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  1. #51
    Player
    Izsha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    966
    Character
    Izsha Azel
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    I'm always torn on the aoe situation. On the 1 hand i like the interconnected synergy in DRKs aoe. On the other hand, aoe redundancy is a great place to cull buttons and make space for interesting abilities. Trait flash into crescent. Same with AD. Etc.

    While the aoe systems can move more in Drks direction for engaging gameplay, it comes at the opportunity cost of new functions and fleshing out other systems with new tools.

    I think I lean towards streamlining aoes into 1 or 2 actions because it's really just dungeon spam. But I'm biased as someone who rarely does dungeons anymore, but raids every week. Drks aoe kit might as well not exist when 95% of my time is spent single targeting stuff and jobs like pld survive just fine without engaging aoe.

    I think my reluctance is because drk aoe is a really good thing and I dont want to destroy good things. But on principle, I dont think we should blow half our button budget on aoes when (in theory) we could have engaging systems for more general tasks instead.

    Cull the aoe and rebuild them as engaging systems in the primary actions we will all use every day in ST applications, party utility, and defensive systems.
    (0)
    Last edited by Izsha; 03-21-2019 at 01:46 AM.

  2. #52
    Player
    Jandor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    3,479
    Character
    Tal Young
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Izsha View Post
    I'm always torn on the aoe situation. On the 1 hand i like the interconnected synergy in DRKs aoe. On the other hand, aoe redundancy is a great place to cull buttons and make space for interesting abilities. Trait flash into crescent. Same with AD. Etc.

    While the aoe systems can move more in Drks direction for engaging gameplay, it comes at the opportunity cost of new functions and fleshing out other systems with new tools.
    Could always make more existing single target skills work as AoEs too.

    Savage Blade, Rage of Halone and Shield Swipe as conal AoE's for example.
    (0)
    Last edited by Jandor; 03-21-2019 at 06:11 PM.

  3. #53
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,870
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandor View Post
    Could always make more existing single target skills work as AoEs too.

    Savage Blade, Rage of Halone and Shield Swipe as conal AoE's for example.
    That'd be my preference. If it looks like it'd cleave multiple enemies, it ought to.
    (0)

  4. #54
    Player
    Izsha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    966
    Character
    Izsha Azel
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    I'm down with that.
    (1)

  5. #55
    Player
    Katie_Kitty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Posts
    952
    Character
    Princess Whiskers
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Total eclipse is trash. It's not fun to use at all. It feels slow and clunky and just bad. Get rid of it. Get rid of flash as well.

    Take circle of scorn, give it the blind effect, and put it on the GCD instead so it's spammable. Maybe give PLD a second AoE that combos with CoS for extra damage.

    Problem solved.
    (0)

  6. #56
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,870
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty View Post
    Total eclipse is trash. It's not fun to use at all. It feels slow and clunky and just bad. Get rid of it. Get rid of flash as well.

    Take circle of scorn, give it the blind effect, and put it on the GCD instead so it's spammable. Maybe give PLD a second AoE that combos with CoS for extra damage.

    Problem solved.
    Imo, Circle of Scorn's animation would be badly inferior to TE's as a spam. I don't think my ears would enjoy dealing with that crash every 2.2-2.5 seconds, either. A problem solved for you may well be a problem worsened for others when it comes down to something so subjective.
    (2)

  7. #57
    Player
    Kalise's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    1,784
    Character
    Kalise Relanah
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty View Post
    Total eclipse is trash. It's not fun to use at all. It feels slow and clunky and just bad. Get rid of it. Get rid of flash as well.

    Take circle of scorn, give it the blind effect, and put it on the GCD instead so it's spammable. Maybe give PLD a second AoE that combos with CoS for extra damage.

    Problem solved.
    You realize making Circle of Scorn a GCD will make it feel exactly as "Slow and clunky" as Total Eclipse right?

    Since TE only feels "Slow and clunky" because it is literally just spending every GCD available on it and if you don't have much SkS (Which is likely because stat priorities doesn't have SkS very high for PLD as it's less effective than Crit/DH) it will thus be pretty slow.

    If anything CoS as a GCD would feel WORSE than TE. Since not only would you no longer have an oGCD AoE skill to use alongside it, but it also means you'd be spamming a DoT skill and thus constantly clipping the DoT effect.
    (1)

  8. #58
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,870
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nolagamer View Post
    Just borrow WoW's paladin consecration ability. AoE attack with enmity.
    Seems like we kind of have that already with CoS, if it simply left the ring of swords in the ground and periodically damaged upon area-entry any enemies not already afflicted by CoS's DoT.

    The problem is you want to be able to have burst threat during the gather more so than during the AoE mow-down itself, more often than not, and thus anything stationary tends to go to waste.

    ...Reminds me of the days when a tank would stop his pull, so I'd drop Flaming Arrow, only for him to take off again a couple GCDs afterwards...
    (0)

  9. #59
    Player
    Khalithar's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    2,555
    Character
    Khalith Mateo
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Shurrikhan View Post
    Seems like we kind of have that already with CoS, if it simply left the ring of swords in the ground and periodically damaged upon area-entry any enemies not already afflicted by CoS's DoT.
    I haven't played WoW in a while so bear with me, but I think by making it like consecrate they're asking for it to have the same duration/cooldown. If I remember my WoW abilities correctly, consecration had something like a 12 second duration and a 10 second cooldown. It was part of your aoe rotation to always hit it on cooldown as it would provide great threat and damage with 100% uptime.
    (0)

  10. #60
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,870
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Khalithar View Post
    I haven't played WoW in a while so bear with me, but I think by making it like consecrate they're asking for it to have the same duration/cooldown. If I remember my WoW abilities correctly, consecration had something like a 12 second duration and a 10 second cooldown. It was part of your aoe rotation to always hit it on cooldown as it would provide great threat and damage with 100% uptime.
    Depending on the expansion, it would have worked similarly to that, yes, but at least in the times I've played between WotLK and now, it was never an on-cooldown CD, and far better for it. It tended to have a period of overlap, wherein duration exceeded cooldown, as to make it less annoying to maintain; you just had to avoid using it too early, before you could hold your position. Now, though, it's made mandatory by its augmenting so many different skills that the overlap is practically meaningless...
    (0)

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