Monk Macros with Proper Rotation!

[alsims2007]

What!?!? I just watched that entire video and its a comparison of him using his Sphairai Animus(http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/47e66a1e96a/) vs Glanzfaust(http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/c070572d9fc/) showing nothing more than the dps difference between both of them and not one thing said or mentioned on Macros......What are you talking about?

Skip ahead to 4:10 im the video. Also check your duplicate post in the dps section for my thoughts on the macros

[Kitfox]

snip

I'm not discrediting you because you might not be lvl60, nor do I want to get into an "internet fight." I'm simply stating your understanding of macros and rotational effectiveness is lacking. Look, veterans don't give you flak just to bully you, they do it because you're wrong about competitiveness and effectiveness of macros. This subject comes up every so often among new players who get overwhelmed by the number of abilities, which is why people are so quick to dismiss your video.

I watched your entire video before I commented though, I've also read your edited comment. When I talk about fractional timing on macros and abilities queuing, I don't mean what you call a "cast sequence" macro. I mean ability queueing. What that means is you can click on a GCD ability before your GCD is ready, and it will queue the ability and it goes off when your GCD is ready. You can try this yourself. Now try the same with a macro. It will not work.

What happens is that it will not trigger until your GCD has fully passed, it does not queue. Because it does not queue, you can only use your macro as fast as you can click it after your GCD is done. That means you lose whatever reaction time or clicking speed amount of time you have, everytime you use your macro. This is the non-queueing fractional loss.

Fractional loss is something you can actually work with if you really like spamming your macro buttons. Depending on your button mashing frequency, it might not actually be more than ~5% dps loss, but it will be a loss. Your greatest loss comes from triggering random buffs when you should be triggering a GCD. Every buff has a roughly 0.5-1 second animation time. If you trigger a buff instead of a GCD, you cut that much more into your GCD, which is a major loss. If you only have one single buff/oGCD in your macro and you keep spamming it so that it triggers between the GCDs, your dps loss will be minimized, but that also kind of defeats the purpose of your macro. When you have multiple oGCD abilities in the macro and they are all ready, you'll be clipping and triggering them without control and clipping into your GCDs, losing much more DPS than the fractional loss from the lack of macro queueing. You simply do not have enough control over your oGCDs if you use them in macros like this.

If you really wanted to, you could make a seperate macro for stacking all buffs, so that you only need to mash one button for all your oGCDs, that way you at least have the control when to pop them and how many. You should not, however, pair buffs and GCDs in the same macro for the reasons stated. Even a stacked buff macro is bad, because you have no control over the individual buffs and abilities, but it's really the only acceptable way to macro some of your abilities.

Video format is not my preferred argument form so I hope you can instead of accept this text form based on simple empirical logic. Try GCD queueing and using macros in the same manner. Pay attention to when your GCD abilities go off and when buffs cut into them. It's best if you can test and realize this yourself.

If you insist on video evidence, this is roughly how opener + rotation should look like, career mnks can nitpick if they want: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCu5I37GVMY
If you're confident you can do that with your macros without clipping GCDs and using an efficient order for your off-GCD abilities, then all the power to you.

If you want to compare yourself to others, I suggest looking into fflogs. (highly recommended)

[SmallHobbit]

Please show your parses since you claim you can be competitive with macros also you aren't 60.

i also think about is funny because monks rotation are not constant repeatble so your rotation need be variable so means it can be sometimes like:
(bootshine -> truestrike -> demo..) or sometimes is looks like (bootshine -> truestrike -> snap punch)
and
(dragonkick -> twin snakes -> demolish) or (dragonkick -> twin snakes -> snap punch)

and between this skills are still used even more skills like elixir field -> ToD and many more... how you just wanna macro this?
can you please show me a video where you able to kill any savage stone sky sea dummy with macros?

may this would change my mind when you show me a video how you kill the a12s dummy with macros :3

regards hobbit

[TheRealMadruck]

i also think about is funny because monks rotation are not constant repeatble so your rotation need be variable so means it can be sometimes like:
(bootshine -> truestrike -> demo..) or sometimes is looks like (bootshine -> truestrike -> snap punch)
and
(dragonkick -> twin snakes -> demolish) or (dragonkick -> twin snakes -> snap punch)

and between this skills are still used even more skills like elixir field -> ToD and many more... how you just wanna macro this?
can you please show me a video where you able to kill any savage stone sky sea dummy with macros?

may this would change my mind when you show me a video how you will the a12s dummy with macros :3

regards hobbit

Hobbit, I created a video showing my Parse information. And you are right that the combos for Monk are not static like Dragoon and Ninja. But, you state that the only way to prove my Macros work at all(even for solo or casual content) is to go to one of the highest areas to test? I did not make my video or my post raiders only but for all players that do monk. I know I am getting alot of push back from my information but I have done test already on this as I stated in my second video!

[SmallHobbit]

even for solo or casual content

well yeah with this macros you should be able to do same dps as a casual dps do in expert roulette but ppl need also to understand that with the right rotation and own gameplay you will be able to get easy like +50% higher dps overall in a real fight!
because your buffs and dots are not perfectly clip and thats in raids are the diffrence between a good dps player or just a causal one.

regards hobbit

[TheRealMadruck]

well yeah with this macros you should be able to do same dps as a casual dps do in expert roulette but ppl need also to understand that with the right rotation and own gameplay you will be able to get easy like +50% higher dps overall in a real fight!
because your buffs and dots are not perfectly clip and thats in raids are the diffrence between a good dps player or just a causal one.

regards hobbit

Hobbit, I created this posting and my videos to show the system on how to macro correctly as a Monk....not to use all their abilities as Macros as you can see clearly that I dont in both my videos. Not once have I ever stated that all Monks should macro all their abilities. I only macro the last 2 parts of my combos and also a few buffs, thats all. As for your statement about learning the Job, your right they do need to learn. But isn't it possible for players to do both? Believe this or not but I have 2 accounts, I have 9 60's on my account until I was hacked. My information and facts is not based solely on the merit that my character is only lvl 54 as a Monk! I hope you believe that. As I stated, people can do Macros and also do high end content without them....I will never state otherwise but it does not negate my Macro or that it does work effectively for most content...even if its not for all!

[Caitlyn]

I watched both videos, but I have three things which actually bothers me:

1. Why are you creating/using macros for a level 54 Monk? Why 54? What about Level 60? Shouldnt you level your Monk to 60 first before making some (weird) macros/comparision videos? So, you have no experience in playing Monk at Level 60, rather having the right gear and stats for accurate parses. Its like having a Level 10 Conjurer making a Healer-Guide for Endgame-Content. Level your Monk to 60, get some gear and make parses on a Level 60 dummy with your macros. Then we can talk.


2. In 2.X the average DPS for a Level 50 Monk (ilvl 120+) should be around 500-600 DPS. Its easy to say, that a macro will only cause a DPS-loss of 2% when your parsed numbers are extremely low. But numbers are important for endgame/raids, which means you should have at least an ilvl of 210+ and a DPS of around of 2000+ (including Level 60). There is no place for speculations like "if you do xxxx amount of damage you lose x% by using a macro". In fact, macros are slower, more error-prone and makes you forget how to play your class properly. You cant deny that!


3. Why using macros at all? Featherfoot is quite useless and Steel Peek/Shoulder Tackle should be used very carefully (maybe some enemies must be stunned later?). Blood for Blood can be dangerous when getting hit by a strong raid-wide AoE. Your macros will let you lose control over your own skills. There is no need, especially you can reach any important skill without breaking your fingers. Actually you only need around 15 buttons, 7 or 8 of them permanently. Monk is pretty easy to play. Dont be lazy, play without macros, Rookie!

So lets say you have the best Monk player in FF14, can you promise me that that Monk will have a 100% uptime in dps with no mistakes while having to throttle lets say for kindness only 18 buttons(Monk has alot more based on buffs and X-Class Abilites) do you think that a player who uses no macros wont screw up his rotation by accidentally pressing the wrong button compared to a person who does macro and only has 12 buttons for discussion sake? Really?

The best Monks wont accidentally pressing the wrong button. In fact, its quite hard to press the wrong button as a Monk. You have combos with 3 skills each. You have your Off-GCD and CDs which you should be used since when they re ready. How can you "accidentally" press the wrong button? Thats even impossible for casual players ; )

So I can understand your feedback within this subject(btw I did use your information and added it to my video so thank you for that) but it still does not negate the facts of my data on the falsehood that using any Macros on Monk is a massive dps loss...its not true! You do lose dps, even if it is 5% on your example....that does not negate the fact that again according to the numbers since humans make mistakes that the dps and the overall numbers will pretty much end up the same since the Macro using player is less likely to make such errors.

First of all, your damage numbers are so low, that its impossible to see a difference between macro and no-macro. Second, its a mistake to use macros at all. And at last, your macros arent perfect either. They are causing more mistakes than any human can do by accident.

[TheRealMadruck]

SNIP

Caitlyn, you have alot of valid points. As you stated that you have watched my videos, you can clearly see at the end of my first video that the rotation I did with the macros was the ideal rotation based on several sources. To name some, http://www.ffxivinfo.com/guides/monk...iki/Monk_Guide If you watch the last part of my video it clearly shows the same rotation on those sites which it can be varied but for the most part it falls under the same method. And to answer your question in regards to using Featherfoot and other buffs, I created the first video representing the basics of how to Macro a Monk providing only templates. Every player is different as those Macros in my video is used solely for me doing casual content not endgame. But like I stated, every individual player can easily modify any of my macros to suite their own play style as I never said that it was the only way to set up macros as you heard me say in my 2nd video. If you use Macros, great....if you dont thats your choice as well but it is a built in system that does work in FF14 that SE and Yoshi P have set into the game, why not use it? Maybe not for Endgame, but they are useful in many other situations. Thank you for your feedback and take care.

[Caitlyn]

snip

Both Monk guides are outdated (ffxivinfo for example is listing a weapon called "Prototype Midan Metal Knuckles", which doesnt exist in the game) and doesnt include the way to play your Monk at Level 60 (which is quite different). You should better check some forum guides like this.

Sure, some macros are nice to have (like replacing skills on my WAR depending on his current stance). But please dont even try to bring new players to heavily use macros instead of learning to play the class right. Macros like this arent helpfull in any situation. But speaking of that, I want to know, when does your macro become helpfull. In which situation exactly?

1. What? I would love you to proof that the best player in the game especially a Monk will never make a mistake in a 15 minute fight every time 100%! I really would love data backing up that claim! We are all human and we all make mistake as you stated about my macros.

Even when he does 5-10 mistakes (he must be drunk then), you macros will cause even more.

2. The Damage may be low but math is math. If you would like to disprove my evidence, I kindly ask you to hop onto your Monk.....apply my macro using a source for data as you saw I did with my video and show contrary evidence. Until then Caitlynn, with all due respect....I have data to back up my information as everyone can clearly see, if you would like to make claims to the contrary, please do so as I welcome it as a chance to improve my information. Until then, everything else is conjecture and theory without prove.

I will do, when I find time to do so. But when I do, doing side-by-side, what if I can prove you, that the actual damage loss is higher than 2% or 5%?

[TheRealMadruck]

Both Monk guides are outdated (ffxivinfo for example is listing a weapon called "Prototype Midan Metal Knuckles", which doesnt exist in the game) and doesnt include the way to play your Monk at Level 60 (which is quite different). You should better check some forum guides like this.

Sure, some macros are nice to have (like replacing skills on my WAR depending on his current stance). But please dont even try to bring new players to heavily use macros instead of learning to play the class right. Macros like this arent helpfull in any situation. But speaking of that, I want to know, when does your macro become helpfull. In which situation exactly?

First, never once did I ever say or reference to New players watching my video that this is the only way to play Monk, so lets get that clear now. Second, there are plenty of occasions! Fate Farms, Soloing older content, Chocobo Leveling, Low Level Dungeons that are so easy(I.E. Sastasha), Palace of the Dead....do I really have to name off every piece of content in game that is not Endgame?

Lastly, to your reference of the links I sent...the link you posted is also out of date which most updates are from patch 3.2 with the other pages talking about scattered data. Second, playing any job in FF14 can not be taught, watched or seen to truly be good at it as in any MMO or life in general. But it does give others a start to learn from and form their own methods of playing. So the data maybe old as you claim, but it still has alot of validity to it as there is not 100% guide to any class or Job in any MMO ever made!