The problem with Tripling Down on Shadowbringers Job Design

[Supersnow845]

Pretty sure I went into detail about that and sparked a big discussion with WAR Here for a good minute before that train stopped.

Oh I know, just pledging my continued support of nerfing the blight on balance design that is WAR

[ty_taurus]

It’s so funny to me how when Heavensward or Stormblood are brought up by someone missing how jobs felt more fun to play back then, that someone inevitably starts complaining about the job balance back then (which is, you know not the point) because Endwalker balance is so perfect and flawless of course, with WAR being the perfect trifecta of most brain dead, strongest damage, and strongest sustain for some reason. Not to mention RDM’s damage is painfully low, DNC was very undertuned in tier 1, MCH was very undertuned for tier 1 and 2, PLD’s emergency warriorification was so important, it couldn’t wait for 7.0 apparently… Jobs are as homogenized, simplified, and neutered as ever and yet balance is still a problem.

So what’s the point of job lobotomization if it still fails to achieve perfect balance?

[Supersnow845]

It’s so funny to me how when Heavensward or Stormblood are brought up by someone missing how jobs felt more fun to play back then, that someone inevitably starts complaining about the job balance back then (which is, you know not the point) because Endwalker balance is so perfect and flawless of course, with WAR being the perfect trifecta of most brain dead, strongest damage, and strongest sustain for some reason. Not to mention RDM’s damage is painfully low, DNC was very undertuned in tier 1, MCH was very undertuned for tier 1 and 2, PLD’s emergency warriorification was so important, it couldn’t wait for 7.0 apparently… Jobs are as homogenized, simplified, and neutered as ever and yet balance is still a problem.

So what’s the point of job lobotomization if it still fails to achieve perfect balance?

How many buffs did SGE get to compete with SCH who got nerfed despite the fact that even now in a raid setting SCH’s kit is still so infinitely better it’s almost hilarious

Who allowed a universally useful utility, the most mitigation of any one class and shields big enough to delete mechanics the class can generate entirely off its own toolkit to all exist on a single class

[Striker44]

So what’s the point of job lobotomization if it still fails to achieve perfect balance?

If I took a test and failed with a score of 20%, then studied for my next one and scored 80%, should I conclude that there was no point to studying because it didn't get me a perfect 100%? Of course not. A change doesn't have to make something "perfect" to be worthwhile - simply being "immensely better" can fit the bill.

[Valence]

It’s so funny to me how when Heavensward or Stormblood are brought up by someone missing how jobs felt more fun to play back then, that someone inevitably starts complaining about the job balance back then (which is, you know not the point) because Endwalker balance is so perfect and flawless of course, with WAR being the perfect trifecta of most brain dead, strongest damage, and strongest sustain for some reason. Not to mention RDM’s damage is painfully low, DNC was very undertuned in tier 1, MCH was very undertuned for tier 1 and 2, PLD’s emergency warriorification was so important, it couldn’t wait for 7.0 apparently… Jobs are as homogenized, simplified, and neutered as ever and yet balance is still a problem.

So what’s the point of job lobotomization if it still fails to achieve perfect balance?

MCH is still a third class of its own, below the second dps group (ranged jobs), if you go about cDPS metrics. It's way behind everything else, it's just sad. That's the whole MCH's story since its rework in ShB, always bottom DPS job.

[VentVanitas]

SE's insistence on WAR supremacy just means that sacrificing so many gameplay elements for the sake of balance is a foolish endeavour. if there's gonna be stupid wackiness like WAR solo-ing anything under Extreme/Savage anyway, then why are we bothering with such uptight balance?

I better see Bloodwhetting omega nerfed by the time media tour tooltips get released.

[rawker]

Not gonna happen. Some youtuber will make an uproar

[ty_taurus]

Bloodwhetting is removed, but becomes a trait that’s always active.

[Kaixern]

Enhanced Tomahawk :
Gets a free Bloodwhetting per use
(Not a reducted cooldown, this way there is less homogenization among classes, you players are going to be really happy with this right?.....)

[ty_taurus]

If I took a test and failed with a score of 20%, then studied for my next one and scored 80%, should I conclude that there was no point to studying because it didn't get me a perfect 100%? Of course not. A change doesn't have to make something "perfect" to be worthwhile - simply being "immensely better" can fit the bill.

I think “immensely better” is highly questionable. The current balance is in some ways more jank than it used to be.

Both now and in the past, all jobs are viable. But because of how homogenized the jobs are, the jobs that are worse are hard to justify because there’s virtually nothing else they bring to the table that other jobs can’t do. You can still bring them because again, everything is viable like it was in the past as well, but RDM for example has almost no merit compared to SMN who also has a raise, deals more damage, has more mobility, and has been reduced to almost healer level gameplay but without the healing.