Pugging HM Titan?

How many of you have found success with doing this? I (along with the rest of my whole server) have no choice but to pug this run. I don't think it's a hard fight perse, but DF with pugs is absolutely outrageous. Pugs have no patience to sit back and discuss strat, they just yolo in and get angry when a wipe occurs, then proceed to either...

A - Grief entire party till someone else leaves so they won't get the DF debuff
B - Leave Party, sending a whole 7 other people back into q wait times for a new group
C - Rage

What exactly are the people on my server supposed to do? We tried creating characters on higher populated servers but they were full. We were forced to roll on these new servers. Most of the others on my server have no gear nor are they attuned to Titan. We can't pay for runs because, well, people like me are the furthest on my server. So what now?

I think the actual fight is fine. I like the mechanics and it has engaging difficulty. What I do not like, however, is the DF part. There are so many things wrong with this. Of them all is the group composition. Note that on my server, we cannot custom q because again, we do not have enough people nor the right classes or people simply aren't attuned to the fight. In this case, we are forced to go in q'd with 2 tanks (which is a horrible setup for this fight)

The other is the lack of a votekick feature. This allow trolls and griefers to enter the DF HM and continuously wipe the raid until someone else leaves because they have no desire to get the DF debuff. Evidence is seen here. Now imagine dealing with this for days in a row with no end in sight. Next is the inability to find new members after one leaves. As I stated before, pugs will leave if as much as one person gets hit by an AoE. Making strat and synergizing near impossible to achieve. Gear Check is a factor but honestly the least of my problems.

This is frustrating and unfun playing the lottery. I know the fight in the back of my head. Doesn't mean the other 7 pugs know a thing. Over 100 times of pug wipes. It's not fun anymore and that is what a game should be providing: fun.

It is not impossible to gear up for titan using DF groups. DF has CM/AK/Ifrit HM on farm. You can also start an FC and start gearing up your guild. This is not hard, nor is it impossible. Some would even envy your for being able to complete at server firsts.

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Originally Posted by ntall1

It is not impossible to gear up for titan using DF groups. DF has CM/AK/Ifrit HM on farm. You can also start an FC and start gearing up your guild. This is not hard, nor is it impossible. Some would even envy your for being able to complete at server firsts.

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Gear is the least of my worries. My FC which only has roughly 5ish 50s cannot even fully q together due to people being on different stages. The whole premise of this thread has nothing to do with premade compositions. It's DF PUGGING. Again, I ask, who has done this through pugging and kindly enlighten one what steps you took doing so.

It's kinda screwed up that there is no vote to kick feature for things like what happened in that video... Instead of him just leaving and taking the 15 minute debuff, he decided to grief us for 25 minutes, wasting more of his time and ours. Also if someone d/cs while in your DF group it doesn't count them as gone, so the first one to fall on their sword and leave for the betterment of the group gets the 15 minute debuff :\.

Sounds like, based on your own gear, that you should not even be trying to pug Titan HM in the first place. Its not hard to level up, and its not hard to gear up for end game. It is very easy in this game. You are acticing like you have hit a wall because other ppl on your server level up to slowly.

Instead of puggin titan. Pug CM/AK until you are an average ilvl of 65 or better. Before that gear ilvl chances are that YOU are the issue in the DF pug group.

For a fight like Titan... I consider a DF group a 'learning' experience. For example, even if you watch all the videos in the world and memorize his ability string, nothing compares to actually doing it. After I researched the fight, I joined a DF group to 'practice'. Once I felt confident enough in my own ability to DPS and survive, I joined a pug group on my own server. As I learned more, I joined more restrictive groups and eventually won. I suspect a lot of people do the same. If you are joining a DF group expecting to win, you're probably going to waste a lot of time. I'm not saying it's impossible but... ugh. You only have an hour and a half to win with this group. If you don't win, you'll likely never see these people again and that's progress wasted. You're far better off joining a group on your own server.

That said, I know you mentioned your server has a low population. =/ I would suggest making a thread on your world forums and 'schedule' a time if your FC doesn't have the numbers to do it. Shouting in Revenant's Toll is the 'place to be' when looking for endgame groups on my server. Also... I'm not sure if you are aware of this, but I figured I'd throw it out there anyway...

Premade comps for Titan are USUALLY one of the following:

1x tank, 3x healer, 4x dps (usually two melee)
1x tank, 2x healer, 5x dps (usually two melee)

You can do one or the other, but with three healers and 'okay' geared DPS, you likely won't get past the heart unless you build a level 2 LB. (Auto-attack Titan in phase one until at least a half bar is filled. By that point, you should have enough time to build up to level 2 before the Heart). If your group is great at dodging and the healers are geared/competent, it's easily done with two healers. If the DPS is really good, you won't need a LB at all. It's even been done with ONE healer, but I do NOT suggest this for groups who haven't beaten it before.

It will probably get easier once gearscore limits come in, and if they bad the run sells who mess up runs on purpose, then it will get even better.

I would just like to comment that gear was not the issue here. I ran quite a few runs with Longnu and even though our gear was not that great, we always managed to dps the heart down in time. Problem is pugs that were good enough to actually dodge everything were never found. Our server has such a small community of 50s that are skilled that doing this fight is not even currently feasable with a server group. So we are forced to do DF over and over and hope for a 1 in 300 chance we get a group that can actually down this.

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Originally Posted by ntall1

Sounds like, based on your own gear, that you should not even be trying to pug Titan HM in the first place. Its not hard to level up, and its not hard to gear up for end game. It is very easy in this game. You are acticing like you have hit a wall because other ppl on your server level up to slowly.

Instead of puggin titan. Pug CM/AK until you are an average ilvl of 65 or better. Before that gear ilvl chances are that YOU are the issue in the DF pug group.

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I do double the DPS of people in twice my gear (Pugs ofc) Gear is not the issue. Again, focus on the thread instead of being an elitist.

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Originally Posted by Zabuza

I would just like to comment that gear was not the issue here.

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That's my issue, everything but the gear. I have full darklight, hoplite in the other ring slot, and Garuda's weapon. If I'm the tank, despite hitting cooldowns and self-heals, healers just don't heal me enough in time for mountain buster or they die to weight of the land. Or everyone dies to weight of the land. If I'm in DPS mode, everyone dies to weight of the land. I can tank it. I can dodge those attacks while DPSing. And my gear is certainly good enough. My problem is that people just keep on dying over and over and over to weight of the land. It's starting to get really depressing when I've done everything in my power to help the runs succeed, and there's just nothing left that I can do in order to help.

If you build it, they will come.

Just build your own server group (FC), and start working on your members instead of worrying about your own gear (If yours is indeed up to par). Get a group of ppl leveled and geared. That should be your current priority. Seems DFing it is wasting your time anyway, why not spend it more productively.

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Originally Posted by NovaLevossida

It's starting to get really depressing when I've done everything in my power to help the runs succeed, and there's just nothing left that I can do in order to help.

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Well said and the same issue I am dealing with.

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Originally Posted by ntall1

If you build it, they will come.

Just build your own server group (FC), and start working on your members instead of worrying about your own gear (If yours is indeed up to par). Get a group of ppl leveled and geared. That should be your current priority. Seems DFing it is wasting your time anyway, why not spend it more productively.

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Then why was this mode introduced into DF if it is impossible to beat? The point of this thread is the DF. I get what you are saying and yes, we are working on it. However, if Titan defeats DF purposes then why is it even allowable as a queue?

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Originally Posted by LongNu

Then why was this mode introduced into DF if it is impossible to beat? The point of this thread is the DF. I get what you are saying and yes, we are working on it. However, if Titan defeats DF purposes then why is it even allowable as a queue?

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How am I being an elitist by saying to build a static group to do content with? You are saying DF sucks and should be better. Well its not going to get better. Ppl use DF as a means to practice the content before doing it with their static groups. It does not matter what server you are on. DF groups will always struggle with fights like titan. No server group will have it any easier than others if they are playing with random ppl every single time.

You say I am an elitist for simply stating basic truths. Yet you go on to say things like you can double the dps of others even with sub par gear. Who is being the elitist?

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Originally Posted by ntall1

How am I being an elitist by saying to build a static group to do content with? You are saying DF sucks and should be better. Well its not going to get better. Ppl use DF as a means to practice the content before doing it with their static groups. It does not matter what server you are on. DF groups will always struggle with fights like titan. No server group will have it any easier than others if they are playing with random ppl every single time.

You say I am an elitist for simply stating basic truths. Yet you go on to say things like you can double the dps of others even with sub par gear. Who is being the elitist?

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Don't try and derail. You just admitted it's not possible for it to be done with DF, so you're saying the developers intentionally placed a mode in the game to purposely bang one's head against the wall for hours only to realize it's what? A training mode?

Flawless logic.

Still waiting to see the official line that tells me that it's supposed to be a Training Mode.

If it's real (lol) then I'll have no reason to post here. If not, you're doing nothing and adding nothing beneficial to this thread.

i got my first relic weapon for my warrior from DF, with 7 other japanese players.

and my third relic weapon for my pld from DF, with 6 other japanese players and one NA players who has only 3300hp and died in P1, got raised twice and died again immediately.

both were around 8~10 oclock in tokyo time in the morning.

btw, not single one of them was from same FC, i screenshotted the fight, and checked them in lodestone.

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Originally Posted by hola

i got my first relic weapon for my warrior from DF, with 7 other japanese players.

and my third relic weapon for my pld from DF, with 6 other japanese players and one NA players who has only 3300hp and died in P1, got raised twice and died again immediately.

both were around 8~10 oclock in tokyo time.

btw, not single one of them was from same FC, i screenshotted the fight, and checked them in lodestone.

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Great idea... will try this out. Ty

so i suggest

if you cant find a good PUG group on your server or a good FC to do HM titan

do DF HM titan at around 8~11 oclock tokyo time in the morning.

but firstly, at least gearing yourself up with DL gears, dont make 外人look bad.

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Originally Posted by hola

so i suggest

if you cant find a good PUG group on your server or a good FC to do HM titan

do DF HM titan at around 8~11 oclock tokyo time.

but firstly, at least gearing yourself up with DL gears, dont make 外人look bad.

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Server's too small to do it with a static group. We'll have to wait a very long time before we can do that. Nevertheless, we're working on gear / organizing groups for the future.

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Originally Posted by hola

i got my first relic weapon for my warrior from DF, with 7 other japanese players.

and my third relic weapon for my pld from DF, with 6 other japanese players and one NA players who has only 3300hp and died in P1, got raised twice and died again immediately.

both were around 8~10 oclock in tokyo time in the morning.

btw, not single one of them was from same FC, i screenshotted the fight, and checked them in lodestone.

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You do know that only works if you're on JP server side, which probably has abundance of JP players that's usually superior and has no problem surviving insane battles even with very few party members. :p

Unless... someone... somehow... promotes US-based server for more hardcore (latency) challenging for JP players to come over, which will never happen. lol

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Originally Posted by LongNu

However, if Titan defeats DF purposes then why is it even allowable as a queue?

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You speak like this is the developers fault and not the players fault lol.

Anyway

http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/4460776/

Replace these awful grey rings for AK or DL pieces and get a primal weapon so you can contribute to the fight properly. Some DL body piece will also help your DPS and survivability.

Its too hard to go to create a local PUG and not use random DF?

Did anyone ever find out which server that player was in that video?

Here is a translation of the OP:

For some reason I cant find a DF group to carry me thru Titan HM. This is BS, and SE needs to fix it. All end game content should be easy enough to solo, or be doable with half the required party members. Gear? I don't need gear. I am so awesome at dps that I do not require good gear and am still able to out dps anyone ever cause I am so fricking awesome.

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Originally Posted by ilJumperMT

Its too hard to go to create a local PUG and not use random DF?

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If you are a WAR it is. Nobody wants to do this fight with a WAR tank which imho is an even worse game design. I have been kicked from local PUGs just because a freaking PLD made a shout just before entering a fight.

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Originally Posted by Pavetl

If you are a WAR it is. Nobody wants to do this fight with a WAR tank which imho is an even worse game design. I have been kicked from local PUGs just because a freaking PLD made a shout just before entering a fight.

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^ There is that. People doing the groups always either have a PLD already or don't want a WAR. If you want to put together a group, not too many people want to do it with a WAR. I'm personally going the route of waiting around for a FC I joined to get up to the fight and helping them along the way to just do it with them. But, hell, I've had duty finder groups where people will join in, see 2 warriors, say "Great, no PLD," and straight up leave. I've got full DL and garuda's axe and 7100 HP, so I'm not sure what else that I can do to counter common prejudice.

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Originally Posted by ilJumperMT

Its too hard to go to create a local PUG and not use random DF?

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Yes, it is. Our server is one of the new server and it hardly has any 50s on it. The 50s that are on it are even less geared than we are.

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Originally Posted by ntall1

Here is a translation of the OP:

For some reason I cant find a DF group to carry me thru Titan HM. This is BS, and SE needs to fix it. All end game content should be easy enough to solo, or be doable with half the required party members. Gear? I don't need gear. I am so awesome at dps that I do not require good gear and am still able to out dps anyone ever cause I am so fricking awesome.

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Except almost every time Longnu and I have done this we have been able to DPS the heart down in time when we get to that phase. We have not been failing Titan for that reason. The reason we have been failing is there's always someone in the group who cannot dodge all of Titan's moves. If one person dies it almost dooms the whole raid in this fight unless that person can be rezzed. Also two tanks is useless for Titan, but you are forced to queue with it for DF. Also we have a parser that's basically been saying both of us have been outdpsing everyone even when they outgear us. DPS is not the problem.

Dpsing down the heart is not the hard part of the fight. The hard part of the fight comes AFTER you shatter the heart. That is when the healers need the good gear, the ability to dodge, and have to be able to manage their mana while using aoe heals. That is when every class needs to be on their toes, know the attack rotation, be able to anticipate instead of react. The moves come fast and hard here, and make the first bit of the fight, and the heart phase look easy. DF groups from my server have no problem shattering the heart but all also fail after.

It is not something you should be able to expect to do in a DF group, but this is no reason it should not be part of the DF.

All you need is all the time in the world to find the right asses to kiss to get into the good FC's that do this sort of content. They do it on their time however, not yours, so you better make room on your schedule. Some are friendly; some are not. A good many won't care that you exist until you earn your right to be acknowledged; hang out on the vent/teamspeak/mumble server long enough, don't piss people off, eventually you'll be 'in the club' and then you can do stuff with the big dogs.

Otherwise, have fun widdat; this game wasn't meant for 95% of the playerbase.

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Originally Posted by Chrysania

All you need is all the time in the world to find the right asses to kiss to get into the good FC's that do this sort of content. They do it on their time however, not yours, so you better make room on your schedule. Some are friendly; some are not. A good many won't care that you exist until you earn your right to be acknowledged; hang out on the vent/teamspeak/mumble server long enough, don't piss people off, eventually you'll be 'in the club' and then you can do stuff with the big dogs.

Otherwise, have fun widdat; this game wasn't meant for 95% of the playerbase.

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You sound very salty.

Over 200 HM Titan runs in DF and still haven't beaten it. I am 95% of the time not the one who dies. So depressing.

Now you join a FC and stop pug'ing

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Originally Posted by Blazn

Now you join a FC and stop pug'ing

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In a FC... The server unfortunately is a new one and we haven't been able to find any healers that don't stand in AoEs(we know pretty much all the 50s on the server since there still aren't that many :\.) We have a better chance rolling the dice with DF healers, sad as that is.

If all you have to work with is crappy players. Than you do that, and allow everyone in your group to learn the content with each attempt.

Pre made groups can be just as bad as DF groups. The reasons FC's, and premade groups are able to complete the content at all is due to persistence. When you have a static group (Even with healers that stand in AOE's) as you fail you will all collectively learn the fights mechanics. Making it easier for that group in future attempts. The reason a fight like Titan is so hard for DF groups is because most DF groups have players drop out after a wipe. So you will always be playing with ppl who have not practiced the fight, and you will always be playing with potentially undergeard or under skilled players.

The only way to prevent the above is to not only build a static group of players that are available, but you must gear up that group equally, and that group must all learn the fight thru however many attempts that requires.

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Originally Posted by Zabuza

Over 200 HM Titan runs in DF and still haven't beaten it. I am 95% of the time not the one who dies. So depressing.

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I understand that, mostly players die in the last phase, with the AOE stomp and mountain buster on the tank, it takes awhile to get the timing wright though. I have had one or two good pugs, where we got titan down to 25-30%. But generally speaking vary rare that a titan pug completes the primal fight.