important/crucial things on backburner while they try to woo us with these items with absurd stats, why they won't increase lvl cap but they have no problem adding 'item levels' which is a stupid concept altogether, we really don't care what the lvl is on the item, it's for lvl 99 and that's all one needs to know.

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Originally Posted by Anjou

Well Umichi it's the truth as to why Matsui doesn't deserve it: He does not listen to NA or EU, in fact let's just add in the rest of the globe because the only players he listens to are his JP players. He does not care about what we think, he only accepts ideas from the Japanese, which typically are things we don't typically agree on because their way of thinking is different than ours simply because of culture. Because of this, NA/EU/SA will butt heads with JP BECAUSE OF THIS. Matsui works hard there is no doubt about that, and yes some of the things he's done has been good, but he needs to step up his game or else he's going to be remembered as a horrible developer to FFXI's history.

Truth be told, he's got things to fix, and he needs to stop focusing on the new content to fix these issues. In short: Stop trying to pacify the playerbase, stop being lazy, and get s--t done. If I was his supervisor and I saw this kind of conduct being done, I would personally get on his case because that's not how one conducts themselves, idc what the terms of service says about us only having the right to quit, we also have the right to be talked to like the JP players and know wtf is going on with a game we're shelling out a monthly fee for, and find out why they are putting the more important/crucial things on backburner while they try to woo us with these items with absurd stats, why they won't increase lvl cap but they have no problem adding 'item levels' which is a stupid concept altogether, we really don't care what the lvl is on the item, it's for lvl 99 and that's all one needs to know.

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Lol an advance discussion was made here that might change your point of view. Too much to repost here but read that first before you guys decide whether or not Matsui deserves gratification.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...to-obtain-gear

Daemon I know that he's doing a good job concerning the new content, but what I'm saying is that if he wants to -really- deserve gratification, he'll bring up old promises and finish up what the devs started concerning job fixes and adding things like Cait Sith to the list of summons. For god's sakes, summoner hasn't had anything new in terms of magic save for Odin/Alex but you only get them once an hour (More if you are in an area that has revitalizers). I think if he wants to please at least some of the community, he could start there and make it look like he cares about getting the game in a better state and work on the jobs that need fixing *Cough*Blue Mage*Cough*