Targetting and my tale of 2 Mongrels

First of all I would like to say I play with a gamepad, so I do not know how it is for keypad users.

So here is my story to give you an idea about what I am discussing. Although, I give this example, it is not the only one I could talk about. Today I was at Iron lake (for a change), doing the leve Muttonn over Mongrels. I throw the leve and placed the difficulty on solo. Knowing I was going to have difficulty even on solo, I thought to sleep one of the two mongrels which would claim. With my first attempt I cast sleep on one mongrel and start to attack the other. At this point the battle is a grind but fun, then the other mongrel wakes up and proceeds to charge in my direction. Knowing I would be in trouble if I was attacked by both, I selected sleep again and now my problems begin. With the enemy option seleced in targetting system I press right to target the just awoken mob, suddenly my targetting system selects a ravenous nannygoat, i press right again (both mongrels now attacking me), the targetting system selects another ravenous nannygoat (i am now at half health), i press right again and now because the mob has run behind me (i think) the targetting selects the mob i am locked onto. Now panic set in and I press cancel to desperately try to heal myself, but I fail and die.

Now I do not want to be too passionate because it will make this thread seem troll like but I have to say that is terrible. There are 2 problems I particularly have with this:

1) The ravenous nannygoats were a good 50 yarms behind the two mongrels.
2) Why is it selecting mobs which are, not in my leve and not claimed by me?

While I like the improvements to the new targetting system, I think these improvements could greatly help the targetting in battle:

1) There should be a distance equation in the tagetting. I am not going to say it should be this figure, but the ravenous nannygoats were out of my range.
2) If you are on a leve, the targetting system should give preference to the mobs which are in your leve/behest/quest. Also once claimed the group of claimed mobs should have preference over every other mob (for me this is common sence, why would I have attacked the rav nannygoats in my example, unless I wanted to die).

To further help the targetting:

3) Once you are in a party the friendly setting should target the party preferenially to other players, this would remove the need for changing to the party option.
4) Add an NPC option.

Finally I would like to say although the controller targetting is better it is still fatally flawed in my opinion. Hopefully adding something along the lines of the improvements I stated above would go a long way to making the game as a whole much more enjoyable, as i believe control can make or break a game.

P.S Posters, thank you for reading my thread and I look forward to your comments.

I use a gamepad and I've never had a problem with targeting mode B. Yes it will occasionally select something I'm not fighting but I've never had a problem selecting my target quickly. It's all about the direction your character is facing. If you're looking right at them it should target them first, that has always been my experience at least.

Also just set a /targetnpc macro on your first of alt/ctrl. I have it set so I hold L-trigger and press A, target NPC.

The only really addition/improvement I see the need for is for Enemy mode to target engaged enemies preferentially.

I also play with controller and I agree with your whole post. It's not the end of the world as it is now, but how are PS3 players going to feel if the target system doesn't work good out-of-the-box?

But surely there is a team of some sort who's dedicated on improving things like this.

They don't even need target mode A and B.

As someone else stated in a different thread, make up and down target party members in the party list and left and right target NPC's.

NPC targeting should have a priority system:-

1st Friendly NPC
2nd Engaged NPC
3rd Closest NPC

No, I'm pretty happy with Targeting Modes A and B. I think they're very good solutions to the problem, it's just that Enemy could use a little bit of a priority tweak and maybe Friendly should be NPC instead as there's a mode for Party anyway. As someone who ranks mainly Disciples of War, I have no need to target party members 99% of the time.

What happens with a Behest and the battle warden walks in front of you? Instead of that engaged enemy NPC you've now selected the battle warden as they are both the closest and a friendly NPC.

What do you mean NO you are happy with it, I wasn't asking for your permission LMAO

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What happens with a Behest and the battle warden walks in front of you? Instead of that engaged enemy NPC you've now selected the battle warden as they are both the closest and a friendly NPC.

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It's one NPC hardly a game breaker.

Ok , how about left and right target monsters, up and down target party or friendly targets.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

They don't even need target mode A and B.

As someone else stated in a different thread, make up and down target party members in the party list and left and right target NPC's.

NPC targeting should have a priority system:-

1st Friendly NPC
2nd Engaged NPC
3rd Closest NPC

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I would like an Engaged targeting mode too. Would help out LOTS! Maybe even a keybinding to "Target nearest engaged NPC" too.

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Originally Posted by Reika

I would like an Engaged targeting mode too. Would help out LOTS! Maybe even a keybinding to "Target nearest engaged NPC" too.

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Yea FF11 used to have /target <BT>(battle target), I miss that :(

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Ok , how about left and right target monsters, up and down target party or friendly targets.

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Well then you'd have the problem of friendly NPCs getting in the way of possibly healing party members. The targeting modes are fine as is. Targeting Mode A is great for support/healers. Targeting Mode B works very well for everyone else. As I said, only Enemy really needs a change to prioritize engaged enemies.

Honestly instead of, or in addition to, BT I'd love to see a target enemy sign macro. Those marks are incredibly useful and this would make them even more so.

I'd like to have a feature where if you are currently locked onto a target and you press and hold a button it aborts the lockon to that target and instead swaps to the other target from that party.

So For instance if you are fighting

Monster Part:
Mongrel A
Mongrel B

And you are currently targeting and locked onto Mongrel A. Pressing and holding Menu or Cancel or some button will deselect Mongrel A and swap target to Mongrel B.

Currently there are no "Hold for Effect" mappings for the Gamepad which I think is where they could implement any extra buttons that are currently missing.

O = Cancel on Tap, O HOLD= Deselect Target and Select Next Party Target

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Originally Posted by Arcell

Well then you'd have the problem of friendly NPCs getting in the way of possibly healing party members. The targeting modes are fine as is. Targeting Mode A is great for support/healers. Targeting Mode B works very well for everyone else. As I said, only Enemy really needs a change to prioritize engaged enemies.

Honestly instead of, or in addition to, BT I'd love to see a target enemy sign macro. Those marks are incredibly useful and this would make them even more so.

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Up and down would select the people in your party list, how on earth would you select the NPC ?

The only way is if you go to the top or bottom of the list and select the NPC.

I guess you obviously don't heal much using a gamepad. (I use the mouse to heal FWIW, but still feel that the targeting system would be better this way for both keyboard uses and gamepad users)

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Up and down would select the people in your party list, how on earth would you select the NPC ?

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You said:

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Ok , how about left and right target monsters, up and down target party or friendly targets.

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I don't heal much but if I did I'd just use targeting mode A where up and down already does select party members.

Why want less options. Options = good.

Agreed. Sub-par targeting makes playing FFXIV frustrating. I will play again when this is fixed.

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Originally Posted by Reika

Why want less options. Options = good.

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Not always, more options can be confusing and messy, the current system is pretty clunky and if you are in mode B its way too easy to accidental press up or down changing the settings and then be confused as to why you can't target what you want to. (especially if you are playing with a 360 controller lol)

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Originally Posted by Reika

Why want less options. Options = good.

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I am sorry Reika but I find it very stiff to change. Particularly if you need to change in modes in battle. Coming out of one setting changing it and then locking on again it very stiff and does not allow for fluid control. Hence why you can affectively do them all while in enemy mode.

I find it a bit of a crapshoot. Sometimes I can do it flawlessly. Othertimes its a bit clunky, especially if there's a marmot on a ledge...

Setting up subtargets (either yourself or part of a raid management) would be ideal.

I agree with OP. Also i miss being able to weapon skill with my sub target like you could in 11.

example: you're fighting the mob with your main target and realize a weapon skill would be over kill so you weapon skill a second mob with your sub target then go back to your main target seamlessly and finish it off with basic attacks then auto target the the second mob and finish it off too.

After you cue up an action/spell you are prompted to select a traget (sub-targeting).

This is when UP/DOWN targeting of players via the party list needs to function.

Targeting needs to work during targeting.

There is no confusion of UP/DOWN controlling the action bar WHILE you are casting a spell. It is very clear that all commands are to select a target at this time.

Currently, /target npc selects the monster that is closet to the middle of your screen.

Instead, it needs to select the monster that your actually closest to. (For melee - perhaps spell casters would disagree.) If /target NPC selects according to the middle of screen, then simply add a second command that is "/target nnpc" for the actual nearest NPC.

Or just use FFXI's targeting. It seems like a lame suggestion at first, but geez, it worked right?

I just want functional targeting. Please.

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Originally Posted by Arcell

I use a gamepad and I've never had a problem with targeting mode B. Yes it will occasionally select something I'm not fighting but I've never had a problem selecting my target quickly. It's all about the direction your character is facing. If you're looking right at them it should target them first, that has always been my experience at least.

Also just set a /targetnpc macro on your first of alt/ctrl. I have it set so I hold L-trigger and press A, target NPC.

The only really addition/improvement I see the need for is for Enemy mode to target engaged enemies preferentially.

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My problem was not selecting the target quick Arcell. When I pressed right I got a target, but it was not a claimed mob or even a quest mob. The second part of this comment is when I am asking for. By the time the game had cycled through the two ravenous nannygoats my character was at 100 HP life. This is what my post is highlighting a simple range/perference equations would have stopped me from dying. Then it was down to my ability to play the class correctly. Like I said when I had one mob sleeped and the other attacking me, it was a challenge, but fun and then, I had this targetting issue. I want to highlight it because it has happened before and you feel cheated. Also like a poster has said, this game is really hoping for a good PS3 release, so the control on a gamepad will be essential to that.

I think this is one area they should use the FFX1 method of targeting. I agree completely with this post.

Sorry I am not familiar with the xi method of targetting. I never played the game.

Why didnt you just AOE sleep on the one you're fighting? I dont get why you had to switch target at all.

I never have issues with mongrels because
1. I dont fight near other mobs, i move them a little so I can aoe
2. They're insanely weak to magic, so you just nuke the hell out of them

Even when using a mouse i sometimes click on a mob and the selection STILL targets a nearby monster and not the one my mouse pointer is directly pointing at...

What i'm most confused about is that FFXI had a decent targeting system made to work with both PS2 and PC, so why not copy that for starters? It's baffling.

PLEASE ALLOW ME THE OPTION TO HAVE THE ACTION BAR NOT AUTO-HIDE [LIKE THIS] clicky

I play with keyboard only, and I gave up and just reach over to my mouse and click what I wanna target mid-fight, too cumbersome otherwise

FFXIV targeting:
Left to Right

What it should be:
Current engage mob, nearest, far