Why summoner is a DoT job?

Why?
Never in any other FF they worked like this, so why this is how they are here?

I'm not saying they dont do damage, because they do. But why are their mechanics like this? This job should have a different name :X I even like the looks of the egis unlike some other people, just don't like the amount of DoTs the job has.

I believe nobody has the answer for this, but feeling so disappointed about the job atm that will make my arcanist turn into Scholar first... And that comes from a main Summoner player from previously FFs. :(

PS.: Sry for errors, not native english speaker here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

This is an MMO. Even though Summoner is a traditional name for a person who calls forth a large beast the deals devastating damage in spectacular fashion, that's not viable in an MMO because of Balancing issues, making something OP, making something hard on the system when hundreds of SMNs in a FATE party call our their huge monsters and deal devastating attacks all at once.

This is not a single player game. This is an MMO. That's why SMN is a DoT job.

Hope that answers your question.

---

That only answer why you can't spam huge effects in battle not why it's DoT.
why hell's fire from an Ifrit Egi should be a huge effect? he's not Ifrit itself if it did damage in aoe it would be enough. Unicorn summon restoring hp aoe... Stuff like that.

This is an MMO. Even though Summoner is a traditional name for a person who calls forth a large beast the deals devastating damage in spectacular fashion, that's not viable in an MMO because of Balancing issues, making something OP, making something hard on the system when hundreds of SMNs in a FATE party call our their huge monsters and deal devastating attacks all at once.

This is not a single player game. This is an MMO. That's why SMN is a DoT job.

Hope that answers your question.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

This is an MMO. Even though Summoner is a traditional name for a person who calls forth a large beast the deals devastating damage in spectacular fashion, that's not viable in an MMO because of Balancing issues, making something OP, making something hard on the system when hundreds of SMNs in a FATE party call our their huge monsters and deal devastating attacks all at once.

This is not a single player game. This is an MMO. That's why SMN is a DoT job.

Hope that answers your question.

---

Well thats not really a reason for it to be a DoT class. Just because a class has a pet doesnt mean they HAVE to be a dot class, they could have lower personal damage, to be made up by the pet damage, they could be a versatile class, who could change rolls based on what pet they have.

There is just something off with the FEEL of the class, the DoTs lack weight or impact, whereas other classes are alot more on the flashy side.

The Summoner is pretty much a copy of WoW's warlock. Pretty lame if you ask me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vanroe

Well thats not really a reason for it to be a DoT class. Just because a class has a pet doesnt mean they HAVE to be a dot class, they could have lower personal damage, to be made up by the pet damage, they could be a versatile class, who could change rolls based on what pet they have.

---

You mean like DRG in FFXI? Last I heard that sucked. The last thing we need is a class like DRG in XI

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vanroe

There is just something off with the FEEL of the class, the DoTs lack weight or impact, whereas other classes are alot more on the flashy side.

---

Well, there's always BLM. :)

What's wrong with being a DoT Class? I think it's good that the Summoner has a different play style than a Black Mage.
We have one Nuke Caster and one DoT/Pet Caster. Sounds good to me.

Why not make it a DoT class?

They summon things and use DoTs. Sure it's arbitrary but so is summoning big creatures for big alpha-strike damage. There's no real logic either way.

Traditional Summoners called a summon for a unique, one-off, powerful attack.
OH WAIT, that's exactly what its level 50 ability does. . .

I'm confused, would you want Enkindle to be a SMN's only move? There are so many ability slots to be filled that it would be silly to have anything else; I'd rather it not be a copy of XI's SMN where every ability was a different way of controlling the same pet.

The only way to make it "traditional" would be to remove all of its existing abilities and replace them with different summons which appear, do a single attack, and then retreat. Fun. At least DoT/debuffs allows for SMN to actually regulate things.

Also, Arcanists in FF "traditionally" revelled in dark magics, so... I'd say it's spot-on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rbstr

Why not make it a DoT class?

They summon things and use DoTs. Sure it's arbitrary but so is summoning big creatures for big alpha-strike damage. There's no real logic either way.

---

The logic is that of a Final Fantasy game, not real world game. :) And there's no logic in Summoner being DoT mage while theres plentiful logic in the summoning of big creatures for big alpha-strike damage.

And the question is not just the damage. Summoning can have multiple effects, like casting Doom, casting regen in the party, casting protect/shell/reflect like in other FFs its not just about the damage.

If this class was called warlock, nobody would be saying anything about its name other than it's a copy from wow :X

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zx10r

The Summoner is pretty much a copy of WoW's warlock. Pretty lame if you ask me.

---

not really

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malix

not really

---

Explain to me how it isn't like the warlock we have dots and pet damage that sucks just like locks still last expansion they made it so you can play something other than the same old all lock go affliction spec since other just blow and that took 5 years or so for them to completely remake the Demon spec lock i am not going to wait around for 5 years for SE to learn what a SMN is from there other games.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fantasia

Traditional Summoners called a summon for a unique, one-off, powerful attack.
OH WAIT, that's exactly what its level 50 ability does. . .

I'm confused, would you want Enkindle to be a SMN's only move? There are so many ability slots to be filled that it would be silly to have anything else; I'd rather it not be a copy of XI's SMN where every ability was a different way of controlling the same pet.

The only way to make it "traditional" would be to remove all of its existing abilities and replace them with different summons which appear, do a single attack, and then retreat. Fun. At least DoT/debuffs allows for SMN to actually regulate things.

Also, Arcanists in FF "traditionally" revelled in dark magics, so... I'd say it's spot-on.

---

Wrong lore wise arcanist don't revel in dark magic, they don't even use dark magic if you understand how arcanima works yes the spells are dark to us but in the game world they are not using dark magic. Oh this is arcanist first time being in a final fantasy. The class that revels in dark magic is the black mage their magic is connected to the void itself hell the void wants to claim and corrupt a black mage since black magic and the void share a deep bond. The black mage class gear comes from the very void itself the same void where all the demons live.

Hell there is even an eye on our glove(most likely jewelry) which I think represents the one eyed flying void sent(forgot its name)

Man it took blizz 5 years for them to make demonology good? I do recall when I first played wow (like 2 months ago) the changes they made to demonology was rather recent like demonic fury and imps etc.

I also feel the OP is correct the pet should of been the center piece of the class instead of a DOT class with the pet being the side show.

Man it took blizz 5 years for them to make demonology good? I do recall when I first played wow (like 2 months ago) the changes they made to demonology was rather recent like demonic fury and imps etc.

I have been playing wow though since it was RELEASED in 2004 and most of that time i was playing a warlock and was saying it took them 5 years to start to kinda make work to what it is now

Not really sure what people were expecting, maybe to summon their pet once a minute for a single attack and then spend the rest of the time throwing out weak cures?

I think they made a decent choice with SMN, it's very similar to Aion's Spiritmaster (even the "Egis" look strangely similar) if you want a comparison with another game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alkimi

Not really sure what people were expecting, maybe to summon their pet once a minute for a single attack and then spend the rest of the time throwing out weak cures?

I think they made a decent choice with SMN, it's very similar to Aion's Spiritmaster (even the "Egis" look strangely similar) if you want a comparison with another game.

---

It isnt ANYTHING like the Aion spiritmast i have one up there all there skills make your pet use a different skill i wouldnt even mind if they would have done that for SM but they didnt do that at all

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alkimi

Not really sure what people were expecting, maybe to summon their pet once a minute for a single attack and then spend the rest of the time throwing out weak cures?

---

A lot of people are thinking of XI and a few other games, where your pet did everything and the summoner was essentially a puppetmaster in that your abilities were commands for the pet.

That system could be powerful and fun, but I think the main reason for needing the characters to have their own skillset is to keep it from being OP--all other classes die when they die, SMN could just resummon.

As far as choosing DoT over (relatively-)low burst damage, I assume it was just "EVERYONE ELSE'S PET CLASS WORKS THIS WAY" logic.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Darkes94

Explain to me how it isn't like the warlock we have dots and pet damage that sucks just like locks still last expansion they made it so you can play something other than the same old all lock go affliction spec since other just blow and that took 5 years or so for them to completely remake the Demon spec lock i am not going to wait around for 5 years for SE to learn what a SMN is from there other games.

---

First of all DoT class is an archetype that has existed long before WoW so lets get that out the way first. The only similarities is that they use DoTs and have a pet. Can i say WHM is like X healer from X game? Sure if i use your logic.

Heres some differences between smn and DoT spec Warlock:

Warlock CDs are centered around the warlock and SMN is centered around the pet.
Warlocks channel their filler
Warlocks AoE A LOT differently
Summoners use an aetherflow system where as Warlocks use Souls(sounds the same but works in a completely different way)
Summoners can spread DoTs and Warlocks cannot.
Summoner has an ability called Fester that is a big part of their rotation as well as an ability to drain HP AND MP while Warlocks do not.

I can list more if you want but i think you get the point i am trying to make.