Hunt Community vs Hunt Snipers

[Paladinleeds]

And resetting their hunt once or twice.

If I remember the rules correctly this is treated as griefing and thus explains why you were banned.

[Archwolf]

If I remember the rules correctly this is treated as griefing and thus explains why you were banned.

You are correct. I broke the rules by resetting their hunt, and allowing more people to make it to the kill. I don't feel sorry for that.
My real problem is that these players are actively griefing the entire community of people who are also interested in ARR S ranks and other hunts, and nothing is done about them. Their behavior is ugly and detrimental to the common good, whereas my actions were taken in an effort to change the behavior of one or two players (yes, I 'griefed' them). I don't feel sorry for that either.

[Paladinleeds]

snip

Then frankly, I agree with the ban. Your lack of remorse is showing, and that you'd show a flagrant disregard for the rules again. If you're that concerned about this "griefing" (of which outside of resetting the hunt pull, SE sees no griefing possible), get SE to change the rules. Don't just go vigilante because that will get you banned again. I actually have put forward suggestions for improving older hunts (such as ARR S Ranks), and actively call them out when I see them. But at the end of the day, SE sees that you're griefing and they aren't. Them's the rules unfortunately. You just gotta deal with it or campaign for change.

[Unease_Lemming]

Then frankly, I agree with the ban. Your lack of remorse is showing, and that you'd show a flagrant disregard for the rules again. If you're that concerned about this "griefing" (of which outside of resetting the hunt pull, SE sees no griefing possible), get SE to change the rules. Don't just go vigilante because that will get you banned again. I actually have put forward suggestions for improving older hunts (such as ARR S Ranks), and actively call them out when I see them. But at the end of the day, SE sees that you're griefing and they aren't. Them's the rules unfortunately. You just gotta deal with it or campaign for change.

We have been trying to get this acknowledged, see the two topics that were linked up there.

Everyone outside of Behemoth does not care at all though, since everyone just assumes we're lazy whiners. SE does not care either from the looks of it.

It's terrible that the people doing this have been getting away with it for months now. The hands of the rest of us are tied thanks to the "rules", and our cries for help are being ignored. It's no wonder people are getting more and more desperate. Hunts on Behemoth are a sad affair, and nobody, including the devs, care at all. Feels horrible.

[Alien_Gamer]

Everyone outside of Behemoth does not care at all though, since everyone just assumes we're lazy whiners. SE does not care either from the looks of it.

I don't believe this is an accurate statement. Everyone seems to recognize that people who pull quickly are irritating, but most also realize that SE designed it this way so those players aren't actually breaking any rules. Unfortunately for Behemoth, your massive population compounds the issue; larger populations means more fast pulls, solo kills, and more people that don't get to make it. I'd be interested if the percentage of selfish vs community oriented hunters is any different on Behemoth compared to other worlds.

In regards to the rules governing hunts...I think most of the community would accept a revision of the rules but I don't know if a revision is possible. Lets say SE decided to change the rules, what do they change them to and how do they try to enforce it? There is no rule that could be programmed that can't be easily avoided, or worse, voided completely through happenstance. For example, there was once a proposal that a hunt is invulnerable for the first X minutes after spawn or for the first X minutes after being seen. So the S Rank spawns, a random botanist sees it, or someone who doesn't hunt sees it while they run past on chocobo, and kicks off the timer. Timer expires and then it gets seen by hunters...same result as things are now without the rule. Having an invuln buff that lasts until X minutes after the first attack just means things take longer for the legit hunters and doesn't actually stop the selfish people because if they don't call it out, the likelyhood of another hunter seeing it and calling it out is rather minimal.

Its not enough to say the rule has to change, it has to change to something effective and can be applied universally through programming. Thats a difficult proposition.

[Paladinleeds]

Its not enough to say the rule has to change, it has to change to something effective and can be applied universally through programming. Thats a difficult proposition.

I'm gonna attempt to put forward 2 suggestions that will turn the hunt system on its head, to open up some discussion of improvements.
1) Convert all B/A/S rank hunts to a special "Hunt Rush" trial area. You'd queue for it like any other duty, and it'd work a bit like Aquapolis, in that if ya wipe, you're thrown out and locked out from rewards for say, a day. Each successfully killed hunt will reward seals.
2) Keep the hunts as they are but instance them per party (that will have an opening window, a bit like ephem nodes, during which time anyone can party up and attempt to access it). You'll only get credit for your 1st kill of that hunt.

[Spiroglyph]

I'm gonna attempt to put forward 2 suggestions that will turn the hunt system on its head, to open up some discussion of improvements.
1) Convert all B/A/S rank hunts to a special "Hunt Rush" trial area. You'd queue for it like any other duty, and it'd work a bit like Aquapolis, in that if ya wipe, you're thrown out and locked out from rewards for say, a day. Each successfully killed hunt will reward seals.
2) Keep the hunts as they are but instance them per party (that will have an opening window, a bit like ephem nodes, during which time anyone can party up and attempt to access it). You'll only get credit for your 1st kill of that hunt.

I'd like for hunts to be turned into FATEs of sorts, with level sync and all. Would make it a hell of a lot more interesting, and not soloable. It'd still be competitive, as FATEs have a timer once engaged and people would still have to rush there to make it in time - just to add another suggestion to this thread (that's already been mentioned in other hunt-related threads).

As for OP - while I understand you did what you did with good intentions at heart, and while it annoys me personally when I see people selfishly doing hunts like those people from your server - shouting profanity, resetting hunts and following them around calling them out on their behaviour, when they weren't actually desrespecting any rules in place (unlike you), well. :/ I'm not surprised you were banned.

[Archwolf]

Then frankly, I agree with the ban. Your lack of remorse is showing, and that you'd show a flagrant disregard for the rules again......
You just gotta deal with it or campaign for change.

I certainly hope my lack of remorse is showing, that was kind of the intention. I don't feel I did anything wrong.

But you do make a very good point. I did break the rules and buck the system. Because the system is flawed and needs to be changed. Perhaps I should have tried to go about it in a more peaceful way. At the time, I was only trying to bring a stop to the selfish actions of one or two individuals. I wasn't trying to make a statement about change, but maybe I should have.

[Paladinleeds]

But you do make a very good point. I did break the rules and buck the system. Because the system is flawed and needs to be changed. Perhaps I should have tried to go about it in a more peaceful way. At the time, I was only trying to bring a stop to the selfish actions of one or two individuals. I wasn't trying to make a statement about change, but maybe I should have.

With regards to trying to get the change enacted, so long as you do it in ways that will stay within the rules (such as campaigning for change), then I'll support you and chime in too, with how I feel they could be improved. I think the hunts system needs revisions and needs improvements. That I won't deny. I just believe we should stick to the ways within the rules to try and get the change brought about, that's all. Thankfully Louisoix doesn't seem to have this problem, but I remember Odin used to have people who pulled quickly, which would rub people the wrong way.

We have been trying to get this acknowledged, see the two topics that were linked up there.

Everyone outside of Behemoth does not care at all though, since everyone just assumes we're lazy whiners. SE does not care either from the looks of it.

It's terrible that the people doing this have been getting away with it for months now. The hands of the rest of us are tied thanks to the "rules", and our cries for help are being ignored. It's no wonder people are getting more and more desperate. Hunts on Behemoth are a sad affair, and nobody, including the devs, care at all. Feels horrible.

I can certainly agree it's horrible for those just trying to get by. But, we can try and campaign for change, and while we do it, try to outsmart the group in ways that stay within the rules. So perhaps that means working together, keeping up to date with the clocks, etc. Outsmart and outmaneuvre. But don't resort to rulebreaking, that's all I'm saying.

[Vnolan]

Unfortunately for Behemoth, your massive population compounds the issue; larger populations means more fast pulls, solo kills, and more people that don't get to make it. I'd be interested if the percentage of selfish vs community oriented hunters is any different on Behemoth compared to other worlds.

Apparently it's only one or two people.

At the time, I was only trying to bring a stop to the selfish actions of one or two individuals.