Give every job dual wield at 99

This is one of the worst ideas that I have read in a very long time, and since the official forums were opened I've seen more craptacular ideas than I likely ever will for any other medium in my life.

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Originally Posted by noodles355

One person remarked on Rdm melee? Exaggeration much!? Pot calling the kettle black?

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I remarked on your one, single post. You remarked on the entire topic.. so no.. Your Point = NULL

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Originally Posted by noodles355

Oh great, another bloody rdm melee topic. Rdm, equally geared and played will always be worse at DD than a dedicated melee job, and every moron who says otherwise is trying to compare their view of a good rdm melee with a terrible [other DD].

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Since when was this topic derailed into "another bloody rdm melee topic"? No one was discussing melee rdm or even damage potential or lack there for of but mostly generalization very, very briefly.

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Originally Posted by noodles355

My Rdm out-DDs Wars in Dom Op parties, does that make me better or equal to war as a job? Hell no. It just means I'm a better player than said Wars, and was I on War myself, I would be doing significantly more damge still.

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No one cares?

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Originally Posted by noodles355

As far as bst goes: You're complaining you have to make a choice of shadows+pet PDT-10% against being able to cure with MP? Big whoop-di-doop. Almost all jobs have to make choices and sacrifices through subjob choices. It's part of the game, get over it.

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We went to talking about bst to whm, from combat application to stat boosting consideration of duel wielding. You have a poor way of summing up and digesting the contents of what's been discussed.

Rest assured, we're not singling out rdm melee, I picked on whm melee too so how about keeping your panties on a second and not barge in complaining instead of joining the discussion rationally... I guess if that's possible.

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Originally Posted by Daniel_Hatcher

I remarked on your one, single post. You remarked on the entire topic.. so no.. Your Point = NULL

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I love that one person remarks on something said about RDM

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You posted saying that one person commented about rdm melee, which was not justification for my outburst. So yes, that's an exaggeration and you're a hypocrite.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

Since when was this topic derailed into "another bloody rdm melee topic"?

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If it has potential to turn into a Rdm melee topic, then it needs to be snuffed out early. That's that. There were a good 4~ replies about rdm melee, that's enough to send off the alarm bells and try and stop it.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

We went to talking about bst to whm, from combat application to stat boosting consideration of duel wielding.

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What's your point? The argument I posted regarding bst is the exact same for whm too. But here, I'll re-quote the relevant section as you seem to have some sort of selective reading problem:

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Big whoop-di-doop. Almost all jobs have to make choices and sacrifices through subjob choices. It's part of the game, get over it.

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I do love the arrogant tone of your post, when you haven't actually concidered what I wrote properly. "Oh! he sounds angry so what he says must be rubbish and I shall argue it because it being angry has made me angry too!"

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Originally Posted by Daniel_Hatcher

Seriously WHM was mentioned too, should we call it a WHM Melee topic aswell?

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Temper for WHM! :D

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Originally Posted by noodles355

You posted saying that one person commented about rdm melee, which was not justification for my outburst. So yes, that's an exaggeration and you're a hypocrite.

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Well no, not quite.

But okay...

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Originally Posted by Daniel_Hatcher

I love that one person remarks on something said about RDM and you call it a RDM Melee topic.

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Well yes, quite.

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Originally Posted by noodles355

I do love the arrogant tone of your post, when you haven't actually concidered what I wrote properly. "Oh! he sounds angry so what he says must be rubbish and I shall argue it because it being angry has made me angry too!"

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Seriously, calm your tits and stop taking everything as a personal offense.

If you read back to one of my last posts about duel wield, the last thing I said that it's combat trait and should stay that way. Yes, it's about making choices and sacrifices over what subjob you use, but pretty much everything else you bother to type is down right ignorant to the discussion out of paranoia that some one dissing the way you may choose to play your favorite job or whatever. In short, you lost credibility before your closing statement was made.

Edit in:

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Originally Posted by MDenham

Temper for WHM! :D

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I vote for Ternary Flourish on WHM.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

I vote for Ternary Flourish on WHM.

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Native Quadruple Attack, retroactive to lv85.

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Originally Posted by Olor

At 99, free us from having to choose a either nin or dnc sub to get dual wield. Open up the sub job possibilities with native dual weild for every job at 99

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If the idea is to open up more SJ options, the solution is not to give every job dualwield. The solution is to make other SJs equally useful in other ways.

When's the last time you saw someone sub blu or cor? bst is mostly only good as a sj for charm (an enmity tool), but even that is pretty weak. pup only gets used as a sj if the ADD trick needs to get used. The autorefresh from /smn ain't all that attractive now that /sch 1ups it. Most SJs are a terrible choice right now. It's no wonder you're using nin or dnc! Not only do they give you dualwield, but they give you sneak/invis methods, nin gives you shadows, and dnc gives you heals, sambas, steps, and flourishes!

The real problem is that other jobs don't have complimentary traits/JAs/spells at low levels. What would you sub on bst if you had native dualwield? Yeah, war, because of berserk, aggressor, double attack, provoke, etc. Lots of jobs need to have their SJ usability re-examined.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

Seriously, calm your tits and stop taking everything as a personal offense.

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Calm down. Oh wait, there's no actual anger in your post, so that doesn't really work? My bad.

(Psst, maybe you should try saying that to me too regarding my last post which you quoted, devoid of anything justifying a "calm down" really. If you don't want me to take things as a personal offence then dont write them directly at me?)

From your last post I have discovered a few things about you:
1) You like to make baseless assumptions to try and build an argument. Making something out of nothing. Sauce: "that some one dissing the way you may choose to play your favorite job or whatever".
2) You seem to think I care about how much credibility you think I have. (I couldn't care less. i don't owe you anything, and nor do you have any assets I'd be interested in)
3) You like to call justified arguments ignorant, without any sort of rebuttle. Unless of course the "ignorant" comment was regarding my comments on Rdm melee, which I thought we already covered was a tangent? The argument of "you must make choices and sacrifices, everyone else does on every other job" is still relevant.
4) Hvergelmir.

Well this got no where fast. My bad for assuming your first post was an assumption that this topic would derail into rdm melee topic, assuming that my post towards had an "arrogant tone". My bad for assuming every retaliatory remark you made against Daniel was an attempt to defend yourself while at the same time trying to make a snide remark against him, which I assumed was cause you took grievance from even being addressed by some one not agreeing with your stance. Cause I mean, how could it not rub your the wrong way since it was directed at you, right?

You come in overreacting and make a jumble argumentative post that's over simplifying the pre-existent debate.

And seriously, a hvergelmir in my possession is bothersome to you that you have this baseless assumption in your head for what I may be using it for? ...Right.

But oh, on to important business...

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Originally Posted by Economizer

White Mage melee certainly isn't a novelty if you are trying to solo anything as one. Curing yourself for five minutes won't kill a monster if you are the only one doing damage, even if you are casting every Divine Magic nuke and even Impact every chance you get. Not every situation in this game is an alliance battle versus mobs that will kill anything they look at that doesn't have over a few thousand health.

Of course, does a White Mage need Dual Wield natively? Does a Red Mage? Does Beastmaster? Again, like I said before, while it would be beneficial towards the classes, it does not necessarily make it happening a good idea from a flavor or balance standpoint.

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If WHM is not a novelty, then what would be the application of a melee WHM outside of personal preference when doing things on your own time?

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Originally Posted by Soranika

If WHM is not a novelty, then what would be the application of a melee WHM outside of personal preference when doing things on your own time?

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Proving it's possible to do X on WHM.

It makes more sense in small groups, when the application of melee WHM is to retain WHM cure power while speeding up kills somewhat. (Obviously whether or not this is a good idea depends on the fight. For example, I'm not crazy enough to melee Chloris on WHM.)

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

All the jobs that use 1H weapons either already have it or have no use for it.

THF DNC NIN BLU: have it already. Of these THF and BLU will always be using /NIN for shadows and DW3 anyway.

PLD: Should never take off shield.

RDM: Should always be using staves.

WHM: See RDM.

WAR: Should always use great axe.

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Biggest bunch of bs i ever heard given that tier I enspells affect both main and offhand weapon. RDM technically should've been had DW1 and DW2 already behind NIN and DNC of course with NIN the highest tier of DW followed by DNC, then RDM. I NEVER understood people who want to be RDM but never use a sword which they have an actuall skill for that improves accuracy but think RDM should ONLY use a STAFF for which they have no actual skill for and may only get a few paltry stat boosts for which make very little difference overall when they are still outshined natively by BLM and SCH. To each their own but complete BS in my opinion but whatever

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Originally Posted by CapriciousOne

Biggest bunch of bs i ever heard given that tier I enspells affect both main and offhand weapon. RDM technically should've been had DW1 and DW2 already behind NIN and DNC of course with NIN the highest tier of DW followed by DNC, then RDM. I NEVER understood people who want to be RDM but never use a sword which they have an actuall skill for that improves accuracy but think RDM should ONLY use a STAFF for which they have no actual skill for and may only get a few paltry stat boosts for which make very little difference overall when they are still outshined natively by BLM and SCH. To each their own but complete BS in my opinion but whatever

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My head is full of something.

Something that rhymes with "truck".

Can anyone guess what is filling my head?

I idle in PDT Shamshir so nacht.

Still need oneiros grip so back to staff below 76% MP.

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Originally Posted by Neisan_Quetz

Dual wield only matters for single handers anyway. And of those, Pld still doesn't care, Dnc Nin and Thf have it already, and Blu can set it. That leaves ... ohwait.

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BST, and BRD

:P

My two fave jobs

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

The reason BST wants Dual Wield has nothing at all to do with faster TP building. In fact, It likely has exactly the opposite reason... I'll explain.

Right now, to Dual Wield 2 -PDT pet axes, BST has to sub NIN or DNC. Subbing NIN means you can keep shadows up vs a mob that doesn't AOE, however if the mob can AOE you, DNC can be better to cure yourself.

Unfortunately, /DNC requires TP which isn't very easy to come by, and even harder in situations like closed battlefields where there's only the NM to build TP on. In this situation, /SCH /WHM or /RDM are much better options as you can replenish mp simply by /heal, not to mention far more refresh gear available, and sublimation/refresh from rdm or sch. But right now, you can only wield 1 x -pdt axe if you /sch /whm or /rdm

If this wasn't why the OP wanted DW for BST, I'm stumped.

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Yeah this is exactly why I want dual wield for bst. Would love to be able to sub mages without taking a major hit to pet durability.

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Originally Posted by SpankWustler

My head is full of something.

Something that rhymes with "truck".

Can anyone guess what is filling my head?

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I was thinking more along the lines of something that rhymes with "spilt" but whatever