Durability restoration choices?

I know there are numerous ways to restore durability while crafting. I was just looking for some input on which one(s) you serious crafters use and why. I'm currently using Waste Not/Waste Not II since my LWing was my first 50 craft.

Has anyone experimented with the others enough to call one BETTER than the others?

I know for sure Waste Not II is the least efficient (I doubt anyone could efficiently use the charges without a huge waste -- ironically enough). Master's Mend II, I believe, is the most efficient for 70 or 80 durability items, but I personally have trouble maintaining 160 CP for it. Manipulation is the most consistent, I think. Waste Not is great for Hasty Touch spamming and is my preferred choice for leveling. I'll probably end up using MMII for high-level crafting, though.

I think it really depends on how you craft. Manipulation/Master's Mend is great if you're using Great Strides. Waste Not is great for Hasty Touch spam because you're not wasting charges on other buffs other than Steady Hand.

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Originally Posted by Capita

I know for sure Waste Not II is the least efficient (I doubt anyone could efficiently use the charges without a huge waste -- ironically enough).

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I assume this is due to the fact that you waste so many of the ticks setting up other "buffs" (Steady Hands/Great Strides/etc)? I am trying to find a solid baseline to use to HQ 1-star crafts with 40 durability, using NQ mats. Sounds like for the higher durability crafts, MMII is the way to go. I don't currently have Manipulation but something tells me it will be a huge help on 40 durability crafts. Thanks for the input!

I dont use any mending abilities and i HQ 1/2 star all the time. Go the other route and make Each quality touch as strong as it can be.. Not the baby touches.
EX:
Inner quiet--> Great Strides--> Ingenuity II-->Innovation-->Advanced Touch (Usually get around 700 on -normals-)-->Great Strides-->Advanced Touch-->Ingenuity II-->Advanced Touch. Thatll leave you around 40/50 durability depending on synth. Here i will usually use either Rumination or wait for a "good" and use Tricks of the Trade to get enough CP to use Steady Hand II then hasty Touchx2-3 (depending on how many Careful synthesis II's i need to finish the synth). Doing this i can HQ 1 stars from NQ mats nearly 100% of the time, and I am 4/4 on HQing 2 star recipes.

Edit on goods i can get around 1100, Excellents with full buffs = 2100-->2200. Its insane.

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Originally Posted by Laryndra

I dont use any mending abilities and i HQ 1/2 star all the time. Go the other route and make Each quality touch as strong as it can be.. Not the baby touches.
EX:
Inner quiet--> Great Strides--> Ingenuity II-->Innovation-->Advanced Touch (Usually get around 700 on -normals-)-->Great Strides-->Advanced Touch-->Ingenuity II-->Advanced Touch. Thatll leave you around 40/50 durability depending on synth. Here i will usually use either Rumination or wait for a "good" and use Tricks of the Trade to get enough CP to use Steady Hand II then hasty Touchx2-3 (depending on how many Careful synthesis II's i need to finish the synth). Doing this i can HQ 1 stars from NQ mats nearly 100% of the time, and I am 4/4 on HQing 2 star recipes.

Edit on goods i can get around 1100, Excellents with full buffs = 2100-->2200. Its insane.

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Wow that is insane! Looks like I need to start leveling the other crafts to 50. *bangs head against wall*

I have had some success using Great Strides followed by Steady hands (if a good condition pops during then I use Tricks of the trade rather than risk the possiblity of failing before Steady hands is on)...then just Great Strides/Standard Touch...I use Masters Mend if My quality is still not there...I find that I have enough CP to do this as well on the 40/40 synths. I do not have any crafters above 30 yet so these are the functions I have...but I am raising them 5 levels at a time because I will have 50 on everything.

Haven't found that Inner Quiet helps me...I do use Waste not on 70/70 to save dur on my progress bar...always taking it to 1 step before finish so i can focus on HQ line and still have like 50 dur to work with...Just gotta ignore the goods that pop up when doing that...but I always go for excellents...

Hopefully this helps...I usually get 90% of my synths HQ...(as long as I'm like 3 or more levels higher than the receipe.)

Another thing i forgot to mention. I do not waste CP/Rounds on using Steady hands II -unless- I am going to Hasty Touch. It isn't worth it in the long run if you have Ingenuity II up the whole time (Its only a 10% chance to fail on Advanced Touch, and Careful Synth II can't fail at all).

The real problem with Waste Not is, frankly, how many of its' charges you end up wasting, thanks to Tricks of the Trade.

Here's my current rotation for 40-point synths:

Inner Quiet
(Tricks of the Trade, if condition is Good)
Great Strides
(at any point in the next three steps, if the condition changes to Good, I use Standard Synth immediately and then move into the rotation)
Steady Hand
Waste Not
Hasty Touch x4 (using ToT if Good condition pops up)
Master's mend
Steady Hand
Hasty touch x3
Master's mend (if there's enough CP left at this point)
Hasty touch (if there's enough CP left at this point)
Rumination (to get enough CP if there isn't enough left)
Standard Synth x whatever I need to finish
Careful Synth (if I'm really worried about it)

I can generally HQ any item from NQ mats using this method, as long as I'm a couple levels higher than the item in question.

Edit:

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Haven't found that Inner Quiet helps me...

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Inner quiet is fantastic, might be the best feature in the crafting part of this game. Combined with Rumination, this is THE key to getting consistent HQ's, and it costs very little CP to put on and stay on... pays off every single time you use it, without question.

Master's Mend II is probably the most efficient considering it's pretty hard to make the most out of Waste Not II.

40 durability crafts you can mix it up with Manipulation and Waste Not I.

There are crafting rotations that make good use of Waste Not II, but to each their own. Waste Not II is the one of the essential pieces of my crafting rotation.

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Originally Posted by Raldo

There are crafting rotations that make good use of Waste Not II, but to each their own. Waste Not II is the one of the essential pieces of my crafting rotation.

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I've recently been using WN-II with Hasty Touch spam. Since it doesn't really focus on hitting goods/excellents with Great Strides it doesn't waste many ticks of WN-II.

The way I see Waste Not II, if about six ticks weren't used for touch or synthesis, it becomes less attractive.

If two or more expiring buffs exist (e.g. Steady Hands II and Waste Not II) and Tricks of the Trade pops, I will touch through it (side effect: bonus quality).

If a Good procs while two buffs aren't up, I'll Tricks it. Tricks ideal when no buff is in progress or when buffs have just ended.

Looking forward to Careful Synthesis II and Byregot's Blessing, but have an interest in Ingenuity II. The idea being to build as much Inner Quiet (Control) before doing the big quality finisher.

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Originally Posted by Jess_Spark

Haven't found that Inner Quiet helps me..

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Inner Quiet raises your Control by 20% of the base, applied after each successful Touch. So, your first Touch is with your base Control, your second is with 120% of your base Control, and so on. The net effect is roughly 10% increase in base (Basic Touch, Hasty Touch) Quality each time you Touch. If you are going to spam Hasty Touch actions, then you *really* want Inner Quiet going. If your plan is to Great Strides -> Steady Hand -> Advanced Touch -> Great Strides -> Advanced Touch -> Great Strides -> Advanced Touch -> Synth a 40 Durability item, then Inner Quiet may not be of much use.

On the other hand, if your plan is to Careful Synth -> Steady Hand -> 5 Hasty Touch -> Master's Mend 2 -> Steady Hand -> 5 Hasty Touch -> Synth to finish, then Inner Quiet will provide a significant boost to the Quality you add, especially to the later Touches.

Due to the mechanics of Inner quiet, it is better to save the Great Strides -> Touch combo until the end of your run. I've seen Quality increases that went this way (only noted these first five) when making something : 69, 76, 83, 90, 97. Those were all Normal, Basic/Hasty Touch. Great Strides at the start would have turned the 69 into a 138. Great Strides for the very last one, however, would turn the 97 into 194.

Inner Quiet is easily the best 18 CP you can spend at the start of the recipe. I just do not understand why people want to kill it with Rumination - most I've gotten out of that skill is 59 CP, not enough (unless I'm saving explicitly for this purpose) to restore any Durability, only barely enough to pop Waste Not. That is a lot of Control to sacrifice, if you are still working on Quality, and I prefer to start by getting to one-Synth-from-completion before I start working on Quality.

waste not II is the best you jsut gotta use it after some durability is gone, you get the biggest bang for your buck. it was also one of the moves that they used to HQ every item (well i think it was waste not I but II is better still) along with tricks of hte trade comfort zone and hasty touch but they seriously nerfed tricks of the trade and comfort zone, with comfort zone only giving you 14 CP after 10 turns they seriously broke it. waste not II is well worth it but don't use it with full durability or it is a waste

I have 7 crafts at 50 on Adamantoise along with Botany and Mining at 50 as well. Every Skill has its uses. I personally love to waste not II and just used it 47 times on Hippo leathers to pull every craft HQ.... So yes it is useful.

Don't forget the more crafts you have at 50 the more cross class skills you can use. I personally love experimenting with my own rotations depending on the durability of the item themselves. I find it very easy to HQ anything under Star 1 with nq mats and hq nearly everything above with hq mats and I'm just now starting to build all of my hq af.

With a full set of HQ accessories(Fully melded) and the 50 Quested Main Hand + Hq off hand + Patrician gear(I think thats the name) all you need is an HQ AF Body to hit Star 2 with no food. Of course the Patrician gear can be painful just for the simple fact of the mats required...

Don't forget you are going to need to farm some materia III's for yourself. You will be better off in the long run getting them yourself!

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Originally Posted by RedMoko

I have 7 crafts at 50 on Adamantoise along with Botany and Mining at 50 as well. Every Skill has its uses. I personally love to waste not II and just used it 47 times on Hippo leathers to pull every craft HQ.... So yes it is useful.
...

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What's your skill sequence for 100% HQ 1 star 40 durability at such a low level? I've only manage to come up with 50% HQ from all NQ items for the 40 durability items. 80 durability item is easy to HQ from all NQ, but 40 durability is the problem. Here's the rotation I am using:

http://i.imgur.com/ljxG7yx.png

Try Popping Steady Hands II before Waste Not and change it to Waste Not II, You will see why...

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Originally Posted by Capita

I know for sure Waste Not II is the least efficient (I doubt anyone could efficiently use the charges without a huge waste -- ironically enough). Master's Mend II, I believe, is the most efficient for 70 or 80 durability items, but I personally have trouble maintaining 160 CP for it. Manipulation is the most consistent, I think. Waste Not is great for Hasty Touch spamming and is my preferred choice for leveling. I'll probably end up using MMII for high-level crafting, though.

I think it really depends on how you craft. Manipulation/Master's Mend is great if you're using Great Strides. Waste Not is great for Hasty Touch spam because you're not wasting charges on other buffs other than Steady Hand.

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Well, yes. If you use Waste Not II, you've committed yourself to doing touches and synths for the next eight actions or you've wasted your CPs. Hasty Touch is the way to go here. Personally, I love it but there's no denying it puts you at the mercy of the RNG.

I'm fan of waste not for 1 and 2 star items. My rotation is normally:

1. Inner Quiet
2. Steady Hands 2
3. Waste Not 2
4. Hasty Touch x 4
5. Careful Synthesis x 3/4 (1 away from finish)

I don't waste any of the waste not in my rotation. The only time I ever try to use great strides is near the end of a synthesis when I go to hit the lvl 50 carpenter quality boost skill.

I just wanna say thanx all for the input(even though not my thread). I've been working on cross class and all crafts to 50. Reading all this was really informative :)

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Originally Posted by Gabbelgak

I'm fan of waste not for 1 and 2 star items. My rotation is normally:

1. Inner Quiet
2. Steady Hands 2
3. Waste Not 2
4. Hasty Touch x 4
5. Careful Synthesis x 3/4 (1 away from finish)

I don't waste any of the waste not in my rotation. The only time I ever try to use great strides is near the end of a synthesis when I go to hit the lvl 50 carpenter quality boost skill.

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you actually waste waste not, or rather the steady hands :P
switch steady hands 2 with waste not 2, because if you waste one move of waste not its like you did not waste anything as you will end up with 5 durability instead of 0/10