Merit System

YES PLEASE!

Absolutely not. The merit system in xi was an afterthought at best, and it seriously lacked any sort of real character building.

Give us a real character building system instead.

Sphere grid, licence board, talent trees..

Unless each is directly linked to a class/job good luck making the system balanced enough to encourage rather then killing the freedom that the job system brings.

(Then you run into what WoW found out that there is only one or two good builds - so good luck making each skill desirable...)

No thanks. The merit system in XI was implemented so those who had reach the cap can have a motivation to exp and give those close to the cap a group to join. However, a merit system for XIV wouldn't be productive, at least not at this point. We already know the cap will be increase eventually, so I don't see a need for this type of system at the moment, in fact, I don't see a need for this system at any point in this game.

No thanks, instead, give use a talent tree for more character customization.

I want it, or something similar.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Twiddle

No... next!

---

^^^^^^^^^^^

I would be cool with a merit system, if done properly. It would give incentive for people at max level to keep killing monsters, along with spiritbinding and farming certain items like Karakul Fleece, etc. Though, it would be tricky to implement if Yoshi and his team plan to raise the level cap soon.

I think the best way to implement a merit system would be after they've established a solid level cap for a while, and also bring back the level sync system. This would encourage max-level players who need merit points to party up with lower-level players who just simply want to get their class/job up. In doing so, with proper mob placement in each map, this would also keep each area of the game more relevant as well.

One of the biggest problems that me and my friends have with MMO's in general is the fact that, if we don't start playing at the same time and at the same speed, then our character levels would get too far apart to effectively do anything fun together. One of us would be going through endgame dungeons while the other would still be stuck trying to get his first job unlocked or something... it's very inconvenient. Having something along the lines of level sync and merits would alleviate that, and would possibly also get rid of the current power-leveling problems because veteran players could still help out newer players by actually showing them how to fight instead of killing things for them. I really think it would strengthen the game overall, as well as the community. :)

You know we seem to be getting these posts for XI features with absolutely no explanation in the OP. So, why do you actually think this is a good idea? I didn't play XI so humor me, explain it in detail.

I'd rather not have a talent tree, but I'd like something to drop points into to power up my character slightly more.

doesnt have to be like the one in 11, a sphere grid or something would be cool. I just hope there is something for us after we reach the max lvl

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kairyu

doesnt have to be like the one in 11, a sphere grid or something would be cool. I just hope there is something for us after we reach the max lvl

---

Well as someone who never played XI, I have no idea what the "merit system" even entails at all. That's the problem with having absolutely no explanation in the OP. Believe it or not some people didn't play XI and have no idea what you're talking about, or maybe it's just me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Endigiont

I'd rather not have a talent tree, but I'd like something to drop points into to power up my character slightly more.

---

Agreed. Even blizzard realized that talent trees are old news, which is why they nixed them in the most recent version of wow. I'd like a system that gave us some abilities that allowed us to differentiate our characters without having clear "bests".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Well as someone who never played XI, I have no idea what the "merit system" even entails at all. That's the problem with having absolutely no explanation in the OP. Believe it or not some people didn't play XI and have no idea what you're talking about, or maybe it's just me.

---

Graphically its a mess and Id argue down any idea of bringing it back graphically (its basically the classic FF way too many menus type of deal).

Game play wise when you hit max level you still collect EXP once you get enough EXP (I think its basically a levels worth of EXP) you get a point you can spend on things like faster attack speed or more health. You can spend the points for your character in general or spend them on class specifics. There was a limit on how many points you could put into each category.

In short it adds levels where you get to customize what "leveled up" about your character.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Well as someone who never played XI, I have no idea what the "merit system" even entails at all. That's the problem with having absolutely no explanation in the OP. Believe it or not some people didn't play XI and have no idea what you're talking about, or maybe it's just me.

---

Here: http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Category:Merit_Points

Long story short, after you reach the level cap, you can still gain "exp," but when you "level," you instead get a merit point, which can be spent to either improve your stats or enhance your abilities.

I didn't play FF11 long enough to get to that point, but a friend of mine who did said that, alongside level syncing (which I have no idea why they didn't implement it in FF14, it was ingenious imo), it made it to where both low-level and high-level players could do things together.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shougun

Sphere grid, licence board, talent trees..

Unless each is directly linked to a class/job good luck making the system balanced enough to encourage rather then killing the freedom that the job system brings.

(Then you run into what WoW found out that there is only one or two good builds - so good luck making each skill desirable...)

---

^^^ My vote is for a license board.

Talent tree's are a pretty bad design when you can't have multiple characters. I would hate to have my character only good in one structure to later find out that I'm not good for certain boss fights.

Merits is too much for early on in the game as well. I would love to focus on the battles instead of trying to find a new balance with skills.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NinjaPanda

Talent tree's are a pretty bad design when you can't have multiple characters. I would hate to have my character only good in one structure to later find out that I'm not good for certain boss fights.

Merits is too much for early on in the game as well. I would love to focus on the battles instead of trying to find a new balance with skills.

---

I disagree with this. Only because each class would undoubtedly have its own tree that wouldn't affect your other classes.

There needs to be some sort of build system if they want to seriously tackle pvp.

I would like to have points aside from exp from mobs, so you can spend on learning and expanding on skills. I don't think they should come easy though, maybe you should only get them after completing dungeons and stuff.

I like the idea of license boards from FFXII and it would fit with which ever grand company you've joined adding another feature to it. Add them in Tier's for level 50 are tier 1 then for future level cap tier 2 license etc. but each job is separate and can spec it individually and some depth to this feature.

I don't understand why everyone hates the merit system from ffxi so much. I thought it was great lol. It gave me a reason to continue to get experience. It's dumb that now at 50, you get experience and it goes nowhere. I'd love something in place that continued to make my character better when I hit the max level besides just getting better gear. It doesn't have to be the same as the merit system I suppose, but there should be something.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SodRansom

I don't understand why everyone hates the merit system from ffxi so much. I thought it was great lol. It gave me a reason to continue to get experience. It's dumb that now at 50, you get experience and it goes nowhere. I'd love something in place that continued to make my character better when I hit the max level besides just getting better gear. It doesn't have to be the same as the merit system I suppose, but there should be something.

---

i think people dislike it because it become a chore, after max lvl you have to do it or you are gimped. whats the point of being max lvl if you still have to xp

Let's keep posting more recycled ideas from FFXI and other MMOs!

{Fun}{Excitement}

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by syntaxlies

i think people dislike it because it become a chore, after max lvl you have to do it or you are gimped. whats the point of being max lvl if you still have to xp

---

Yeah, that's kind the inherent problem with MMO's isn't it? No one appreciates the journey. It's "gotta be uber maxed out everything right away!" But then, once you get there, people start complaining about being bored lol. I fall victim to that myself sometimes, and I have to remind myself to appreciate not being max level yet, and still having a goal that I'm chasing. I'd just like there to be SOMETHING to do at the top level that makes your experience count for something. A couple people have mentioned a talent tree, maybe it could be something like that. Something that's more about customizing then it is about raising the bar for your character.

How about a Crystal Chronicles kinda deal? You find artifacts at the end of each dungeon and you choose one. You can gather all artifacts multiple times but you can only use one of each artifact for each class. I think that would encourage people to revisit these dungeons and keep that low-level content in circulation.

Merit system was designed because SE didn't want to raise the cap on FFXI, but they eventually did later. All it did was to make you spend a lot more time grinding to gain higher combat ratings and stats that you would of normally got with traditional leveling. Needless to say lv50 is no way going to be the final FFXIV cap.

I dont think it is necessary to create a customization system ONLY for max level - and whatever customization they do it per class (other wise you would screw yourself into only being able to play mages or melee or only gather/crafter). I dont think obtaining points needs to be only from levels and at every level up either - some could be from achievements and the like.

A true discussion would require an idea of which system to be using and how to make it not a "this build is always better then that build" system (something the WoW devs struggled with (because its hard not because they are bad.. :P))

Please stop with the XI rehashes. It's so old now. Npc's, Mobs, Raid area types, sure no problem.
game mechanics please leave them there. I could see a Dyna type of event in this game taking
place in a 1.0 type area were you kinda relive the final days of the sixth astral era. Maybe even
have white raven be the Dynamis lord of this game. Anything doing with the EXP system in that
game should stay there.

XI player seem to have these rose colored glass for grinding endlessly like it's fun. the first 4 years of that
game was a bitch to level in. Plus we have a materia system in this game, and we are no where near a final
cap. it's way to early to be talking about cheap system to try and keep people playing.

no thanks more grinding after i cap out.
you guys need to stop living in the past and ask for something we haven't seen.

Well in WoW, at Endgame, you can do PVP for PVP gear, or Raids for PVE gear.

I still to this day hate you need to gear up for each.

However the variety in PVP Battle Grounds or Arena, is actually a lot of fun and gives the game a hell of a lot more life at end game. (Sadly the gear only helps you in PVP... Damned Resilience stat so lame)


Oh wait what? Sorry I got off track.

Anyhow the merit system was't even original to FFXI, it was called Alternative Advancement in Everquest, and you could decide how much EXP you wanted to go to AA (Before and After Max Level) I honestly think EQ did it better, you could improve just about any aspect of your character, and each expansion had unique AA points for it, new spells / stat adjustments, which was pretty cool that it was an always expanding system, were as FFXI was more limited only at max level very few things to put points into and rarely updated / expanded.

Oh wait what? What point was I getting at?

I dunno.

I'd like to see something unique in FFXIV but I'd still like to see something to differ from person to person instead of talent trees and definitely not the cookie cutter everyone has the same spells / abilities / (Race) Base stats and Gear and to some extent skill is the only modifier for a player.

I lost my point..

You guys are complaining about grinding exp after cap to buff your character? How long did it take you to get to max level? Took me 19 days of playing casually (2-3 hours a day, and not even 100% focusing on leveling) to get my first solo fifty. It took me a almost a year an a half to get to cap in XI.

Merits are not a bad idea. Everyone playing would probably have a few of them just by running dungeons or spiritbonding.

If I can get to 50 in less than 19 days; its no wonder so many people have relics. We need long term goals. People need to stop hating on XI because long term goals was something it did right.

I'm more interested in what a merit system, along with level sync and a few other things, would do for the game as a whole.

Consider the following:

- If you had been playing FF14 since launch, and one of your good friends wanted to start playing as well, wouldn't you guys want to play TOGETHER? In most RPG's, when there's such a large level difference, there's not a lot you CAN do in which the both of you would benefit. With level sync and merits, max-level players can party alongside lower-level players. While the lowbie player does leves, farms monsters, etc., the max-level player will still get exp proportionate to whatever level he's synced down to (in this case, whatever the low-level player is), and work on customizing his character further (such as an Enhanced Rampart, additional +enmity stats, etc.). Without such systems, one of you would probably be doing endgame dungeons and primal fights while the other would still be hitting dodos with a stick.

- Since both players can party together effectively, it discourages the rapid power-leveling and "why don't you know how to play your job?" problems that's been seen in FF14. Previously, the high-level player parties up with whoever needs to be PL'd, gets claim on all the monsters, gets kicked from the party (that technically ALSO has claim on the monsters), then kills all of them with something like Steel Cyclone, Firaga, etc., gets re-invited back, and repeats the process when the mob camp respawns. The high-level player does all of the work and doesn't get anything out of it (unless he/she forces the other players to pay him, lol), while the low-level players getting PL'd stand around and do nothing, don't learn how to play their jobs, and probably go afk to make themselves a sammich or something. With level sync, EVERYONE has to cooperate together; with merits, the high-level player has a reason to be in the party, but can still help show the less-experienced players how to play their jobs by way of example. In the long run, it also encourages camaraderie amongst the community when players can get together and effectively accomplish something together.

- If done correctly, it can also make certain maps more relevant and worth coming back to. I remember seeing my friends often fighting colibris in places like Ronfaure S(?) in FF11 because they said it was easier to get exp in level sync parties than it was trying to take out much more formidable monsters in other, more "end-game" areas. Along with the usual quests, NM's, dungeons, etc., little things like this can help make each area more engaging and interesting, as well as memorable. I'm sure anyone who has played FF11 for even as brief a time as I have remembers areas like Valkurm Dunes, or Qufim Islands because they were prime areas for leveling... it was almost a "rite of passage" in a way. Finally, giving each area more significance would help encourage a wider distribution of players across the maps, meaning (unless the population was spread REALLY thin), everyone could find something to do with others in each area, instead of certain areas being ghost towns or packed to the point of server lag.

- Along with the right gear and materia, merits can promote unique character builds. You could make a PLD that's near-impossible to pull aggro off of, or another one that can shrug off a Hellfire with ease. You could have a BLM that's really good at managing its MP, or one that can crit with Thundaga almost every time for insane damage. Yes, I realize that this can get into the "you should always build this way or else you'll suck" mentality, but if it was properly balanced, it could provide a lot of choices that would cater to how each individual likes to play.



Finally, as a side note (and this goes for any topic, not just this one): Who the hell cares if it was in FF11, or WoW, or whatever other game. Good game design in general encompasses ALL games. Hell, pretty much any standard RPG since freakin' Dungeons & Dragons has used experience points and levels because it works and sets a standard. A HELLUVA lot of games let your character jump as a means to get from point A to point B, to dodge or attack *coughdragooncough,* or utilize other game mechanics, such as hitting blocks in Mario games.

Instead of being butthurt because "it was too grindy," or "looking at people jump gives me cancer," or *insert anything related to grass here,* ask yourself how such ideas helped make the game FUN, or INTUITIVE by design, IMMERSIVE through graphics and sound, or otherwise SUCCESSFUL as a whole, and see if it's worth such blunt criticism. :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kairyu

YES PLEASE!

---

Something to build up your own characters is needed. Not sure if it has to be Merit System or something new.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TomCarroll

Give us a real character building system instead.

---

I love the spirit withing Merit System, and I would really like something similar in ARR. A system that let you boost your characters ( in a limited way, so you have to make a choice ) once you reach the cap level. (Maybe it's quite early in game though...)

They should add something like this but each job can spec it not like XI was to limited on that aspect.