Shell FCs are a bigger problem than we think...

[Joven]

Just wanted to say that I am an FC of just me and a couple of alts. I have a medium in Lavender Beds that I use extensively for airships/subs and FC actions. Why should I be denied/have my house taken from me, one that I saved up and paid a lot of gil for, just because you're upset?

[Big_Bap]

You seem to be ignoring my statement that I am not taking sides on this, Big_Bap.
I am telling you that you are going about this all wrong.

You made a thread titled "A question from North American player". It's too vague so you have fewer players opening that thread to start with.
Your OP text said "There is an EN forum thread that talks about deleting FC with less than 4 members. According to data, JP players favor small sized FC. Why does it seem like JP players favor small FCs?"
So you only get players who favor small FCs to write why they like small FCs.
On top of that, you only let the thread be up less than 24 hours to come to a conclusion and say "Nobody agrees with him".

You're not interested in the JP opinion, only in shaping it to back up your argument.

BTW, I am not saying that JP players do not favor small FCs. They do.
But the way you presented them with the question, and the way you used their answers to back your argument is somewhat deceiving.

So what would have been a more appropriate title then? What prevents one of your fellow players from discussing why they dislike small FCs?

I am very much aware that you folks tend to use the thumbs up feature instead of replying with the same answers (see post #9 in relation to post #3). As I've already pointed out, the thread as nearly 6,000 views. Look at this thread if you want a comparison. I'm going to repeat myself, can you point me towards posts that do not support small FCs? I very much care about what you have to say, unlike Almagus. After all, they are the one that claim that 15,000 Japanese FCs should have their house demolished.

To make things clear, until my last post, I did not use any messages from that thread to back my argument. If so, please point it out.
The only thing I've done is share the link to the thread on the Japanese forum to let other people know that nobody seemed to agree that small FCs should be deleted. As stated previously, I didn't need to go over there to know you favored small FCs, I already have that information from the lodestone.

[xxSouxx]

What title was more appropriate? If you think an ambiguous title like "A question from North American player" would grab people's attention to look in the thread, then what can I say?

And also, do you not agree that a question phrased like "Why does it seem like JP players favor small FCs?" will not give you any response like "Yes, we disagree with <someone>" or "Yup, I'm all for deleting small FCs".
They will just explain why they like small FCs and ask why an EN player is bringing this topic to them.
But you phrased it so that it looks like the JP players all agreed with you and disagreed with this someone.
(https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...89#post5617889)

And even phrased it as if I took sides with you.
(https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...18#post5618218)
Oh, and thanks for the name calling, too.

As stated previously, I didn't need to go over there to know you favored small FCs, I already have that information from the lodestone.

Then what did you go over there for???
That's the point. You already have your answers, you did not need to go to them.
It just looks like you were not interested in their answers, just to use them for your argument.
And that's the point that I'm in disagreement with, Big_Bap.

As for the undersized FC deletion, I've already stated that deleting JP FCs won't increase US/EU housing.
There is no post about under-sized FC being a problem in JP.
It's just not an issue either way at the moment because the JP servers are not as stressed with over-population at the moment.
You shouldn't drag JP into this.

[Big_Bap]

What title was more appropriate? If you think an ambiguous title like "A question from North American player" would grab people's attention to look in the thread, then what can I say?

Apologies for using a vague title I guess? It sure was accurate though!

And also, do you not agree that a question phrased like "Why does it seem like JP players favor small FCs?" will not give you any response like "Yes, we disagree with <someone>" or "Yup, I'm all for deleting small FCs".
They will just explain why they like small FCs and ask why an EN player is bringing this topic to them.
But you phrased it so that it looks like the JP players all agreed with you and disagreed with this someone.
(https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...89#post5617889)

I disagree. People here will read a thread and share whatever feelings they have about a subject. I'm sorry if that is not how it's done on your side of the forums. If you want a good example, go over to the general section and look for threads about adding female Hrothgars or male Vieras. And yes, the comments, minus yours to a certain degree, all disagree with the stance of Almagnus.

And even phrased it as if I took sides with you.
(https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...18#post5618218)
Oh, and thanks for the name calling, too.

I asked you why you claimed to be neutral when you have stated that you disagree with deleting small FCs. I am very aware that things might be lost in the translation, but you have refused to clarify (if there is something to clarify that is). Also, you are a cat boi... it's not an insult.

Then what did you go over there for???
That's the point. You already have your answers, you did not need to go to them.
It just looks like you were not interested in their answers, just to use them for your argument.
And that's the point that I'm in disagreement with, Big_Bap.

I know you prefer small FCs, I didn't know exactly why. As it turns out, it is for the same reasons why some NA or EU players also prefer smaller FCs.

I have replied to every comment. How can you say I am not interested? This is getting quite repetitive, but where have I used any of those replies to support an argument?

As for the undersized FC deletion, I've already stated that deleting JP FCs won't increase US/EU housing.
There is no post about under-sized FC being a problem in JP.

You have stated that you don't support deleting JP FCs. Was the nuance lost in the translation? Have you forgotten about that last part? You tell me!

It's just not an issue either way at the moment because the JP servers are not as stressed with over-population at the moment.
You shouldn't drag JP into this.

Thank you for saying the same thing I've said at the beginning of this thread. Also thank you for burying Almagnus as they chose to drag the Japanese players into this.

Like I have been saying for a long time, the shell FCs need to be dealt with because they are exacerbating the housing problem. Of all the servers, Chocobo is the poster child for this problem with 891 of the 2613 FC houses belonging to a shell FC.

Why don't you go and ask the JP players why they are playing the way they are? It's really funny how you are projecting your own definition of acceptability on a group of players you don't even interact with.

You say "Shell FCs are a bigger problem than we think...".

First off, who's "we"?

You?
The players who post on this forum?
If so, why do you include Japanese players who don't even write in this section? I can't help but notice you made no effort in asking them why they favor smaller FCs. Or better yet, find me extensive posts from Japanese players who show as much disdain for small FCs as you do. The very reason why you can filter servers by Data Center or Region is to provide fair comparisons. You chose to bundle everything together to make it seem like this is a bigger problem than it actually is, when it's hardly a problem in the first place.

[xxSouxx]

I'm neutral in whatever you guys discuss here because it's not an issue for me.
The stress level is different and JP is not facing this problem.

"Also thank you for burying Almagnus as they chose to drag the Japanese players into this. "

Come again? You are the one who created a thread in the JP forum and tried to use it to prove your point.
Honestly, Almagnus1 can say all s/he wants, as it doesn't affect JP server at the moment.
If/when the devs take interest in such a drastic remedy, you can be assured that JP forum will come alive with protest.

[Big_Bap]

I'm neutral in whatever you guys discuss here because it's not an issue for me.
The stress level is different and JP is not facing this problem.

"Also thank you for burying Almagnus as they chose to drag the Japanese players into this. "

Come again? You are the one who created a thread in the JP forum and tried to use it to prove your point.
Honestly, Almagnus1 can say all s/he wants, as it doesn't affect JP server at the moment.
If/when the devs take interest in such a drastic remedy, you can be assured that JP forum will come alive with protest.

Yes, thanks again for adding more dirt on top of their grave!

The overwhelming majority of players in this thread do not support deleting Free Companies and I'm sure they are all happy to hear that you are confident enough to say that the Japanese players would also strongly disagree with that idea.

That being said, you are failing for the third time to point out how I have used any kind of information in that Japanese thread to support an argument. Can you show me where I have quoted one of the Japanese players until you started posting in this thread

Thanks again for the frag!


///

In case you missed it due to the late edit:

Like I have been saying for a long time, the shell FCs need to be dealt with because they are exacerbating the housing problem. Of all the servers, Chocobo is the poster child for this problem with 891 of the 2613 FC houses belonging to a shell FC.

Why don't you go and ask the JP players why they are playing the way they are? It's really funny how you are projecting your own definition of acceptability on a group of players you don't even interact with.

You say "Shell FCs are a bigger problem than we think...".

First off, who's "we"?

You?
The players who post on this forum?
If so, why do you include Japanese players who don't even write in this section? I can't help but notice you made no effort in asking them why they favor smaller FCs. Or better yet, find me extensive posts from Japanese players who show as much disdain for small FCs as you do. The very reason why you can filter servers by Data Center or Region is to provide fair comparisons. You chose to bundle everything together to make it seem like this is a bigger problem than it actually is, when it's hardly a problem in the first place.

[xxSouxx]

I gave you a link to your quote and you are turning a blind eye. Sigh...
(You have also not answered my question, either.)

And also, do you not agree that a question phrased like "Why does it seem like JP players favor small FCs?" will not give you any response like "Yes, we disagree with <someone>" or "Yup, I'm all for deleting small FCs".
They will just explain why they like small FCs and ask why an EN player is bringing this topic to them.
But you phrased it so that it looks like the JP players all agreed with you and disagreed with this someone.
(https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...89#post5617889)

Which is this:

I asked on the JP forums why they like smaller FCs that this lunatic would define as "shell" FCs and what they think about his "suggestion" to delete them. Nobody agrees with him LOL https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-北米のプレイヤーからの質問

The thread you opened was for discussing why JP favored small FCs, not about discussing this "someone"'s plan.
It was open less than a day with only 3 page input, 3 pages until someone finally figured out what the point you were trying to make, and you take that as some kind of proof for your argument.
It's not an honest way to have an argument with someone.

Can't you understand that end does not justify the means?
And that's the point I'm making.

Anyway, that's all from me.
For me, you Big_Bap and Almagnus1 is going about this at the same level.
Have fun.

[Big_Bap]

You have also not answered my question, either:

And also, do you not agree that a question phrased like "Why does it seem like JP players favor small FCs?" will not give you any response like "Yes, we disagree with <someone>" or "Yup, I'm all for deleting small FCs".
They will just explain why they like small FCs and ask why an EN player is bringing this topic to them.
But you phrased it so that it looks like the JP players all agreed with you and disagreed with this someone.
(https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...89#post5617889)

I answered it here:

I disagree. People here will read a thread and share whatever feelings they have about a subject. I'm sorry if that is not how it's done on your side of the forums. If you want a good example, go over to the general section and look for threads about adding female Hrothgars or male Vieras. And yes, the comments, minus yours to a certain degree, all disagree with the stance of Almagnus.

///

The thread you opened was for discussing why JP favored small FCs, not about discussing this "someone"'s plan.
It was open less than a day with only 3 page input, 3 pages until someone finally figured out what the point you were trying to make, and you take that as some kind of proof for your argument.
It's not an honest way to have an argument with someone.

Sorry if that was lost in the translation, but I talked about it in my first post:

フォーラムの英語セクションの一部のプレーヤーは、家を持っているフリーカンパニーが4人のメンバーを下回った場合、永久に削除されるべきであると信じています。

Some players in the English section of the forum believe that if a free company that owns a home falls below four members, it should be permanently removed.

And in case you missed it, I also shared a link on my 2nd post:

お返事ありがとうございます！

あなたのブラウザが翻訳をサポートしている場合、またはあなたが英語を読むことができる場合、これは議論です。

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...think.../page1

Regarding the link I shared on the English forums, I don't see how disingenuous it is to share a link to another thread (where other players can translate all the content) while pointing out that nobody has said anything negative about small FCs. In fact nobody has said anything negative 2 days later...

Can't you understand that end does not justify the means?
And that's the point I'm making.

Anyway, that's all from me.
For me, you Big_Bap and Almagnus1 is going about this at the same level.
Have fun.

Thanks for your input! I'm glad the English and Japanese community dislike the idea of deleting Free Companies!

[Almagnus1]

I find it amusing that when you look at https://www.xivhousing.com/free-company-housing-2021 , Chocobo is the server that has the most FC housing (and also stays #1 depending on how you slice the data). The exact server being called out is completely arbitrary, and had there been a different one (be it a EU or NA server), I still would have called it out as that's just pointing to whatever was the lead server.

Big_Bap is just mad that I'm using their data, and that's all this "AlMaGnUs1 HaTeS jApAnEsE pLaYeRs" stupidity boils down to.

[Nepentha]

Big_Bap: Presents data to show how things really are on various servers. Discusses the issue on JP forums to get their opinion.
Almagnus1: no u

I mean. Really. That's the debate going on here.