[dev1033] Ideas for a Two-Tier Class System: Jobs on Top of Weapon Specializations

[Gath]

Thanks for adding to the discussion and I think these are some awesome questions.

Personally, this is how I can see this possibly being implemented.

1)1H-Axes shouldn't be essentially different from 2H-Axes, in my mind they should all fall under some general weapon type which would be AXE. Since AXE=MRD, equipping a 1H Axe would make you a MRD. If they really wanted to differentiate more between the two they could make some abilities require 1H, others require 2H, and others that could be used by both. (Although abilities that would require 1H or 2H I think should be a very small subset of the general AXE skills that you learn).

2)Abilities that MAKE you a Beastmaster like charm, gauge, reward, etc. should be learned through your title.

So using the more visual rank system we were talking about it could look something like this:

Beastmaster - Recruit learns Charm & Wide Scan
Beastmaster - Initiate learns Gauge & Vermin Killer
Beastmaster - Novice learns Reward & Resist Slow

Obviously I just pulled these abilities/traits from FFXI, but it gives you a sense of how it can be learned, they might rename/rework abilities to fit this game better.

Another thing I think is this points to another reason why we need this type of system because as the system stand now in FFXIV (armory system by itself) how are you even going to implement PET classes? Make a "Pet-Master" weapon? Seems too specific to me to have a weapon like that and then also need to do the same thing for a summoner. Having these kind of abilities being learned through the Title/Job system makes it connect a lot smoother.

I agree with you almost 100%, the title system makes it much easier to implement and makes people see the similarities with classes vs. titles. On another note of this, maybe I skipped over it and I don't think I did. What if you don't have the weapon specialist that compliments the title you want to play? Do you practically just level up the specialist itself at the same time while you're leveling your title rank?

Like this; You get both SP and points. I.E AXE (MRD) > BST. Do you get both the SP for MRD and the points for the title? or do you need to level MRD first and then get the title? What about a level restriction to people who are new? They need to level a class first in all fairness, due tot hte fact that it would help create more dynamic into getting a title and getting that title to Master. or would there be a level 30-40 requirement to unlock the chance to actually start progressing through said title?

[OmegaNovaios]

Wow I really like this idea. Maybe even more than:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...sic-FF-Classes

So I could do something like Red Mage/Gladiator to be like a RDM in FFXI and the same for BLU. I really like this idea and it seems really easy to implement.

[Duelle]

So I could do something like Red Mage/Gladiator to be like a RDM in FFXI and the same for BLU. I really like this idea and it seems really easy to implement.

What worries me about this is whether there will be some actual build up to the multiple roles a hybrid can take up. Red Mage in particular was screwed last time (FFXI) because the job was basically used only for support.

The proposed idea works well with one-role classes in a way, but seems tricky when applying it to hybrids.

[Akumu]

What worries me about this is whether there will be some actual build up to the multiple roles a hybrid can take up. Red Mage in particular was screwed last time (FFXI) because the job was basically used only for support.

The proposed idea works well with one-role classes in a way, but seems tricky when applying it to hybrids.

For the hybrids I imagine the class you "sub" would make you more efficient enough to have a role. Since Hybrids are usually just the "Jack of all trades" type job. I would imagine a RDM/GLA would be better with physical attacks compared to a RDM/CON. There is also the class Fencer but no info on that yet.

Carpe probably could explain it better. This is just a small summary of how I see it.

[Anathiel]

What worries me about this is whether there will be some actual build up to the multiple roles a hybrid can take up. Red Mage in particular was screwed last time (FFXI) because the job was basically used only for support.

The proposed idea works well with one-role classes in a way, but seems tricky when applying it to hybrids.

If I understood carpe's op correctly really all the title system gives you are bonuses and abilities that augment your current equipped weapon specialization. So if you were a rdm/glad, you'd be a sword user with across the board spells chosen from other classes you leveled that would be amplified with red mage abilities whether they be passive or aactive.

[Cairdeas]

If I understood carpe's op correctly really all the title system gives you are bonuses and abilities that augment your current equipped weapon specialization. So if you were a rdm/glad, you'd be a sword user with across the board spells chosen from other classes you leveled that would be amplified with red mage abilities whether they be passive or aactive.

Correct. A RedMage/Gladiator would be somewhat proficient in Elemental Casting, Healing, and Buffing/Debuffing, but would be prime for Elemental Weapon Skills. Dealing more damage with them then a normal Gladiator would for instance.

While a Redmage/Conjurer would be more proficient at dealing direct damage elemental attacks and heals, and Redmage/Thaumaturge would be better at using Damage over Time elementals and heals.

[Malakhim]

See Cairdeas' last post and that might be the one you're talking about.

[Cairdeas]

I think they should be independently leveled.
One getting SP and the other getting JP.
Also no single weapon class should be specialized to a single Title. So you could raise Beastmaster while training Archer Weapon Class and use your pet to hold a monster while you shot it at range.

[Gath]

I think they should be independently leveled.
One getting SP and the other getting JP.
Also no single weapon class should be specialized to a single Title. So you could raise Beastmaster while training Archer Weapon Class and use your pet to hold a monster while you shot it at range.

That has the potential to cause a balance issue. It will end up being everybody being with their title, and using a different class which is not "optimal" to that title at all together, and it will end up everybody being the same again. Like Having SMN have it's summons and using all archer abilities. If you say there is an optimal weapon for each title, then that throws out the whole customization with titles and classes that was theorized in the OP.

[Cairdeas]

That has the potential to cause a balance issue. It will end up being everybody being with their title, and using a different class which is not "optimal" to that title at all together, and it will end up everybody being the same again. Like Having SMN have it's summons and using all archer abilities. If you say there is an optimal weapon for each title, then that throws out the whole customization with titles and classes that was theorized in the OP.

I was refering mainly to limiting certain weapons to certain titles. Instead If your skill favors your Job Title you get to use it at 100% effectiveness if your using it out of favor you can only use it at 50%.