Pronouns???

[Iscah]

It would be quite easy. You are overcomplicating it. Presumably there is a placeholder token in all lines of dialog where the WoL's personal pronouns appear. Presumably the game replaces the placeholder in all dialog occurrences with the corresponding pronoun via a conditional that calls the function that returns the character's sex. These are reasonable presumptions that any competent programmer would make.

You're presuming wrong. It is coded into each individual line of script to insert the correct snippet of script. It's not cross-checking a table elsewhere.

I don't think it's poor programming but rather the only way to manage complex switches of dialogue depending on gender, like Thancred trying to flirt with you if you're female but a less remarkable compliment if male, or including any number of one-time-only comments based on character gender or race.

I don't have a source on hand but others have posted the base coded script before. It's probably in the previous discussion linked on the first page of this thread.

[Tharia]

It would be quite easy. You are overcomplicating it. Presumably there is a placeholder token in all lines of dialog where the WoL's personal pronouns appear. Presumably the game replaces the placeholder in all dialog occurrences with the corresponding pronoun via a conditional that calls the function that returns the character's sex. These are reasonable presumptions that any competent programmer would make.

I don't care how bad the game's code base is; there's no way it would take more than twenty minutes to add a gender selector to character creation, add the gender field to the character data, and modify the function that returns the character's sex during dialog pronoun replacement to return the character's gender instead. Then another twenty minutes to add a quick validation into the character loader that silently fixes any existing character data that doesn't have a gender selected to default to the gender matching the character's sex. Hardly any time at all for each localization team to provide add the word for "gender" into the localization dictionary. Maybe a little bit more time to code a dialog box that gives all existing characters the opportunity to set their gender on the first load after the feature is added.

As far as technical difficulty is concerned, this is not a difficult ask, by any means.

Not all lsnguages are as simple as english, considering the ppronoun it changes in some language quite the sentence structure. Not worth the programming cost.

[Avatre]

Not all lsnguages are as simple as english, considering the ppronoun it changes in some language quite the sentence structure. Not worth the programming cost.

English, simple?

Their, they're, there.

Two, to, too.

Won and one.

Read and read.

And those are just the super common ones that people mess up

[Feronar]

Please no.

Edit- To be a little less rude about it, please know that it would NOT be an easy thing to implement. The dev team would then have to go through 10+ years of dialogue in this game and either tie it to w.e pronoun you made on your character. And that would be after theres a clear consensus of how many genders there are and how to refer to them in every instance of that dialogue. Then of course there's those who are fluid or changing, so you'd have to have an option to change that pronoun and the game reflect that every switch.

All that's before taking into account that there are multiple languages, each with its own rules on pronouns.

The easier answer would be just to make every instance of dialogue completely gender neutral... but then you'd still have to through 10+ years of dialogue to get that done.

NO, absolutely not. They tried that in WoW Shadowlands. Hearing my character (male) referred to as "they" was unbearably cringey, and ruined what would have otherwise been epic moments.

[SannaR]

I might be a clueless cis female, but isn't part of being transgendered is to be seen as the gender they transitioned to? At least that's what a lot of stories of transgendered people say. That they want to be seen as passing as much as possible of the gender they identify with. So, I'm a little confused. Also the majority of the time the WoL is either addressed by their first or last name. If not their race. It's very rare for them to use him/her unless the npc speaking isn't one to call you Warrior of Light/Darkness while also not being close enough to use part of the character's name.

[HollyJollyPaca]

I might be a clueless cis female, but isn't part of being transgendered is to be seen as the gender they transitioned to? At least that's what a lot of stories of transgendered people say. That they want to be seen as passing as much as possible of the gender they identify with. So, I'm a little confused. Also the majority of the time the WoL is either addressed by their first or last name. If not their race. It's very rare for them to use him/her unless the npc speaking isn't one to call you Warrior of Light/Darkness while also not being close enough to use part of the character's name.

Don't worry you're good!! But presentation is a big part of being transgender/gender fluid. So in my friend's case, they're trans BUT they're still quite fem in terms of physical appearance. So they wanted to have that in their character. But they couldn't get exactly what they looked for unless they had a lady Lala's face. They got the presentation they wanted from the female physical model but it didn't satisfy them gender wise. Another example could be somebody wanting to play an Au Ra and wanting to play as a girl but...well, we know how the sexual dimorphism is there haha!

[SannaR]

Don't worry you're good!! But presentation is a big part of being transgender/gender fluid. So in my friend's case, they're trans BUT they're still quite fem in terms of physical appearance. So they wanted to have that in their character. But they couldn't get exactly what they looked for unless they had a lady Lala's face. They got the presentation they wanted from the female physical model but it didn't satisfy them gender wise. Another example could be somebody wanting to play an Au Ra and wanting to play as a girl but...well, we know how the sexual dimorphism is there haha!

Ahh I see. That still seems a bit odd though. I just don't remember a male lalafell face type along with hair that couldn't be made to look feminine. I mean heck when I first met Pippin I thought they were a female. I guess it would have to come down with how flexible said friend is when it comes to initial appearances. I think only male Roe and Hrothgar would be no goes as even with their more youthful face choices it would be hard to make them look more feminine. They might have to get their hands on some of the more feminine hairstyles, but I'm sure it could be done as only npcs would know their gender if they chose Lalafell. Since most players just going by looks wouldn't know if they were a guy or not as unless they were in swim wear, topless, wearing some gear that looked different based on gender none would know.

[Rinhi]

I might be a clueless cis female, but isn't part of being transgendered is to be seen as the gender they transitioned to? At least that's what a lot of stories of transgendered people say. That they want to be seen as passing as much as possible of the gender they identify with.

this tbh, I'd like to hear an explanation regarding this

[HollyJollyPaca]

this tbh, I'd like to hear an explanation regarding this

I've explained it before but presentation is so key to people. Some people want to transition and adhere to societal presentation of their gender. Others aren't worried about that and are comfortable with looking more traditionally "femme" or "masc". It's why you see terms like Trans Femme and others. Honestly it's not just a trans thing but an everybody thing which is why I think pronouns would be a great option. We all present ourselves differently! Some women are more masculine, some guys are more femme, and yet they still identify as Cis. It's just one big spectrum so who needs societal gender norms~

Edit to add examples cause I'm always afraid I'm not coming across correctly BUT, I have trans friends who present themselves as more masculine, who want beards and more chiseled looks. And then I have trans friends (like the one I mentioned) who don't want to look that way and want to have the softer features. They still use he/him pronouns but that traditional male appearance isn't something they aim for, just certain anatomy and pronoun usage. C:

[Krotoan]

This was already discussed: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...29600-Pronouns

interesting read.

Main point brought up more than once, it would require quite a bit of extra work to rewrite old interactions and possibly recode a fundamental system in multiple languages. It would not be a simple thing.