67 Gil Chocobo Blinkers seriously?

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Originally Posted by StingRay104

In the past Final Fantasy games, a player would get decent amount of gil based on the level of the monster or monsters they defeated. When is the last time anyone got gil from a monster? All the new stuff gives cruor. All the old stuff gives at most 30 gil a kill except nms. Where is the balance of actually getting decent rewards from difficult monsters. 1/500 chance to get the item you desire? This is wrong.

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Those games don't involve social aspects. You either farmed crafted or made everything on those games yourself. There was no player vs player trade. In those games the money you made was the economy. In an MMO the money each player makes becomes the economy.

If transactions are mostly between other players that means money lingers in the system. If things where different and more money sinks existed then that wouldn't be a concern. Unfortunately, every thing that's good in this game is either farmed, or crafted by other players.

AS of now players buy mules to hold gear. What if players could buy as much space as they wanted if they rented it each upgrade costing more every time more items where added? What if mog mail cost money for deliveries. What if some HIGH end armors constantly needed recharged.

This isn't a rocket science. Yes the system is broken but money growing on tress is only a good idea if there are equivalent money pits that are CONSUMING it in equal amounts. I'm sorry but trading with outer players isn't consuming money it's just moving it around.

Hey SE, make some new awesome food.
Make it so that we have to buy expensive ingredients to make this food.
Make the foods require 110 Cooking, and have an HQ version that we can't Tier 1.

If we got some new DD food, mage food, etc and it was costly to make, it would be an easy gilsink.
FOR EXAMPLE, if it was the best DD food, cost 100k to make, it would be 100k taken from the players, towards an item that will be consumed. At the same time, giving Cooking a bit more usefulness as a craft. [There's not a WHOLE LOT of profit when you compare to other crafts.]

Well you can't expect the guys at SE to do anything useful like ban the RMT people. then they would not get subscription fees. Instead SE was kind enough to screw over the entire playerbase so they could keep their precious subscription fees from the people that do RMT.

Not like this will get rid of gilsellers SE, they'll just find something new.

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Originally Posted by tyrantsyn

I did this once or twice, found it super annoying and went back to farming the regular stuff. From what it sounds like to me some of you became way too reliant on it. And the fact that some of you guys seem outrage about the nerf is just bewildering to me.

Cruor has become a staple in the game at this point. I'm sure their be using it again for something else before you know it.

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Outside letting people buy Voidwatch stones with it, they aren't going to do anything will the millions of curor out there. This is just a screw you to the player base, and a slight inconvenience for the RMT. It's a stupid measure because it won't in any way stop RMT sellers.

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Originally Posted by tyrantsyn

I did this once or twice, found it super annoying and went back to farming the regular stuff. From what it sounds like to me some of you became way too reliant on it. And the fact that some of you guys seem outrage about the nerf is just bewildering to me.

Cruor has become a staple in the game at this point. I'm sure their be using it again for something else before you know it.

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Pretty much this in a nutshell. I have many other legitimate ways of making cash so this was sort of a lol for me when I'd heard about it.

Let's just all rage quit for stuff getting nerfed. I remember way back in the day when they nerfed ranger and made alot of people mad. This also nerfed holy waters, think there was something with a smithing cap that rmt use to fish up and make a ton of gill on. There is so much stuff they have nerfed in this game and people complain. Stop being lazy and find other ways to make gill not that hard. It doesn't matter if player base or rmt are doing it, either way prices are gonna be high cause some dumbass is willing to pay for a over priced piece of gear. There are so many new players in this game with gear they don't even know how to use. They don't even know how to play the job correctly, it's just sad that you can burn any job and just plain suck at it. If you know you got new people in your shell teach the correct way to playing the game teach them the basics.

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Originally Posted by Kosneffect

Let's just all rage quit for stuff getting nerfed. I remember way back in the day when they nerfed ranger and made alot of people mad. This also nerfed holy waters, think there was something with a smithing cap that rmt use to fish up and make a ton of gill on. There is so much stuff they have nerfed in this game and people complain. Stop being lazy and find other ways to make gill not that hard. It doesn't matter if player base or rmt are doing it, either way prices are gonna be high cause some dumbass is willing to pay for a over priced piece of gear. There are so many new players in this game with gear they don't even know how to use. They don't even know how to play the job correctly, it's just sad that you can burn any job and just plain suck at it. If you know you got new people in your shell teach the correct way to playing the game teach them the basics.

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Granted there are tons of ways to make money but the sole fact remains that repeatedly SE punishes the non tos breakers at the same time as the tos breakers, thats becoming bullshit.

The gil fountain was retarded. This should have been nerfed a long time ago as it's led to inflation. The amount of gil being created was not even close to proportionate to the gil outgoing.

Every time someone in game purchases an item from a npc (Corsair Die, Select puppet attachments, scholar storm/helix spells come to mind...) money is removed from the game environment. If npc selling is entirely removed from the game, gil will continue to cycle around between players, slowly being removed from the system. Additionally the auction house charges list fees for items. Statistically if such an event were to occur where money couldnt be earned from missions/quests, npcing, or monster kills, the gil pool would dry to such a point where even using the Mhaura/Valkurm ships for 100G each would be considered a massive luxury and waste of money. In short, the gil in game has to come from somewhere, and as most sources via quest/mission are not repeatable, this would cause a market collapse in due tome, killing jobs whom depend on npc only offered items to function propperly. While i cant be sure removing blinker npcing from the game is good or bad, i can say that people are less likely to lower their prices initally, and sales will grind to a hault before a mass economic price crash.

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Originally Posted by Winrie

Granted there are tons of ways to make money but the sole fact remains that repeatedly SE punishes the non tos breakers at the same time as the tos breakers, thats becoming bullshit.

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Couldn't agree more.

Sound like you can still make a profit, just not as much of one.

Worst thing is that SE did it with no warning. Like it or not this was a part of the game economy, and if SE wanted to change it, they should have given notice. Let people get the last out of it who want it. This wasn't a glitch, this wasn't against TOS, and it's been in the game for years, it was not something that needed to be fixed without warning. It would not have "hurt" the game economy anymore than it has for the past year, and you would not have pissed off the playerbase.

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Originally Posted by Logandor

To wrap this up I am mainly getting at is now the next "fix" will probably be on dark rings and dyna currency.

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hakuryu imo

I used blinkers once for about 3 million when I was needing some cash bad, but I didn't rely on it. I'm more worried about Dynamis now becoming a shitfest and overcrowded with people trying to farm gil, and I wouldn't be surprised when RMT also join in.

Still doesn't negate the fact that reasonable rewards need to be a part of the game. An economy cannot exist without the means for people to make money. That is the point of my argument, crafting is basically dead, rare items are either cannot be traded or so rare it is not a reasonable means for profit. Cruor can be used for many things, and for awhile it was a way for people to get gil. In WoW you got reasonable amounts of gold for quests and from monster kills, and they were the king of MMO's (might still be idk haven't cared). In japanese culture they believe in learning from others and using that knowledge to better themselves. So why aren't they learning from a more successful game. Sure that game was boring as hell but I'd give anything for their customer service, crafting system, and the system for gaining money. All in all this update hurts SE's stance more than it helps, because when it comes to RMT people won't risk it if there is a reasonable other means to gain their gil. Now that method is gone and RMT will make a killing, and right before christmas too. Fine SE you wanna make money and kill off RMT then pay attention..........SELL THE GIL YOURSELF!!!!!!!!!!! Why would people buy from rmt if they would get banned, especially if they could buy it directly from you. Some players might find this ridiculous, but SE did sell R/M/E to Japan at the anniversary event.

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Originally Posted by StingRay104

Still doesn't negate the fact that reasonable rewards need to be a part of the game. An economy cannot exist without the means for people to make money. That is the point of my argument, crafting is basically dead, rare items are either cannot be traded or so rare it is not a reasonable means for profit. Cruor can be used for many things, and for awhile it was a way for people to get gil. In WoW you got reasonable amounts of gold for quests and from monster kills, and they were the king of MMO's (might still be idk haven't cared). In japanese culture they believe in learning from others and using that knowledge to better themselves. So why aren't they learning from a more successful game. Sure that game was boring as hell but I'd give anything for their customer service, crafting system, and the system for gaining money. All in all this update hurts SE's stance more than it helps, because when it comes to RMT people won't risk it if there is a reasonable other means to gain their gil. Now that method is gone and RMT will make a killing, and right before christmas too. Fine SE you wanna make money and kill off RMT then pay attention..........SELL THE GIL YOURSELF!!!!!!!!!!! Why would people buy from rmt if they would get banned, especially if they could buy it directly from you. Some players might find this ridiculous, but SE did sell R/M/E to Japan at the anniversary event.

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I hope you're talking tome because that WALL OFF TEXT was hard as hell to read. PLEASE paragraph your post. Same with you Winrie.

The FF11 is an MMO if money floods the economy and grows on trees then people will blow it faster. It's all fine if you have features to control the growth. Doesn't other MMOs have armor damage cost or something. Back when I played the realm we used mana crystals. These cost money to cast every spell. Armor cost money to repair tools cost money to repair. Honestly I don't like that reality.

Unless there is something to consume the amount of gil coming in it will eventually cause inflation. The system could've been more balenced. EVERYONE would like EMPY 95+ weapons why not sell (augmented) heavy metal plates with crur instead or something. Say 10-50k each? This way if they're going into the economy players buying them they at least aren't selling them to NPCs. 18 billion a week is hurting the economy.

I do think though they should've taken out the RMT and left some leeway for the users. Like Limited purchases per game week.

The best decision SE made in a while, but being SE it was probably company policy to do it two years too late. Economy on Leviathan is fucked and everything is horribly inflated, and it was not RMT who did it, but legit players, because cruor was the easiest way to make gil for new players who just got their first taste of Abyssea, as well as for people who just wanna be rich for the sake of being rich. By selling cruor they didn't get money from player transaction, but instead pumped new money into the economy. As a result, we have several people with capped gil, overbidding on everything and generally paying whatever they feel like, meaning they inflate prices over anything regular players can compete with, just because they've been getting 60M daily for months now.

Cruor farming was retardedly broken and absolutely had to be cut down, this was the only rational choice SE could have made at all. It doesn't mean some damage hasn't already been done (and won't be reverted anytime soon), but it was the only way to prevent it from getting worse. All these "VW for cruor" arguments are useless, because no matter what you make there you can't possibly compete with the rate the prices get inflated because of how other people are abusing that system. You were actually losing money relative to the market every minute cruor farmers were botting the shit out of Abyssea for that purpose and you should be happy this happened before it was completely too late. I'm just happy SE did it now instead of never.

Alright since some of you have forgotten I'll remind you. Also since some of you aren't able to read any post that doesn't include paragraph spaces I'll break it down.

SE has in the past done this before. Each of these nerfs has caused the inflation to reverse which means items cost less gil. Some of you will remember the days when a scorpion harness would sell for 30m. So what happens to all the RMT's or people whom have already achieved max gil? Their fortune increases because now everything is cheaper.

This is what happens when inflation reverses and thus you have made it easier for RMT to make more dollars on their gil. Also those super rich whom can inflate the price on an object can make it even harder for people to acquire the items they need and want.

I have said this in my last 2 posts but it seems the only responses I get are to insignificant parts of my post so here's hoping the third time is the charm, IF YOU DON'T HAVE REASONABLE REWARDS AVAILABLE TO THE PLAYERS THEN YOUR ECONOMY IS GOING TO SUFFER BECAUSE PEOPLE NEED TO MAKE MONEY AND IF YOU DON'T STIMULATE THE ECONOMY THEN IT WILL COLLAPSE.

Now if SE had bothered to consider this before hand and introduce a more lucrative means of obtaining gil at a reasonable rate, or making crafting worth while again, then perhaps this could have been implemented much easier. All that is gonna happen at this point is everything will shift to the nearest easy money maker, and one by one SE will nerf them.

RMT aren't going anywhere because apparently SE likes having them around.

SE just killed their own game again, I'm not personally affected by it but I know tons of people who are. If they wanted to deal with the RMTs they should've put better limitations for people with excess cruor: Mission clears, hours played etc.

Square Enix in my opinion has the worst MMO management in history.

I'm glad Arcon gets it. Leviathan economy was in the gutter from Blinkering, and if they didn't kill it, it would have made all hell break loose. It was economically sound to let blinkers ride for a while.

You're never going to balance the creation and destruction of gil perfectly. So when deflation reaches extremes, gil fountains can be made to reinflate the economy. When inflation threatens to grow out of control, you cut off the gil fountain to deflate the economy. SE after a year or two SE will create a new gil fountain, because gil going out will be higher than gil going in, and a year or two after that, they'll nerf that, before inevitably adding something new.

That's how you properly regulate a game. Sucks for you. Necessary evil.

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Originally Posted by Behemothx

Square Enix in my opinion has the worst MMO management in history.

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Agreed, for a number of reasons.

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Originally Posted by Behemothx

SE just killed their own game again, I'm not personally affected by it but I know tons of people who are. If they wanted to deal with the RMTs they should've put better limitations for people with excess cruor: Mission clears, hours played etc.

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Disagreed, because RMT weren't even a minor problem here. It was legit players who had the worst negative effect on the economy with Blinkers. RMT contributed very little to it, I don't even know any RMTs who did it on Levi at all, not sure about other servers. But just look at everyone posting in this thread, bitching about it. That alone should give you an insight on how many legit players were doing it, and that's not even considering the people who farmed that shit with three mules each 24/7 in Abyssea.

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Originally Posted by Return1

That's how you properly regulate a game. Sucks for you. Necessary evil.

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The way you properly regulate a game is by targeting RMTs, not legit players.

so whats next like others i think they will attack FC parties by making it so when you FC you can only get EXP from one mob instead of them all. Like seriously who can FC for 20+hrs without using a 3rd party/bot that would fry my brain in about 4hours of such repetitive gameplay.

Oh well there's always monster hunter 3 ultimate coming out soon.

Did you guys ever think the biggest issue isn't the Chinese gill farmers, but the legit players who made a profit off of this (in the form of USD)?

Within the past few months I've seen a familiar name from long ago, all of the sudden become a decked out know nothing, with a 99 Vere. Given they could've been trolling, no one in their right mind fulltimes an idle set.

ok let's iron this out before going any further

THIS WAS NOT INTENDED TO TARGET REAL-MONEY TRADERS.

if you need a reason for it other than it just really, really needing to happen, it's to ensure that content in seekers of adoulin can and will be a viable way to make money when compared to content already in the game

Well honestly I think FCs will be killed off by this as well, used to be able to turn the cruor made from the FC into gil, which shaved off most of the cost, it was similar to a RMT FCing for cruor with tons of mules, but instead they had you do the cruor trades for them while you also got xp in return.

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Originally Posted by scaevola

if you need a reason for it other than it just really, really needing to happen, it's to ensure that content in seekers of adoulin can and will be a viable way to make money when compared to content already in the game

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quoted for the truth

FCs are unlikely to go anywhere, because at a fundamental level they provide a service that people are eager to pay for; they may end up having to charge less but that won't matter if the CPI drops, too.

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Originally Posted by scaevola

FCs are unlikely to go anywhere, because at a fundamental level they provide a service that people are eager to pay for; they may end up having to charge less but that won't matter if the CPI drops, too.

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Siren would disagree. Recently I think they've been selling AB's (lol).

Well, reasonable minds can disagree, but at this point I'm pretty comfortable that going from 30 to 88 in a night while I sleep is worth a million gil to me.

Love the idiots who think this was aimed at RMT instead of Economic regulation.

Love how idiots think this is the first time npcing has been nerfed.

Love the idiots pretending it's the end of the world when they know in a few months something will be implemented that sells just like Blinkers, and no one will care about said blinkers.

Love how idiots think this won't affect them.

Cant speak for other servers. but even with major gil influx on sylph, most products remained reasonable prices and sold well, economy was fairly stable over here.

I have seen no problems on Phoenix with anything except I was making money & was content with making what progress I could.

This makes me sad. Learned a little bit reading this thread about how our ingame economy works. Just SE, give us a decent way of making gil and please from now on, think about how it will effect us. You already knew things like mass killing existed. You could have started off by making only the red monster give experience(should have done this over a year ago when cleaving RMT's started). Remake how you could obtain chocobo blinkers. Like make it so you need to do a mission in sea or some crap. That would make it very lengthy for RMT to get to the damn quest. Put better items on the auction house. I miss the days where you could wear very good gear if you had the gil for it. Now it's all about the voidwatch drops or nyzle isle drops. HELP CRAFTERS. More higher end gear will be put on the auction house if people can afford to make it, or even attempt to make it(this is mainly my point with ammunition).
On a side note, make cruor convertable to voidwatch stones, even if each stone costs 30k cruor or something. That would help people's voidstones stocks greatly. No one wants to pay 120k to do an event where there return will be 20-30k gil 95% of the time....

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Originally Posted by Crimson_Slasher

Cant speak for other servers. but even with major gil influx on sylph, most products remained reasonable prices and sold well, economy was fairly stable over here.

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Give it a month or two.

"Give us a way of making gil." What? 2M daily in Dynamis isn't enough? 4M daily with both Dynamis and Salvage isn't enough?

People seem to misunderstand what "making gil" is, especially the "making" part. Dynamis and Salvage and even FC parties are great because they don't create any new gil, but just shift the gil within the economy around. The same isn't true for cruor. Cruor actually "made" gil, out of nothing. In regulated amounts, this is good and productive, if the player population supports it. The only reason some people didn't notice the influx of money reflect badly on their own gameplay was because the player population went up significantly after the SoA announcements, so there were people ready to consume all that money. As soon as that would have calmed down, you would notice it tremendously, because the supply would be going down, because less people are doing relevant content, while the money keeps going up, and we'd end up in the same crapper we've been a few years ago when people were asking 100M for a Thief's Knife and not getting laughed at for being retarded.

Tl;dr it's a very bad thing if everyone can afford everything, regardless of how good it sounds in your head.

That's cool and all, but most people bought bazaared items with cruor gil, so it's quite possible sales will suffer as a result. We can't all be sellers; who would be buying at that point?

Good Job SE! finally something you did right!

I think most of us can agree that this was a change that had to be made to stem the tide of inflation. Still, I wish SE could be a little more...I don't know, tactful with these sorts of changes. Sort of let people down easy.

And as we have to sell things for less, the things we buy will start costing proportionally less too.

We might have "felt" rich with all the cruor gil, but the fact is that unless you're one of those few who generated the highest amounts of gil from cruor, your relative wealth was constantly decreasing, even if your gil-figure in the game was rising.