The number of bad players are rising!

[Deviant1]

Why is it that good players are always expected to teach bad players?

Would it really be better if the Bad players taught the others to be worse?

I could just see the titan ex party chat:
Baddie1> So when fighting Titan ex remember to avoid the land slide by running off of the side.
Baddie2> ok but what do we do When titan does Infernal Howl?
Baddie1> run to the tank, duh.
Baddie3> oh and remember that on gaols to stack.
baddie4> brb gotta grab some beer.
you> OMFG! why the #^&%$# is the <insert job of baddie5> not dodging?
baddie5> oh sorry was watching tv
*you rage quit the party*
baddie2> ugh what was his problem, we were all having fun... damn rage quiters!

[LexSunfire]

I agree with Deviant1. while running low level roulette, i had a tank tell a arc to put away their pet because it was distracting. luckily i was there to correct the misunderstanding tank. it only takes a few minutes to offer advice. sure, maybe you aren't expected to teach. but a few pointers instead of rage quitting can make this game a whole lot more enjoyable for everyone. if "good" players refuse to teach, there will only ever be more "bad" players.

[Jinko]

Why is it that good players are always expected to teach bad players?

Thing is getting better should be a natural progression, isn't the whole point to play a game to be good at it ?

[Foo01]

Thing is getting better should be a natural progression, isn't the whole point to play a game to be good at it ?

Actually if that is the goal, then it is more like a job/work/school. Not that it can NOT or shoul NOT happen, but it is secondary to having FUN.

FUN should be whole point. It should be fun even if people are NOT good at it, or if they are undergeared.

The problem is the elitist speedrunner are the bad players, because they are making the game less FUN for everyone else. NOT that I can NOT appreciate a run done quickly and smoothly, I like those too, but they are ruining the experience of other players by forcing to them skip cut scenes, forcing them to skip mobs, skip treasure chests, etc. etc. They even go as far as bailing in the middle of runs like this:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...arming-service.


They are abusing the duty finder. Extracting the maximum for their selfish gain at the expense of the game and community. That by definition is a bad player, because they are bad for the game and community as whole.

And those elitist jerks can NOT be bothered to teach or help other players, because they think everyone else is a leach or freeloader.

[MurakumoMillennium]

Actually if that is the goal, then it is more like a job/work/school. Not that it can NOT or shoul NOT happen, but it is secondary to having FUN.

FUN should be whole point. It should be fun even if people are NOT good at it, or if they are undergeared.

I for one would like to know some games where it's more fun to lose than to win. I bet there aren't very many of them.

The problem is the elitist speedrunner are the bad players, because they are making the game less FUN for everyone else. NOT that I can NOT appreciate a run done quickly and smoothly, I like those too, but they are ruining the experience of other players by forcing to them skip cut scenes, forcing them to skip mobs, skip treasure chests, etc. etc. They even go as far as bailing in the middle of runs

I'll agree with you on the people who stop mid dungeon and ask to be kicked or just go afk until they get kicked. But there's nothing wrong with being efficient in a dungeon via skipping trash, large pulls, skipping chests that you can go back to after, skipping CSs etc.

You say it's not fun to skip mobs, I say it's not fun to waste time killing things that don't yield exp or worthwhile drops. Who is right and who is wrong? (I'll give you a hint: it's neither).

And those elitist jerks can NOT be bothered to teach or help other players, because they think everyone else is a leach or freeloader.

There are acceptable levels of what should be taught in game. Most people are happy with explaining basic boss mechanics and such, as there's nothing in the game so difficult that it can't be explained within a couple of lines. It's when you have to teach level 50s very basic job actions that there's an issue.

Unfortunately, it's not that these "elitist jerks" aren't willing to help. Most people are willing to help. But you can only have somebody spit in your face so many times when you offer to help them that you just stop giving a @#$% and let them fail on their own.

You wouldn't believe how many times very basic advice (such as telling a DRG they should use heavy thrust, or that a BRD should use their DoTs) only to get the "DON'T TELL ME HOW 2 PLEY" or "IT WURKS 4 ME" responses. Don't stand in the fire! "HOW DARE YOU TELL ME WHAT TO DO?! DO YOU PAY FOR MY SUBSCRIPTION? REPORTED FOR HARASSMENT".

So yeah, no. You can find out what to do just like everyone else did before you.

TL: DR Those so called "elitists" are more than willing to help somebody if the person in question is willing to learn.

[Foo01]

I for one would like to know some games where it's more fun to lose than to win. I bet there aren't very many of them.

Actually there are plenty. All the competitive games, e-sport, PvP style games necessitate at winners and losers. The game can still be fun even if you lose the battle, or the race (in which case there are far more losers than winners, think Gran Turismo, or any other racing game.)

You say it's not fun to skip mobs, I say it's not fun to waste time killing things that don't yield exp or worthwhile drops. Who is right and who is wrong? (I'll give you a hint: it's neither).

You are deliberately misreading things. The default is to not skip, but the issue is people being FORCED to skip. That is the problem the speed runners are forcing other people to do things they do NOT want to and there is NOT even an attempt to negotiate a compromise because it take too much of their time.

Unfortunately, it's not that these "elitist jerks" aren't willing to help. Most people are willing to help. But you can only have somebody spit in your face so many times when you offer to help them that you just stop giving a @#$% and let them fail on their own.

You wouldn't believe how many times very basic advice (such as telling a DRG they should use heavy thrust, or that a BRD should use their DoTs) only to get the "DON'T TELL ME HOW 2 PLEY" or "IT WURKS 4 ME" responses. Don't stand in the fire! "HOW DARE YOU TELL ME WHAT TO DO?! DO YOU PAY FOR MY SUBSCRIPTION? REPORTED FOR HARASSMENT".

This complete strawman BS. Provided you are NOT trying to cuss at them when teaching them, most people will appreciate helpful suggestions, and not report harassment in response. But if you are forcing them to speed run with your veiled advice then you are harassing them and you are telling them how to play without negotiating with them as to how they would like to play.

[ispano]

Actually if that is the goal, then it is more like a job/work/school. Not that it can NOT or shoul NOT happen, but it is secondary to having FUN.

Again, stop confusing work with job(and school in this case). Work is involved with a job and/or school, but it's not the same thing.

Like it or not, this game requires you to work for what you want. Some don't wish to put in the amount of work needed, some do. Doesn't change that little fact though.

[Doo]

Actually if that is the goal, then it is more like a job/work/school. Not that it can NOT or shoul NOT happen, but it is secondary to having FUN.

I always thought when you get better, you have more fun. I.E It's more fun to be able to kill Titan ex than not. When you put in work say playing basketball and get good at it or any sports, you have more fun. Games tend to work that way.

[Foo01]

I always thought when you get better, you have more fun. I.E It's more fun to be able to kill Titan ex than not. When you put in work say playing basketball and get good at it or any sports, you have more fun. Games tend to work that way.

But this begs the question, is it fun because you are good at it? Or you are good at it because it is fun? Being good at something does NOT necessitate it being fun. And as much as I like to get better at things, fun or otherwise. Getting good at it should NOT change whether it was FUN to start with, because it should be intrinsically fun to start with.

Otherwise, you end with there is nothing to do and I am bored QQ threads. Well was it fun or not when you started? Why did getting over-geared and getting better make it less fun and? I was never any good at basketball, but it was fun, and with age I will only get more gimpy, and will it be less fun? And on the flip side, getting better at doing your 1040 forms for taxes, does NOT make taxes any more fun.

I can't tell you what it is fun, but I can certainly tell you one thing that is clearly NOT fun i.e. being told by an elitist speed runner jerk to skip the cut scene that I have never even seen before and then being left all alone trying to figure out what the heck has happened.

[C-croft]

I always thought when you get better, you have more fun. I.E It's more fun to be able to kill Titan ex than not. When you put in work say playing basketball and get good at it or any sports, you have more fun. Games tend to work that way.

Not all the time. Some of my favorite moments is from wiping in a group. This past weekend, got relic done for BLM. Last one left and healer stuck in Gaol with aggro. So I just kept plugging away. Probably wouldn't have made it anyway in time for next Gaol, but it was fun trying. It was even funnier because someone jinxed me by saying, watch him solo the rest of it. Then bam MB. poorly timed attempt to get behind him before table flip ended the fun. But holy crap was it fun.