PLD Enmity pre Shield Oath

I'm just curious as to how you other PLDs are handling the enmity challenge pre lvl 40?

I've found it to be very tough to maintain hate now that we are reaching some tougher dungeons (Brayflox, Qarn, Titan). I've been able to run some dungeons with a friend who is a WAR around the same level and can maintain enmity a thousand times better (Defiance is lvl 30). Qarn was specifically tough, especially the Templar Gaurdian (golem) fight, as he has somewhat of a enmity reset. Running this as a 35 PLD I was unable to keep hate at all through the fight, ran again with a 37 WAR who tanked it without a hitch. Frustrating...

How are you guys making up for this until we get Shield Oath? Are you having any issues?

For packs:

Shield lob > Flash > Fast Blade > Savage Blade > Flash > Rage of Halone > Full combo. If you are having trouble one trick you can do is FB the first target, SB the second, Halone the third, etc. I haven't had any issues.

As for Qarn the Golem doesn't have an enmity reset, he just targets a random person every now and then. Since we don't have AOE enmity generation you have to pick your enmity battles. Provoke > Fast Blade stragglers, weave flash between Halone combos, etc.

The way I handle packs (example of a 3 pack)

Shield Lob twice two 1 and 2, flash, fast blade 1, savage blade 3, Rage of Halon 1, flash. They could never pull off me after that.

ALSO due add the fact your damage also makes a difference in threat, if you are not hitting hard with your savage blade or Rage of halone, they WILL pull off you so its important to blow a fight of flight cooldown to make good in threat :)

Tanking in this game is certainly the easiest I've experienced in any of the 10+ MMO's I've ever played over the years. On a three mob pull, mark targets 1 and 2. Shield lob target one while running in, use flash, Quick blade on target one, savage blade on target 2, Rage of hamone on target three, flash again. Quick blade + Savage blade target one, rage of hamone target 2, quick blade plus savage on target three, rage of hamone on target 1. I tend to use the 6 second stun on a target when it's about 6 or less seconds from dying so I can focus on generating more emnity on the other targets and it prevents me from taking any more damage from that target.

This "rotation" isn't what I use every time either. If I know someone in the party does a ton of damage, I will target the number 1 marked target more often to produce more threat on him.

I dont ever find the need to switch targets to get Enmity toward them.

General 3 mob pull = Shield Lob> Flash > Flash> Combo on 1> Combo on 1> Flash>Combo on 2> Repeat. If healer gets a crit and gets 1 mob, Taunt it with Provoke.

Yeah, if you know what you're doing and how to utilize your enmity skills threat is no issue pre lvl 40.
For further detail just check the guide in my signature. I linked it here in this forum the day it came up, but it's pushed back on page 2 or 3 by now. And since most players don't care what's on page 2 or 3 all these rumours start coming up again how enmity works and what's the secret when all of it has already been tested in detail ;)

I'm no expert, so whether this was the right thing to do or not, I actually went Gladiator to Brayflox. I had no issues at all holding hate in any situation. It does come down to managing your enmity against multiple targets well.

The reason for my choice on Gladiator was simply the access to other class abilities. Whilst they are short terms buffs, Raging Strikes, Blood For Blood, Internal Release etc does help with damage output which helps with enmity gain. Of course, this isn't always the choice for players who don't have many classes levelled up (most of mine are mid 30s).

I haven't tanked Titan or Qarn, though, so I can't say how that would match up in those instances. I just don't like the huge restrictions Paladin has pre-40 (half as many cross class, with only 2 options to pull from which are mostly defensive; no Shield Oath for the nice enmity bonus and damage mitigation).

Oddly enough me and Unaki have the same rotation. Not like there's much to do there, but I have been told I've been one of the best tanks seen on my server so far @my level. Seems to me there are a bunch of people running around allowing mobs to get on healers, dps n what not. While this is a challenge to tank (FINALLY!!!!), if you pay attention its not really that hard specially as a PLD. Once in a while I'll need to provoke a mob that gets side tracked but provoke, w/ a 3step combo ensures that never happens again for that fight.

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Originally Posted by Unaki

For packs:

Shield lob > Flash > Fast Blade > Savage Blade > Flash > Rage of Halone > Full combo. If you are having trouble one trick you can do is FB the first target, SB the second, Halone the third, etc. I haven't had any issues.

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I agree I've also found this to be the most effective way to hold threat against groups of enemies, I'll usually throw flash in there every now and then just to be sure, and if MP is an issue then use Fast Blade > Riot Blade a few times.

Due to the extremely long cooldown on the actual provoke ability, I've been saving it for when I need to pull a stray mob off someone in my group, usually a black or white mage :P. So far I have had absolutely no issues holding threat on a single target, and only times groups are an issue is when the party decides to attack everything at once, haha.

It doesn't matter what you do if DPS don't focus fire. People can beat their own drum all they want, but they aren't holding threat on all monsters if people are hitting them all. Its just not possible. I would suggest macroing a mark into your shield lob so its already marked on pulled.

It does get alot better after shield oath though.

if you have good dps in your group specialy if they are spamming abilities or the healer gets a good hefty heal crit,you will lose agro pretty easily as a paladin pre 40

paladins struggle to hold multiple targets because they are designed for major boss tanking or single target tanking, although marauders/warriors take more damage they are better for holding multiple targets basicly trash mobs or off tanking,until paladins get shield oath and a decent aoe attack emity ability paladins are gonna be the underdogs at lower lvl tanking.

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Originally Posted by Tanoshii

It doesn't matter what you do if DPS don't focus fire. People can beat their own drum all they want, but they aren't holding threat on all monsters if people are hitting them all. Its just not possible. I would suggest macroing a mark into your shield lob so its already marked on pulled.

It does get alot better after shield oath though.

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Got the marks on my hot bar, and when I tank it comes w/ a warning, you attack out of order, and you pull, its yours to have fun w/ and usually the healer is w/ me on that.

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Originally Posted by Phisen

Got the marks on my hot bar, and when I tank it comes w/ a warning, you attack out of order, and you pull, its yours to have fun w/ and usually the healer is w/ me on that.

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This goes for me, too. I mark my mobs before I pull. If you want to attack other mobs, do not complain at me if I don't get around to pulling them off immediately. My priority is keeping hate from the healer(s), as most DD classes can afford to take a couple of hits and should use their defensive abilities at this point (Stuns, Keen Flurry/Featherfoot/Foresight etc).

But as Tanoshii also says, if the DDs don't work with you as a tank, things can get out of control (almost) regardless of the tank's ability. A good party that cooperates is a well-oiled machine than succeeds as what it sets out to do. If that goes as planned, though, no tank should have many issues with or without Shield Oath.

Hello, I have not a problem holding hate yet except maybe a couple times but I find that flash > combo 1 > flash repeat is enough to hold hate on 3-4 mobs at a time just fine. Just if anyone is wondering certain dungeon bosses do have specific move sets that target SPECIFIC people in your party. Titans line attack targets anyone except the tank! I was kicking myself thinking I was losing hate, but noticed he turned away from me every time just that one move occurred. Its built into the game, know which moves they are either try to stun them out of them or make sure the rest of the group knows that they need to dodge it.

Thanks ALL for the feedback.

Going through everything most mentioned, I feel that I am performing to the best of my class's ability.

• My targets are all marked, via macro.
• I am managing multiple targets
• My combo's are, for the most part, similar to everyone's (I'll try the double shield lob when I get a chance)

• Shield Lob > Flash > Fast Blade > Savage Blage > Flash > Rage of Halone > Flash -- Repeat

• I'm blowing Fight or Flight constantly (although I think I'll start doing this more towards the beginning of the fight for increased dmg/enm

I don't really have trouble on trash packs, and most bosses go smoothly. But when things don't go well, bad healer, DD can't manage hate (or wants to blow CD's in the first few seconds of the fight) I've notice trouble getting things back into control.

I'll give you an example: In Qarn fighting bees, #1 Bee is half health and hate is fine, #2 bee hate is on me, but about half a bar on the healer, healer crits and #2 pulls from me to go after the healer, I provoke, Bee pauses like it's going to come back to me, then immediately goes back to the healer, so I shield lob then run over to flash, and all is good.

I've just noticed things like this, and fights like the Guardian that seem to give PLD trouble (at least for me) where a WAR has none.

Make sure you let your party aware of the enmity bar, I have found that many players never know what its for.

Also I found it to be easier to hold enmity when I pre mark all mobs and direct dps to follow kill order. Sometimes you find yourself with a dps who doesn't care.

Shield Lob is my go to ability when the mob gets out of range.

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Originally Posted by Dreamslave

Tanking in this game is certainly the easiest I've experienced in any of the 10+ MMO's I've ever played over the years. On a three mob pull, mark targets 1 and 2. Shield lob target one while running in, use flash, Quick blade on target one, savage blade on target 2, Rage of hamone on target three, flash again. Quick blade + Savage blade target one, rage of hamone target 2, quick blade plus savage on target three, rage of hamone on target 1. I tend to use the 6 second stun on a target when it's about 6 or less seconds from dying so I can focus on generating more emnity on the other targets and it prevents me from taking any more damage from that target.

This "rotation" isn't what I use every time either. If I know someone in the party does a ton of damage, I will target the number 1 marked target more often to produce more threat on him.

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Lol never saw wow then.

Like everyone else mentioned, my basic combo is also shield lob> flash> fast blade > savage strike > flash > rage of halone > FB,ST,RoT spam. I also try to add shield swipe whenever it's available, if I can get it in time. For stuns, unless it's a big attack or if it would hit other people, I just avoid them so I don't break my combo by using stun

The only thing is that for the first 2 or 3 combos of savage strike and rage of halone, I put each attack on different enemies by tabbing through them and apply the skill on each, so every mob gets enmity

So far I haven't bothered marking, and even when dps all hits a different target each, I can hold aggro on all mobs fine since they all have enough enmity. If an enemy does aggro someone else, I just provoke it and do a combo on it and that usually will regain and keep aggro on myself

i've only tanked until the 2nd primal fight, so I don't know if things changes later

No DPs or healer should ever be even close to you on threat if done right, especially single target. Even on a 3-5 pull, if people are following a kill order you should never have an issue unless you screw something up.

Wrong candy. You must run with some pretty low dps haha
Tanking in this game is definitely not the easiest. Wow is

When you provoke you should shield lob as soon as you provoke. All it does is bring you to the top of threat so you have to lob to get ahead. If not it will always run back to the person it was on before.