I'm with Econ, Dia 3 shouldn't have a base duration of 30 seconds...
Personally I'd prefer if it wasn't a merit at all, but whatever. If SE is going to keep the categories the same, at least make it so you don't need multiple merits just to have a decent duration/effect on of all spells Dia/Phalanx.
[dev1115] Job Adjustments: Red Mage
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04-21-2012, 06:34 AMNeisan_Quetz
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04-21-2012, 06:43 AMZiraelThese changes aren't directed towards RDM, but any mage job in general. A BLU or NIN will get more use out of it than RDM. Dia III can not be resisted as it is. Enfeebling magic landing or not landing does not make RDM desirable (or even tolerable) in end game events. You'd sooner take a Boost-STR, Embrava or Thundaja mage than lolRefresh II/Gravity II one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
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04-21-2012, 08:32 AMLadyofdragonsTotally agreeQuote:
Originally Posted by Zirael
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04-21-2012, 11:10 AMManaKingLoud and Clear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
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04-21-2012, 12:59 PMDemon6324236
Well looking at RDM and what has been done for it lately, I cant say I disagree, when I see something happen or something said that will mean I get invites, Ill be happy, for now, I offer my SCH & my RDM to VW partys when I go, and 99.9% of the time, they tell me to go SCH, even if they have a SCH, and no RDM, they do it every time.
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04-21-2012, 04:25 PMsaevelCan you please bring this back to the devs. RDM's tier II merits DO NEED UPDATING. Specifically Dia / Bio / Phalanx II need their duration extended to max and have the rest do potency.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayohne
Or just release them as scrolls and make the merits raise potency instead. There problem fixed. -
04-22-2012, 01:29 AMShadowViper
Looking at our 2 main mage skills:
Enfeebling, is nice to have when they work, the problem being just about every enfeeb we have other jobs have or have something bit better. So as the enfeebler role in the group, why bring a dedicated when your pretty much have it already.
Enhancing, this is super important to most players for endgame events. When it comes to RDM 99% of our enhancements are self which makes them pointless, and to add insult on injury a sch with /rdm can AOE a good percentage of our self enhancing buffs.
Solution-
Enfeebling - Give us more unique enfeebs, and give us some AOE versions so we can be the crowd control (do this w/o some sort of ability like sch)
Enhancing - More non self buffs, but these also have to be AOE or we are just back to being the cycle mage of a few buffs.
Those 2 things will give us more of a role in a group. -
04-22-2012, 04:00 AMOphannus
Red Mages's most powerful and useful spells are our level 75 merit spells. Black Mages got stronger nukes than Ancient Magic II post 75(tier 5 and -aja spells), why can't Red Mage get more powerful debuffs post 75? Addle doesn't count since you gave it to White Mages, and Gravity II is worthless and a slap in the face.
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04-22-2012, 05:15 AMLastrangerIf only .....Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowViper
SE got this idea that any AOE on rdm would make them too powerfull ( dosnt fit their view of how rdm should be ), Sadly they dont realize with the advent of Sch/level cap raise : this past view of rdm pretty much made their past vision bull and shifted rdm to second rate for enhancing/defeebling, and to add to insult , enfeebles hit imunity more now instead of skillbased resist on harder stuff.
Se has given some nice things to rdm after 75, however they have also shared these with other jobs with exception of Temper/Refresh 2/gravity 2 and spontaniety.
As for Merit 1 & 2 changes all i have to say ( and repeat ) is Make the spell's scrolls and add real merits to rdm, the rdm merit system was wasted and is made for level 75, just like whm pro/shell dev team hit a wall when raising cap because of merit spells, they couldnt add spells that existed new tiers because of merits ( or give to other jobs that now seemed resonable bue to increased level ).
Solution : Instead of spell merits ( and this goes for all Job's with wasted spell merits ) add a single Potency merit for them.
Rdm could have a Enfeebling Potency to boost effect off all enfeebles, this would also open up for 5 more merits where one could also add a enhancing Potency boost merit ( as RDM get highest enhancing skil of any job naturally ) wich would not only go on duration but also effect of enhancing spells on self and others.
That leaves room for 4 more merits in group 2 and since RDM is a Jack of all trades it should reflect that in the merits, 2 merits could be towards melee, a lot of posibility's but something increasing our natural EN magic/spikes
A merit granting Dual wield on first point ( level 1 only ) to give rdm better choice of sub job, and increasing wepon Acc/haste
might fit the bill, the reason i say Dual wield is because all 1 hand wepon wielders have gimp dmg compared to job's doing dual wield.
Another path could of course be to go a original style and make up for lack of Dual wield damage by adding potent En spell dmg when fighting with shield, that carries on to Wepon skills used that are non element, giving these the element of en spell used add to dmg ( a multi hit WS would get multi hit en magic hit as well), but this requires en spell dmg to be raised a lot, my personal opinion is it could be balanced out with a drain on mp for evry hit to counter the kraken club problem they had with drk's 2 hour on multihit's.
But the En spell dmg would have to be potent, like more then the sword/dagger dmg they do for this to be embraced and should have no problem because they pay for added dmg with mp.
Last 2 merits in group 2 should be 1 towards Blm path of rdm, Since 1 already covers enfeeble, mayby a Fast cast boost/Mab for the nuking RDM, or a merit ability that allows nukes to chain toghether ( same elementh spell ) for extra dmg and lowering that elemenths defence on prey,
Level 1 chain ( earth element )could be Rumble, doing somewhere close tier 1-2 magic dmg, Level 2 chain ( 3 earth spells chained ) would be Lesser Quake doing tier 3 spell dmg or little more, Level 3 chain ( 4 earth spells chained ) would create Massive Quake and dmg would depend on previous cast spells, if all where tier 3-4 (used with chainspell ) done under the short duration of the merit JA u can land beyond tier 5 magic dmg with last chain and lower that elementh to a cap, this would require 2 rdm's to work toghether if not using 2 hour or spontenieity to max out.
Last merit would be for whm related side of Rdm since enhancing is covered, this could be a boost to healing spells, but personally i think the one meritt rdm should have gotten was a specific potency boost to Refresh/regen, although with recent change to sch as new regen master it might be to much to dream for.
So mayby add a Convert Max out effect, first tier giving convert a tier of 1,25x change of hp to mp, and boost it towards 1,5x hp to mp ratio at 5 merits and at final merit u give the added ability of hiting a max mp effect on self if hp converted to mp is over amount mp u can hold, so if u have 1000/800 hp/mp after convert u have 800/1500 hp/mp with the help of max mp effect.
this would give convert renewed boost for rdm only asd any job now can get convert to work the same way as subbed.
Merit group 1 :
Convert recast timer : give it reduction from 1 minute for each merit allowing to cap at 5 min recast. further increasing rdm self use of convert.
Magic Acc : turn all the single elementh merits into 1 merit as it wastes good merit space on single useless for the most part lementh acc ( same shoudl be done to other mage job with same silly waste of merit group 1 )
Group 1 merit should also reflect that RDM is a mix of WHM/BLM/WAR by having 2 or so merits covering each job aspect of rdm.
If we count Convert recast as a whm part and elementh acc as a blm part that leaves 1 more merit for whm/blm in group 1 and 2 merit for war part of rdm.
for second whm merit on rdm i would have sugested cure potency but cure is being reworked so i was thinking gaining access to whm removal spells through maxing out a JT for spell resistance.
This would grant a rdm access to the removl spells at 5/5 merits in group and some nice boost to magic resist, allowing RDM to be more party supporter and taking some stress of WHM while not taking whm main focus of healing.
For the blm part of rdm merit 1 : instead off focusing on more dmg like BLM a Job trait merit that increase RDM mp efficency while casting nuke's.
As for War part of Rdm merit 1 : Enspell Potency+ , since enspell is meant to be the melee part of rdm
Second : Board & Sword Job trait : Increase to Shield skill and melee Acc
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That was the merit part, but Rdm also need rework on spells.
where is :
Stoneskin 2, Poisen 3/4 , Blink 2, Spikes 2, Bind 2, dispel 2, sleep 3.
Also Rdm merit 2 spell phalanx 2 need potency up, and all merit spells should be made scrolls.
Why does RDM that has best enhancing/Enfeebling skill of all mage jobs not get any AOE spells further barring them from Party use and making them more of a solo job.
All the Bar spells that are single self only and the new gain spells should be deleted and replace on rdm with their AOE counterpart, as many have argued with before here, this with let rdm that is less tied to background in party/alliance fights to run in and buff their team mates and actually have a group defined job.
At the 40s single target buff like haste and refresh cycling was to some degree tolerable, but as spell list increased towards 75 it become a chore to use single target spell buffs and should have gotten a AOE counterpart to balance out, and this is even less desirable to have more single spell cycles now at 99 and SE dev team should reconsider their idea/stance on RDM and AOE spells
here is a list of useable spells RDM could have as AOE that would promote Party invite:
Hastega ( yes i know WHM now gets it at 40 as single but considering rdm is the best enhancer it should have been rdm who got this first, a change could be done like with regen and sch), also im not against whm getting it but RDM should have enhancing potency over whm on it and be equall to smn in potency ( the hastega should be overhauled to last 3 - 5 min )
Barspells as AOE, Gain spell as boost spell, Breakga, poisenga 1/2/3,Paralyzega, Slowga 1, Bindga , blindga, Diaga 2/3 , bioga 2/3, Refreshra 1/2, shellra 1-5/ protectra 1-5, Blinkra 1, graviga , Phalanxra 1/2.
Also enspells as Ra series or a JA to grant aoe enspell to party members evry 3-5 min.
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and here is a final list of spells that isnt on rdm at all but that could be rdm only spells.
Defencer : Lowers enemy double/triple/quadrouple attack rate by a given % boosted by level of enfeebling skill.
Float : classic FF spell, but used as a enfeebling spell this time , raising enemy of ground lowering physical damage taken but increasing magic dmg/jump dmg/ranged dmg taken.
Amnesia : stop TP attacks/Job ability's , should have increased resist on stronger nm's but rarly imunity instead make it harder to land or less duration on those targets.
Stumble : Occ TP moves fail, increased chance of stumble effect taking place depending on enfeebling skill. a nice alternetive to amnesia if it is consider to powerfull.
Rally : single self target granting a small aoe buff to all around Rdm with rally effect, grant a small boost to all JT by 1 tier, does not effect rdm. if rdm stand near blm's they gain +1 tier of all JT boosting their dmg etc, would make rdm usable as both front and background in party, Range determined by enhancing skill.
Nova : single target Multihit firebased spell, doing 2-8 hit. amount of hit depends on enfeebling skill amount dmg on element skill, making it a balance game for Rdm to get most out of the spell.
I know there are tons more sugestions on Rdm forum of new spells, the point is rdm should have more that is rdm only and i sugest dev's look at forum.
The optemist in me hope that SE dev team is secretly working on Rdm rework and all other content they dont talk about like new expansions, taking newly made code from 14 and reworking it for later being added to 11 as a 2 for price of 1 remake.
But the Pesemist in me realize this probably isnt so and we pretty much gotta cry harder to get work done on 11, wich considering im paying for both 11 and 14 means i should be entitled to expect SE to do something on both not just put all their egg's into the halfsunken ship and let their other ship fall apart over time as lack of maintance.
with that said i do realize SE is working on something and not telling us but what im worried about is it isnt anything new just rehashed areas and no real expansions, spells/ability's
I think some of the merit remake's of tier 2/ability are underwhelming considering we moved fro 75 to 99, some stuff should have been reconsidered and remade completly, take Eagle eye shoot for example, it gets a enemitty lowered now wich is nice but what was needed on it wasnt that but a boost in dmg scaled better as levels went up, level 30 EES was 1 of the best 2 hours toghether with smn 2 hour but at 99 they have become lackluster.
Back to rdm my only plead with Dev team is dont look at rdm and remember somebody soloing some nm and say rdm is a demigod, coz it isnt, no balancing should take into acount insain players that willingly waiste hours DOT/kiting stuff to death as the bar of what to balance towards, be realistic and realize most players just want rdm to be usable as party event or low man job that gets stuff done.
I disagree on the idea that Rdm should be little of all master of nothing, a jack of trade should be able to master the difrrent aspects of BLM/WHM/WAR in the rdm way, being a master of enhancing surpasing whm on that, being a master of enfeebling surpassing blm on that, and using Enspells/spike to gain near War melee dmg, but only with the right Sub job/gear/merit allowing it to master this.
Sch is great example for this hybrid as the white and black book boost it in either direction but instantly, rdm would require more work to gain this thorugh merit/sub job/gear oh and uniqe spells. -
04-22-2012, 05:38 AMsaevel
@Lastranger
RDM has never EVER been an "enhancer" aka buffer job, ever. People got that idea stuck in their had back in 2003/2004 when it was BRD or RDM for "Refresh". RDM was actually shoved into the "Healer" role because they had Haste, Refresh and Cure IV and thus was useful for XP parties.
At 75 RDM's "buffs" were
Haste
Refresh
Protect
Shell
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And now all of those are available as /RDM. Eventually SE introduced Phalanx II but at a vastly inferior level then Phalanx I.
So you can see that SE's idea of RDM is actually in line with what the job always did, RDM was never BRD, COR or WHM. The only AoE buffs RDM got was from /WHM barspells and now accession /SCH. RDM has always been about self buffing while casting enfeebling / nuking magic on the target while also casting cure spells on people.