What am I doing wrong? (WHM)

I'm level 50 WHM and I lose to heal. However, I am having a hard time not running OOM during long boss fights. For example, in Amdapor I run OOM pretty fast on the first fight. I don't know if I am doing something wrong or if my party doesn't know how to dodge stuff. Either way, any tips to help me not run OOM. (I use Saint and potions, but that really isn't enough)

Ever use Shroud of Saints?

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Originally Posted by Cairn

Ever use Shroud of Saints?

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Yes, I use it every time it's off cool down during fights.

More details please

Because I can only draw on the idea that your either overhealing or your party is taking too much DMG

Also it never hurts to have a BRD

What do you mean by "you lose to heal"?

Sounds like what I was going through.
I kept thinking it's my fault, I kept running out of MP. I use ether, shroud of saints, keep using lower versions of Cure and only use the highest version I have when necessary.
I had 2 times when I wasn't suffering that bad and that was when 1. I had a bard in the party. 2. the dps in the party was good.

It's not even about the tank taking a lot of dmg, if the dps don't make enough dmg and it's taking a long time to kill stuff, it's only natural you run out of MP. For the first time ever I actually started appreciating dps a lot haha.

I'm always blaming myself first, before others, but in this case there is really no other explanation.

I've heard SCH don't run out of MP like WHM, if that helps with anything. :)


Happy Healing

I haven't done Ampador yet. But curiosity if Divine Seal may assist in the healing and help you maintain MP (since the +healing potency effect is there)?

You need to plan your shrouds. I get back around 1200 mp per shroud so use it early in the fight right after you dip below that point then on cd from that point forward. I personally try to save free cures for dps as cure ii tends to be just about right to bring them back to full on level 50 fights.

Did you spec for full +MND or +PIE?

Does speccing into PIE help that much at all? I'm almost a pure MND build, accidentally put 3 into PIE at start. I've been running outta mana in battles too, but do alright with spamming regen, cure I, shroud of saints and a pot when I need. only throwing cureII when it's free, mostly, and hardly ever use medica. I haven't lost a team due to no mana yet, but it has come close a few times.

It's funny that with some groups I'm not even half of my mana at the end of a boss and with others I'm dead oom.
Not even talking about a bard here just the difference.

First boss there isn't that heavy on your mana, though if this happens it will be difficult.

- Damage to low to blow up the adds in time
- Tank not picking up the adds when damage is low
- Tank not popping his cooldowns at the right time
- DD taking red circles

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Originally Posted by Sneakaboo

It's funny that with some groups I'm not even half of my mana at the end of a boss and with others I'm dead oom.
Not even talking about a bard here just the difference.

First boss there isn't that heavy on your mana, though if this happens it will be difficult.

- Damage to low to blow up the adds in time
- Tank not picking up the adds when damage is low
- Tank not popping his cooldowns at the right time
- DD taking red circles

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Bard in group? ;)
It also depends a lot on the dps output of course..

It's one of(or probably several of) a couple things:

1. You're overhealing too much
2. You're not using Shroud of Saints on cooldown
3. You're not taking advantage of Freecure Procs
4. You're using spells inefficiently (ie Cure I is more efficient than Cure II, Medica II than Medica I... etc)
5. DPS/tank are taking too much avoidable damage, this includes when the healer/dps is taking aggro damage from lack of tanking
6. DPS sucks and it's taking you too long to kill stuff

The first four are fixable, the last two you can't do much about other than yell at people.

The true answer: You didn't use Repose...

Repose is pretty spammable and every effective usage will save you multiple times the cost of Repose.

Macro it in this way:
(Start step 1 after the MT marked the Attack1 target)
1) Mark a different target with Ignore.
2) Shout in party that you are going to sleep the target in the next 2 sec.
3) Wait 2 sec.
4) Cast Repose.
5) Repeat & Rinse it on every monster except the target marked Attack1 by the MT.

You may even have extra mp left to do DPS :P
After the monster wake-up, if the tank didn't grab it, then just knockback the monster and Repose it again.

The question was about long boss fights. To date, I have not seen sleep used during a boss fight. Ever.

As a tank, I'm not sure if that's because things are immune to sleep or just that they have to die and there's no point in waiting. There may be times when sleep is valuable, but that would be strategy specific to certain boss - not general answer.

Hi DefeatedYMIR. Hope you're still enjoying WHM even though its proving to be a tough class to play. Hopefully we can help with that, though!

First off, shortly after a battle starts, casting regen gives you a very low cost constant heal over time. Try not to cast it towards the end of a battle or before the start of a new one because the moment it ticks after the tank has aggro'd the mobs you will generate threat and they will come after you instead which can put the tank out of position as well as leading to dps survival issues as well!

The second thing you may want to consider is sticking to only using cure I while the tank is above 50-60% (adjust as neccessary for the levels of damage the tank can tank in a burst!) health as it is much more efficient over time not only when you take into account potency and MP cost, but when you take into account that your mp is constantly regenerating.
(Will continue when able...)

Spamming cure I has very little strain on your MP pool. You should try to save Cure II for when you have a proc of Freecure or if a party members health drops by over 1000. If no healing is required, you can save the Freecure proc for up to 15 seconds. This means you can wait those 15 seconds while your mp regenerates, then cure with cure II as needed for no cost!

For those pesky moments of AoE damage on the party, you may want to use Medica 2 as although the initial heal is low, the regen is provides is quite potent. Using this in conjunction with divine seal is a fine party heal, and any subsequent AoE healing needed after the initial Medica 2 can be dealt with with Medica I.

Coming on to shroud, once you've masters mp conservation you will likely only need to worry about this for bosses. I tend to trigger it during the longer fights when my mp has dropped by 1300 from its maximum. I rarely use it a reaction to enmity as this never seems to be an issue if you're sticking with cure I / regen for the main healing strategy.

If you start feeling that you just need that little bit more healing power to stop you draining your mp, divine seal gives you a nice boost, and can be active effectively a lot of the time. It's a 15 second ability on a 1 minute cool down so for large portions of any battle you can be healing heavily with the low tier of cures.

Hope this helps you out a bit! And sorry for the triple post, but seriously... 1000 character limit >.<

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Originally Posted by Draemos

It's one of(or probably several of) a couple things:

1. You're overhealing too much
2. You're not using Shroud of Saints on cooldown
3. You're not taking advantage of Freecure Procs
4. You're using spells inefficiently (ie Cure I is more efficient than Cure II, Medica II than Medica I... etc)
5. DPS/tank are taking too much avoidable damage, this includes when the healer/dps is taking aggro damage from lack of tanking
6. DPS sucks and it's taking you too long to kill stuff

The first four are fixable, the last two you can't do much about other than yell at people.

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If he's having MP problems in Amdapor Keep, it's probably no.6. Though I'm not sure how you can run out of MP on Demon Wall before being squished, it's a short fight and I spam the hell out of Medica spells on that one.

I want to point out that mana regen does get noticeably better with better gear even with lazy play. So if you can't really get it, gear helps to cover up sloppyness.

-Regen gives the best HPM in your arsenal,

-You don't have to keep everyone full health to do your job.

If you use divine seal you should be just fine. Use cure and you will get that buff that will give you a cure II free. Unless the tank or one of the dps are at half health, then use cure II to get the up above 90%.
I keep stoneskin on my tank which saves me 2 or more casts of healing, and regen. Using regen on the party when Hp is down 1/4 of the way is great cause It don't use mp like cure and it works for 20 seconds.

I can only suspect non-efficient use of heals. Using more Mp efficient heals will lower the mana cost. Sure, healing will be less, but over-all you will get a better Heal Per MP ratio. From there its just effective use of Shroud. If you are doing that all right and it still happens, good chance its the DPS/tank taking far to much unnecessary damage which isn't your fault, it is theirs.

Noob reply.....shroud returns mp? Lol

When I play in pickup parties run oom. The tank I usually run with will use cool downs to give me a chance to catch up on heals and regenerate mana. I did throw a few points into piety though.

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Originally Posted by Freddie

Noob reply.....shroud returns mp? Lol

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Yes, the Additional Effect: Refresh is what restores your mana. This is also enhanced when you reach 48 and receive the Trait: Enhanced Shroud of Saints.

Try to use Divine Seal + Regen off cooldown it really lets u relax, throw on a stoneskin and you won't have to spam cure as much. Also, you should really be using cure 1 the majority of the time to get those free proc heals....try to stay away from using cure 2 even though that burst heal feels so good and safe in heated fights, that free proc helps a lot.

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Originally Posted by RhazeCain

The question was about long boss fights. To date, I have not seen sleep used during a boss fight. Ever.

As a tank, I'm not sure if that's because things are immune to sleep or just that they have to die and there's no point in waiting. There may be times when sleep is valuable, but that would be strategy specific to certain boss - not general answer.

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Rivenroad. But i see your point, sleep is definitely not the answer to his mp scarcity.

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Originally Posted by Vid

Yes, the Additional Effect: Refresh is what restores your mana. This is also enhanced when you reach 48 and receive the Trait: Enhanced Shroud of Saints.

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Thanks. Not really noticed.

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Originally Posted by INFERNO5150

I keep stoneskin on my tank which saves me 2 or more casts of healing

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I can't really find out the point in keeping up Stoneskin on the tank during the fight. Maybe there's something that escapes me. Take this video as an example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XS86-eyX1Jk. The WHM keeps Stoneskin on the PLD for almost all the fight, but as you can see, the tank has 4983 HP in total, so Stoneskin saves him from only 896.94 damage (18% of total HP). In the same video you can see that with a single Cure II the WHM restores around 1100 HP, definitely more than a single Stoneskin with the same MP cost (266 in this case). So, I can't really get it. Where is the point in keeping Stoneskin up on tank for all the boss fight? :/

Edit: I forgot to mention that Stoneskin has a cast time of 3 seconds, against the 2 seconds of Cure II.

Maybe you have Clerical Stance on... lulz