Buckler type shield vs Scutum type shield

Hello fellow Pld. Which type of shield do you prefer? Buckler vs Scutum.

I prefer shields with high block chance vs shields that mitigate a ton. After experimenting with both I am still not 100% positive which is "better" but I am starting to feel there may be situations where one or the other are best suited.

I personally prefer buckler-type shields. Maybe its because I like to see that I'm blocking frequently, but I'm not sure which ends up being better. They seem like that would be pretty balanced out because most rate/mitigate is just swapped. i.e. 19 mitigate 75 block rate - 75 mitigate 19 block rate

Shield Slash, in my opinion, is an EXCELLENT skill to use and when timed properly (and with a little luck) you can keep a full 6+ second stop on weapon skills of your target. This is why I like to block often rather then take every bit of damage or try to soften it.

Shield Slash doesn't work on EVERY mob or boss though but still worth it.

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Originally Posted by n1MB1s

Shield Slash, in my opinion, is an EXCELLENT skill to use and when timed properly (and with a little luck) you can keep a full 6+ second stop on weapon skills of your target. This is why I like to block often rather then take every bit of damage or try to soften it.

Shield Slash doesn't work on EVERY mob or boss though but still worth it.

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That's a really good point. Im leaning towards buckler type myself.

I prefer Kite Type

Speaking as a Warrior here.. I play Gladiator occasionally as 2nd class. Don't actually know which shield type is which, but I assume it boils down to choosing better block rate vs. better block amount.

Higher block rate wins (assuming other things equal). Here's why:

Compare the following 2 series of damage from enemy.
100, 75, 75, 100, 75, 75, 100, 75, 75 (higher block rate, smaller block amount, sum=750)
100, 50, 100, 100, 50, 100, 100, 50, 100 (higher block amount, smaller block rate, sum=750)
The total damage in the end is the same, but the point is to not die. The most likely times to die are when a big hit comes and you're low health. Thus the less frequently 100s occur, the better. The big hits occur more frequently in the high block amount/small block rate scenario.

Of course, should you have the choice between a big difference in block amount and just a small difference in block rate, then going for block amount is great.

Also, if you already have a really high block rate, even a mediocre increase in block amount could be a big reduction in total damage received. TL;DR: the "other things being equal" part matters a lot.

It's ye olde evasion vs. mitigation debate. One of the classics of MMO tanking across many games and has multiple forms in most games. Similar to HP vs. Def, Determination vs. Parry, and other flavors in other games. Mitigation always beats evasion when quantity is equal.

I tend to prefer block chance shields because of shield slash.

Sorry, I am a historic military buff and I kind of get annoyed with improper usage of terms when it comes to weapons. GLA/PLD use round shields and tower shields and CNJ/THM use decorative bucklers and targes.

Shield Swipe is your hardest hitting move for the lowest amount of TP and it also blocks the enemy's weaponskills for 6 seconds every time you hit with it. Rage of Halone hits harder but in order to do so you have to combo it off of Savage Blade. At 46 you get Bulwark, a skill that increases your block chance by 60% for 15 seconds so you could be able to use a tower rather effectively and still proc swipe in a long battle. If you already have a high block rate, say 150 you are already blocking a lot. Using Bulwark would increase it to 240 a whopping 90 point increase. Use it when you need to burn through a boss with a round shield and you will basically just be shield swiping for 15 seconds. At that point you won't need the threat from your Halone combo anyways.

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Originally Posted by Unaki

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Shield Swipe gives very little emnity ... so you will still be needing the halone combo no matter how many shield swipes you do. The only threat from swipe is the dmg you do with it x2 with shield oath vs x10 dmg with halone

Well High Block Chance helps with TP generation, however someone could quite easily calculate the mitigation you gain from one or the other.

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Originally Posted by Ariyn

Shield Swipe gives very little emnity ... so you will still be needing the halone combo no matter how many shield swipes you do. The only threat from swipe is the dmg you do with it x2 with shield oath vs x10 dmg with halone

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The point of the swipe is to keep DPS up while using a GCD on a low TP move to help with TP regen.

I think that both types are viable and knowledge of the fights and the damage outputs of bosses.I've theorized the following:
Less frequent heavy hitters = low block chance but with greater block strength to migitate the big damage numbers.
Fastst attackers with low damage outputs = higher block chance shield with a lower block strength.

Over all I think I personally like shields with equal stats. but there is room to think situationally.

Early game i think the high block rate is the way to go. End game when you have higher block rates and such from stats you can mix and match your shields. I would probably go a high block rate vs trash and high mitigation vs bosses. Wont be able to find out till i can actually get in there and tank some end game stuff, till then just my speculation.

Bro I just am dropping in to say, nice Supra, link to mods? I have a JZX90 1JZ PRO-AM/Demo car drift project...Toyota ftw.

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Originally Posted by Ariyn

Shield Swipe gives very little emnity ... so you will still be needing the halone combo no matter how many shield swipes you do. The only threat from swipe is the dmg you do with it x2 with shield oath vs x10 dmg with halone

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Like I said, At the point where you would be swipe spamming you shouldn't need enmity generation because you should be using Shield Oath. I didn't say to forego the Halone combo entirely. Weave your combo between swipes if you are blocking more than 60% of your shots.

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Originally Posted by Kryzen

Early game i think the high block rate is the way to go. End game when you have higher block rates and such from stats you can mix and match your shields. I would probably go a high block rate vs trash and high mitigation vs bosses. Wont be able to find out till i can actually get in there and tank some end game stuff, till then just my speculation.

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I still like round shields better for all situations. If a boss is going to be hitting me with a really hard attack I would rather mitigate 30% of the damage 65% of the time than 70% of the damage 20% of the time. Besides the PLD relic shield is a kite shield with the strength of a tower and the rate of a round so once you get that from the relic quest you won't have to answer that question.

Also, another reason in the 40s to run a round shield is your massive repertoire of mitigation; Rampart (20%/20sec), Foresight(20%/20sec), Sentinel(30%/10sec), Awareness(No crits for 25sec), Shield Oath(Permanent 20%).

I find that on mob pulls if I use a high block rate shield, i will be blocking too often that I can't get enough non-swipe moves in between them to keep halone debuff on even two mobs. So I like to use a high block strength shield.
I know you always have the option to NOT use shield swipe even when it's up but then the opportunity cost of using a block rate shield is wasted.
Of course for boss fight it will be less of a problem, and I know boss fight is all that matters, but I just don't see myself carrying two shields around all the time. Maybe if someone can prove rate shield really do offer net increase in migration then I will do that.

People keep mentioning that blocking increases TP generation. Where is it stated that this is the case?

I don't see it either. So far, i'm liking the high block rate do the fact I can Shield Swipe a boss and shut him up from using a move, it makes ALOT of difference. I already have like 3 cooldowns to reduce damage, a passive that reduces damage. Maybe once I get the cooldown that allows me to raise my block rate up, I'll get block strength, till then. block rating shields it is

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Originally Posted by Gray_Spy

Bro I just am dropping in to say, nice Supra, link to mods? I have a JZX90 1JZ PRO-AM/Demo car drift project...Toyota ftw.

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Off topic . S374 turbo. Fully built engine. 800 whp @ 32 psi e85 tune. Proefi engine management.1994 targa top 6 spd 72k miles. ;)

I read Scutum as scrotum, sorry.

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Originally Posted by Kryzen

Early game i think the high block rate is the way to go. End game when you have higher block rates and such from stats you can mix and match your shields. I would probably go a high block rate vs trash and high mitigation vs bosses. Wont be able to find out till i can actually get in there and tank some end game stuff, till then just my speculation.

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The thing is that this outlook only works if you have a mechanic that guarantees shield blocks, which we currently don't.

Maybe I'm the odd man out, but I feel that tower shiels are once again relegated as wastes of space like they were in FFXI. I know there's a whole real-life thing going on with shield design, but that doesn't mean much when you get more bang for you buck with one. Sure, you could waste stats and pump up block rate through other means, but that means you're not putting points into STR and VIT.

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Originally Posted by Unaki

Besides the PLD relic shield is a kite shield with the strength of a tower and the rate of a round so once you get that from the relic quest you won't have to answer that question.

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Ugh, if this is the case then history really is repeating itself. =/

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Originally Posted by Gray_Spy

Bro I just am dropping in to say, nice Supra, link to mods? I have a JZX90 1JZ PRO-AM/Demo car drift project...Toyota ftw.

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I am a Toyota Guy myself and in Japan. I have a 4AGE AE86 if that matters =P. I also cant figure out what Shield type to go with. I have been leaning towards high block rate thou....

High block rate for me.
When SE finally realize we need our interrupts off GCD and give them a lengthy CD, having a second one (pacification) is going to be big.

I'm currently using a round shield at 50, but I will say that the thought of Bulwark combined with a tower shield intrigues me. The 3 minute CD on Bulwark is the only thing keeping me from trying it.

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Originally Posted by klops

I'm currently using a round shield at 50, but I will say that the thought of Bulwark combined with a tower shield intrigues me. The 3 minute CD on Bulwark is the only thing keeping me from trying it.

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I've tried mixing my shields up when I had fairly equal options at the same time and neither myself or my WHM have noticed a large difference in the amount of damage I take. I've also noticed that on quite a few bosses Shield Swipe is basically pointless aside from the damage that it does as I hardly ever see the Pacify debuff show up. So for me the tower shield wins. I do plan on going with the relic as soon as I can get it though.

higher block chance with lower defense seems better for multiple target tanking like trash mobs, and lower block rate with higher defense seems better for single targets like boss's

For Paladin the Higher Block rate will ALWAYS win because of having the Shield Swipe ability. But just in case that High block strength end game item drops, don't hesitate because of Bulwark's 60% block rate increase. It's basically a shield wall.

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Originally Posted by klops

I'm currently using a round shield at 50, but I will say that the thought of Bulwark combined with a tower shield intrigues me. The 3 minute CD on Bulwark is the only thing keeping me from trying it.

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At 50, I can't imagine not-using a Kite shield. The argument between round shields and scutums should only last as long as it takes to be able to equip Kite shields.

All the endgame shields so far have balanced stats like kite shields anyways, so the argument is pretty much moot. I picked up a darklight kite shield in wanderer's palace last night, and it has both good stats and looks awsome.

Scutum-type for me, I like the look and style. IDK if you guys noticed but the block strength affects damage taken even when you don't block/parry.

Kite shield is middle ground probably the best scutum is pretty badass with bulwark but high block rate shield is pretty bad imo

I love Shield Swipe. I love to Shield Swipe everything. It doesn't work on Primals, or Savra, or some Dungeon Bosses that I've noticed. (But I think I was able to use it on that Duchess chick in Haukee Manor. I know Stun stopped her.) Otherwise, I use it in Fates and on Mobs of a higher level than me. It's great on Bombs. Shield-Swipe being available is why I use Round Shields mostly, so I can have that ability available to proc as much as possible.

Kites seem better middle ground. But I want the nice-peaceful feeling of knowning Shield Swipe is always there and ready.

And, as a side note, I FREAKING LOVE to Shield Bash stuff after the 6 seconds from Shield Swipe. It feels like I can nerf most monsters at a whim and I just can't get over not having those two abilities.