TOP cleared with no healers

[GaiusDrakon]

Again, viewing this through a lens in which the game is broken is a lazy way to look at this, and it's also possible that perhaps a lot of us aren't as good at gaming as we'd like to think we are. Let your egos go for a minute.

Climate change is quickly depleting glaciers, opening up new mountaineering routes that weren't possible before. These routes are, however, treacherous, as the same regions most impacted by climate change are also the places where avalanches and severe weather become more common.

Person A: The fact that John managed to climb Mt. Hegemon through the southern side is insane. It really shows how big a problem climate change is. The Southern route used to be nigh impossible because of how thick the ice sheets are.

Person B: Well let your ego go for a minute. Can YOU climb the same route??????

[SassyAssassin]

Ok yes they cleared but they were level Asian so we can’t compare

[Bsrking5]

Ok yes they cleared but they were level Asian so we can’t compare

Have the scientist finally found the god tier gamer gene yet? I'm sure it's a valuable in the military market with these new fangled things called drones.

[GaiusDrakon]

SOURCE CITATION AND FIVE DIFFERENT ACADEMIC JOURNAL ARTICLES REQUIRED.

*Not required if it supports Ren's argument about the majority of the playerbase liking X.

[Renathras]

I was about to reply, but the moment guy compared FFXIV's RDM to Aion's Chanter, I just gave up, man didn't even play Aion and yet is trying to make comparisons lol

Oh, you have chosen...poorly.

You made a comparison you then said yourself was invalid. I said closest to as far as I can tell. YES, I didn't play Aion because it's a dead game and I liked other games better. That's why I'm not the one comparing Aion to FFXIV.

What this post is really saying:

"I was going to reply, but realized I had no counter to the arguments made, so I'm not going to but am going to present my non-argument as if I won."

Futurama - Will of the warrior: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMdYZG_gdwI
"No girl has the will of the warrior. You have the will of the housewife. Or, at best, the school mom."
"That's it! I'll take you on right now!"
"Very well. But, you see, I have the will of the warrior. Therefore the battle is already over. The winner? Me! Rematch? YOU LOSE AGAIN! HAD ENOUGH?! I THOUGHT SO!"

When you frame your argument as "I don't have to have an argument", then that's this stupidity.

You would be incorrect. During the time I played Aion, from closed beta up until around the end of 2021 (so if memory serves that would be 12 years) , on a number of classes including both cleric and chanter, as classes were adjusted, and instances, aside some exceptionally difficult PVE content or PVP matches, a chanter could solo heal , and that left the group free to do whatever they wanted - sometimes to bring a DPS cleric - since a decently geared DPS spec cleric was once of the highest DPS in the game- OR bring another DPS.

Yay! You actually contested...a small part of...the point: That the Chanter could be considered a Healer, which is 100% in line with my statement that it sounds like the kind of FFXIV AST in HW.

Congratulations for agreeing with me even while you were mocking me.

The phrase you're looking for would be "You would be correct, more or less", not "You would be incorrect".

Also, in some conditions, a songweaver could also solo heal a group , given the correct spec as well but that spec was quite rare (i.e. usually SW went DPS spec) . However it was quite possible.

So...KINDA like...a...RDM...

Thanks for telling me I'm right again without saying I'm right again.

It's funny how you insist I'm talking out my butt...but then say the things I said are correct, just while trying not to word it that way. XD

It's par for the course.

So are people like that not having arguments.

Point is, someone made a stupid comparison, then when called on it, didn't even bother trying to defend it.

.

Can you provide any evidence that people who play SUPPORT roles in 4-role games all play HEALERS in 3-role Trinity games?

SOURCE CITATION AND FIVE DIFFERENT ACADEMIC JOURNAL ARTICLES REQUIRED.

*Not required if it supports Ren's argument about the majority of the playerbase liking X.

/popcorn

I straight up said what information is needed. Asking for a trend instead of a single data point isn't "FIVE DIFFERENT ACADEMIC JOURNALS". Moreover, when I am making arguments, I do cite data such as player numbers AND historic trends. So I'm asking him to do nothing that I don't do myself when I provide data to support positions.

"You lose again!"

[IDontPetLalas]

Oh, you have chosen...poorly.
You made a comparison you then said yourself was invalid. I said closest to as far as I can tell. YES, I didn't play Aion because it's a dead game and I liked other games better. That's why I'm not the one comparing Aion to FFXIV.
What this post is really saying:
"I was going to reply, but realized I had no counter to the arguments made, so I'm not going to but am going to present my non-argument as if I won."
Futurama - Will of the warrior: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMdYZG_gdwI
"No girl has the will of the warrior. You have the will of the housewife. Or, at best, the school mom."
"That's it! I'll take you on right now!"
"Very well. But, you see, I have the will of the warrior. Therefore the battle is already over. The winner? Me! Rematch? YOU LOSE AGAIN! HAD ENOUGH?! I THOUGHT SO!"
When you frame your argument as "I don't have to have an argument", then that's this stupidity.
Yay! You actually contested...a small part of...the point: That the Chanter could be considered a Healer, which is 100% in line with my statement that it sounds like the kind of FFXIV AST in HW.
Congratulations for agreeing with me even while you were mocking me.
The phrase you're looking for would be "You would be correct, more or less", not "You would be incorrect".
So...KINDA like...a...RDM...
Thanks for telling me I'm right again without saying I'm right again.

It's funny how you insist I'm talking out my butt...but then say the things I said are correct, just while trying not to word it that way. XD


So are people like that not having arguments.

Point is, someone made a stupid comparison, then when called on it, didn't even bother trying to defend it.


Can you provide any evidence that people who play SUPPORT roles in 4-role games all play HEALERS in 3-role Trinity games?

/popcorn

I straight up said what information is needed. Asking for a trend instead of a single data point isn't "FIVE DIFFERENT ACADEMIC JOURNALS". Moreover, when I am making arguments, I do cite data such as player numbers AND historic trends. So I'm asking him to do nothing that I don't do myself when I provide data to support positions.

"You lose again!"

So , to clarify:

No, I wasn't "mocking you" however as you said, you hadn't played Aion, so whatever you wrote was pure conjecture or , in your own words "talking out of your butt".

No, chanter did not play at all like FFXIV AST. About all that they had in common was the ability apply buffs and the ability to heal, however the player experience was completely different

No, a SW did not play at all like a RDM. Or heal like one.

in summary, you sound as authoritative here talking about Aion as I would be talking about WOW. Considering I only played WOW for about a week, I'll let you imagine just how profound my understanding of WOW is in comparison to those people who have played it for years.

[Rehayem]

I was about to reply, but the moment guy compared FFXIV's RDM to Aion's Chanter, I just gave up, man didn't even play Aion and yet is trying to make comparisons lol

[IDontPetLalas]

I was about to reply, but the moment guy compared FFXIV's RDM to Aion's Chanter, I just gave up, man didn't even play Aion and yet is trying to make comparisons lol

It's par for the course.

[IDontPetLalas]

"Point is: You cannot assume "Support" transfers 1-to-1 to "Healer" in different games. I've never played Aion but just loaded up their Class page. As far as I can tell, there are 6 main archetypes (Warrior, Scout, Mage, Priest, Technist, Muse) that seem to roughly correlate to "Tank", "Melee", "Caster DPS", X (will get back to this), "Ranged DPS", Y (will get back to this)

X consists of exactly ONE Healer class, Cleric, and one buffer Support class, Chanter (Enchanter?) - "inspire the morale of allies" "strengthen allies". While this could be something like an AST, a Healer with buffs, the description seems more of a buffer. The description bullet points include "Is able to use some recovery and healing abilities." Conversely, Y consists of Songweaver ("lifting their allies' hearts and spelling their enemies' doom with the power of song") which sounds more like BRD than like a Healer, or perhaps a BRD mixed with a RDM; "can reduce opponents stats and control their movement" sounds like a Control/Support, not a Healer. The closest thing to healer there is "Viable secondary healer when accompanied by a Cleric", and Vandal, which is a ranged physical damage dealer and debuffer with a "Variety of control effects".

Strictly speaking, only Cleric there sounds like "Healer", with the other three being a buffer with "some" heals, a debuffer/control (control effects are also used too describe the Songweaver) with magic song damage and crowd control effects, with some limited "secondary" healing, and a full Control class that seems to not even mention Healing."

You would be incorrect. During the time I played Aion, from closed beta up until around the end of 2021 (so if memory serves that would be 12 years) , on a number of classes including both cleric and chanter, as classes were adjusted, and instances, aside some exceptionally difficult PVE content or PVP matches, a chanter could solo heal , and that left the group free to do whatever they wanted - sometimes to bring a DPS cleric - since a decently geared DPS spec cleric was once of the highest DPS in the game- OR bring another DPS.

Also, in some conditions, a songweaver could also solo heal a group , given the correct spec as well but that spec was quite rare (i.e. usually SW went DPS spec) . However it was quite possible.

[Hyperia]

Why is there a healer shortage? Really? It’s because this game forces healers to do heavy DPS an a tiny amount of healing. Heck, healers get in trouble if they use their GCD heals as it’s a DPS loss.

In WOW, if I did DPS in a dungeon, there was a very good chance people will die, here I can disconnect, come back after a few minutes and everything is ok.

I play a healer because I want to support and help others, not DPS. I do DPS though so don’t come back on me on that. I do it but I don’t like it.

I wish that healers had more buffs and other mitigations to fill any healing down time. I’d also like to see them have some bonus system where when a healer uses a GCD, it helps charge a gauge that can be used for a DPS buff or other mitigation.

Give me something to do besides DPS and you may see more healers… also, have more healers start at level 1 besides WHM.