Live Letter Alpha rubber-banding and lag

The live letter is filled with footage of this happening but it's really noticeable at about 1:31:58. You start seeing a lot of running in place and teleporting. Keep watching the bottom right when they minimize the game and you'll see a lot more.

It's alpha. This is exactly what they're testing. They have (triple digit number) of players, plus mobs / NPCs, and they're testing the limits of the zone capacity. I'm assuming all of the things you've mentioned are side effects. They said they're fixing the issue for the next week and then continuing the testing for 5 days after that, and then opening it up for global alpha.

Don't criticize like the game is the finished product. They're just under half a year from release.

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Originally Posted by Rex

I'm assuming.

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Thank you for that.

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Originally Posted by Rex

Don't criticize like the game is the finished product. They're just under half a year from release.

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This is exactly the attitude that got us the 1.0 launch. Don't assume that SE will fix everything to your expectations if you don't say anything about it.

Please please criticize this game if you see problems with it. If you don't, how else will SE know what you want or where they need improvement?

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Originally Posted by Rex

It's alpha.

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Careful with those matches now.
You don't want to get burned again.

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Originally Posted by Gramul

Careful with those matches now.
You don't want to get burned again.

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It's alright. Alpha is currently doing precisely what it's supposed to be doing, seeing at which point that rubberbanding starts and ends.
So from this we can presume that alpha testing is running on schedule?

OMG! PANIC! DESTROY THE GAME!! JUST START OVER!!!

This is why they do testings, to ensure that the game is stable for launch.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

Thank you for that.

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what's he assuming, they have stated this.

Thank you for another, Boy who cried wolf thread.

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Originally Posted by Genjuro

This is why they do testings, to ensure that the game is stable for launch.

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The players, along with developers that work with said players, ensure that a game is stable for launch.

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Originally Posted by Xmbei

what's he assuming, they have stated this.

Thank you for another, Boy who cried wolf thread.

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Assuming was his words, not hers.

No offense but devs only care about (technical) alpha feedback from people in the alpha, not people watching a youtube stream

I guess what I'm really trying to say is...whats the point of the thread? wish I could sage

he wasn't assuming he was relaying info that Yoshi and the dev rep's have told us. They are currently fixing these issues for the next test, if it does well they will send the code to the other regional servers, patch them, then open up for global alpha. If it fails they extend it till the issue is fixed. This has been stated on the forums by the rep's and yoshi, already. So there is no assumptions. there has been a message relay to inform the ill informed. again a gd Boy who cried wolf thread. This as already been addressed by Yoshi and the team, on the forums and the live letter. We don't need 15 more of these threads. find your answers before asking something you assume is not known.

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Originally Posted by Xmbei

he wasn't assuming he was relaying info that Yoshi and the dev rep's have told us. They are currently fixing these issues for the next test, if it does well they will send the code to the other regional servers, patch them, then open up for global alpha. If it fails they extend it till the issue is fixed. This has been stated on the forums by the rep's and yoshi, already. So there is no assumptions. there has been a message relay to inform the ill informed. again a gd Boy who cried wolf thread. This as already been addressed by Yoshi and the team, on the forums and the live letter. We don't need 15 more of these threads. find your answers before asking something you assume is not known.

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If you can link or tell me where in the live letter they talk about it I would appreciate it. For now I'll just take your word for it. Anyways, this thread is just pointing something out that irks me. I want to love FFXIV just like everyone here, that's why I point these things out.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

The players, along with developers that work with said players, ensure that a game is stable for launch.

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Yeah, I'm sure you were the only one who noticed that too. I mean, I guess them sitting there on the game themselves couldn't be accurate as a cryptic observation via a live webfeed. You're so insightful. lol

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

If you can link or tell me where in the live letter they talk about it I would appreciate it. For now I'll just take your word for it. Anyways, this thread is just pointing something out that irks me. I want to love FFXIV just like everyone here, that's why I point these things out.

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Here
Bayohne
Community Rep
Join Date
Mar 2011
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Q27: When can overseas players join the Alpha Test?
A27: The first phase of the Alpha Test has been completed, and we have managed to solve almost all of the issues when player numbers increase. We've made it possible to safely run the game with 800 people in a single area, but once it the area exceeds 800 people we've seen some heavy lag. Next week will not have an Alpha Test and we'll be focusing on fixing this. The week after if we are able to hold five days of tests with no issues, we will open Alpha globally on 11/26.

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Originally Posted by KyahAlmasy

Yeah, I'm sure you were the only one who noticed that too. I mean, I guess them sitting there on the game themselves couldn't be accurate as a cryptic observation via a live webfeed. You're so insightful. lol

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Just because I'm sure they noticed it doesn't tell me they're going to spend more money and resources fixing it.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

If you can link or tell me where in the live letter they talk about it I would appreciate it. For now I'll just take your word for it. Anyways, this thread is just pointing something out that irks me. I want to love FFXIV just like everyone here, that's why I point these things out.

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Why don't you go and read the live letters because they mention server stability all the time. They mentioned that currently you can play with (3 digit number) people on the screen with no lag, but after that there are some complications that they are working on fixing. What Xmbei is saying is that there is no point in splitting hairs about trivial things that have already been acknowledged and are being fixed. If you're going to provide feedback, at least make it useful.

/end thread

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Originally Posted by Xmbei

Bayohne
Community Rep
Join Date
Mar 2011
Posts
568
Q27: When can overseas players join the Alpha Test?
A27: The first phase of the Alpha Test has been completed, and we have managed to solve almost all of the issues when player numbers increase. We've made it possible to safely run the game with 800 people in a single area, but once it the area exceeds 800 people we've seen some heavy lag. Next week will not have an Alpha Test and we'll be focusing on fixing this. The week after if we are able to hold five days of tests with no issues, we will open Alpha globally on 11/26.

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Exactly what I wanted to see. Every other post is just talk. Thank you.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

Just because I'm sure they noticed it doesn't tell me they're going to spend more money and resources fixing it.

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Then you don't understand what Alpha "Testing" is. lol

Case closed.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

The live letter is filled with footage of this happening but it's really noticeable at about 1:31:58. You start seeing a lot of running in place and teleporting. Keep watching the bottom right when they minimize the game and you'll see a lot more.

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i was going to bring this up, but for obvious reasons i left it well enough alone.

people that are saying its just alpha fail to realize that Rubber Banding is a number one issue in all Finished MMO's, not do to poorly coded clients but do to a servers inability to handle data. XIV's original launch was just as crappy and this was with 1000's of people in the starting area's, not 800 people. Regression is not good

in the 1.0 alpha, just getting off the ferry dock at the beginning of the game was an exercise in frustration. People don't really realize how much a game usually changes from alpha to release. 1.0 changed a lot from alpha to middle-of-beta, the problem was it didn't change from beta to release.

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people that are saying its just alpha fail to realize that Rubber Banding is a number one issue in all Finished MMO's, not do to poorly coded clients but do to a servers inability to handle data. XIV's original launch was just as crappy and this was with 1000's of people in the starting area's, not 800 people. Regression is not good

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We're not regressing. I haven't played one MMO where there was rubberbanding that was not caused by poor connectivity. Rubberbanding in any online game occurs when your client and server eaach believe you are in a different location than you actually are- this is generally caused by severe lag, not any particular flaw in the client or server itself.

This reminds me of Alpha Testing 1.0

exact words were words to defend the game...

Lets hope it doesn't happen again

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Originally Posted by Thunderz

This reminds me of Alpha Testing 1.0

exact words were words to defend the game...

Lets hope it doesn't happen again

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Actually I kinda hope it happens again. That way they can fix it. Again this is assuming the worst case scenario that they didn't notice and fix anything but are just following the same motions again.

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Originally Posted by Genjuro

Actually I kinda hope it happens again. That way they can fix it. Again this is assuming the worst case scenario that they didn't notice and fix anything but are just following the same motions again.

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I don't want to BETA test a game again

if they screw up ARR I won't play this game simple fact

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Originally Posted by Thunderz

I don't want to BETA test a game again

if they screw up ARR I won't play this game simple fact

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True. This is SE's last hope. I'm sure that a lot of people will feel the same.

If this doesn't make it, I'm sure a whole new restructuring will be in effect, and it won't just be the development team, it'll probably be the head of SE, Wada himself.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

If you can link or tell me where in the live letter they talk about it I would appreciate it. For now I'll just take your word for it. Anyways, this thread is just pointing something out that irks me. I want to love FFXIV just like everyone here, that's why I point these things out.

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Keep in mind, though... You mention it happening almost at the end of the video. For the entire video up to that point, consider how smoothly and well it performs.

How many people you reckon were on-screen with him at any given time, as well as in the immediate area but that exceeded the draw limit? All the running, jumping, emoting, fighting, spell-casting, people on Chocobos, running around mobs and NPCs, etc. Look how smoothly it's running -even for an Alpha build.

I was pretty damn impressed with how great it looks and smoothly it's running for being an earlier Alpha build. That they felt confident enough to show that live while doing the broadcast, and were relaxed enough to joke around, and speak very frankly and confidently about the game speaks volumes as well - or should anyway.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

Just because I'm sure they noticed it doesn't tell me they're going to spend more money and resources fixing it.

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With the expense they've put into turning this game around to date, all the revamping, re-building, all the staff they've dedicated to it, the expense put into even creating that "End of An Era" video we just saw (which is not cheap to produce), the months they lost revenue by keeping the game running without charging players a dime to log in and play, you seriously need to be told that they'd do what's necessary to fix an issue with lag in order for you to believe it?

Wow. I gotta say, there's cynicism... and then there's you, which I'd rank at verging on obstinate intellectual dishonesty.

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

This is exactly the attitude that got us the 1.0 launch. Don't assume that SE will fix everything to your expectations if you don't say anything about it.

Please please criticize this game if you see problems with it. If you don't, how else will SE know what you want or where they need improvement?

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You obviously weren't there on the 11th final event and how we weren't able to move or do shit at all for that matter with only 200 ppl in mor dhona which is a HUGE zone bcuz of massive lag that alpha footage is pulling off something x1000 better already so STFU with that over used card already

Hope you're right Preypacer.

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Originally Posted by Thunderz

This reminds me of Alpha Testing 1.0

exact words were words to defend the game...

Lets hope it doesn't happen again

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The difference with 1.0 is that Tanaka wouldn't admit there were problems with the game. He was not frank and open about how things were, what wasn't right and what needed fixing. Even to this day, after leaving SE, he won't admit that he screwed up. He passively puts the blame on the developers/designers he was directing.

The problem isn't in people saying "It's Alpha, you're going to see these things". That's 100% true. That's why Alpha tests and Beta tests exist in software development.

The problem isn't in acknowledging the issues... the problem, with 1.0, was that those issues weren't adequately addressed or prevented when they should have been.

Yoshi-P is not Tanaka.

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Originally Posted by Preypacer

Keep in mind, though... You mention it happening almost at the end of the video. For the entire video up to that point, consider how smoothly and well it performs.

How many people you reckon were on-screen with him at any given time, as well as in the immediate area but that exceeded the draw limit? All the running, jumping, emoting, fighting, spell-casting, people on Chocobos, running around mobs and NPCs, etc. Look how smoothly it's running -even for an Alpha build.

I was pretty damn impressed with how great it looks and smoothly it's running for being an earlier Alpha build. That they felt confident enough to show that live while doing the broadcast, and were relaxed enough to joke around, and speak very frankly and confidently about the game speaks volumes as well - or should anyway.

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Thank you.. I couldnt put it words as well as you did. 1.0 was terrible taking 5 mins for an NPC to load so you could get a damn CS... let alone find your friends unless you were outside the city.. the point of the video shows everyone doing action/emotes and what not while running through the city and charactor disappear just as fast as new ones pop up... so if you say this looks bad... go play something else and stop harassing the dev teams hard work. Keep it up Yoshi-P see you in alpha/beta

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

This is exactly the attitude that got us the 1.0 launch. Don't assume that SE will fix everything to your expectations if you don't say anything about it.

Please please criticize this game if you see problems with it. If you don't, how else will SE know what you want or where they need improvement?

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Criticizing things here does us no good. All we're going on are assumptions and youtube videos. We know very little and we won't know much until we get our hands on the game. There's a huge difference between seeing it and playing it.

The only people who can really get SE's attention and let them know what's wrong are those currently in the Alpha. If you really care about the future of the game, you'll work on finding/submitting bug reports and feedback if you get into the Alpha and Betas.

The problem with 1.0 was not just the lack of criticism, because believe me it got a lot of that. The problem was the devs didn't listen to a single word of it. People spoke up a ton about how bad a state the game was in. A good portion were also trying to be optimistic about it but everyone could see how bad it was.

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Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

Hope you're right Preypacer.

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No need to. Regarding the lag, as people have already explained, and provided a link to, Yoshi-P and the devs are aware of it, have openly acknowledged it, and are working to correct it, basing the future testing schedule on their results.

Yoshi-P has been quite direct and open in telling us what's going on. He's been equally open in telling us when things wouldn't be done yet, or if they weren't decided on yet, or what not.

If this were Tanaka, doing things "The Tanaka Way" for a second time around, I'd be right there with you. Thankfully for us, it's not.

With all those people around there WILL be some lag. No matter how good the servers are.

I'm more amazed that some are surprised. Have you ever played a MMORPG?

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Originally Posted by elets

Thank you.. I couldnt put it words as well as you did. 1.0 was terrible taking 5 mins for an NPC to load so you could get a damn CS... let alone find your friends unless you were outside the city.. the point of the video shows everyone doing action/emotes and what not while running through the city and charactor disappear just as fast as new ones pop up... so if you say this looks bad... go play something else and stop harassing the dev teams hard work. Keep it up Yoshi-P see you in alpha/beta

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No problem, and thank you :)

I wouldn't suggest people "go away" though. That won't do the game any good. I think some people just need to sorta stop focusing on only "looking for issues", and also take the time to notice how much is going right with the game... even just on its own merits, nevermind compared to the rolling train wreck that was 1.0.

I just found it kind of astonishing that, out of a video running over 1.5 hours, showing live, un-doctored and un-edited alpha footage that was running beautifully for almost the entire time, that all of that would be completely overlooked and ignored due to a brief period of apparent lag/rubber-banding near the end. I mean, you have to seriously be focused on seeing only the negatives in something to miss so much of the positive in it.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

With all those people around there WILL be some lag. No matter how good the servers are.

I'm more amazed that some are surprised. Have you ever played a MMORPG?

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lol good point, that.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

With all those people around there WILL be some lag. No matter how good the servers are.

I'm more amazed that some are surprised. Have you ever played a MMORPG?

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Yet in that alpha video a shitload of ppl is clogging his char on purpose to test stress and he moves his char fluidly w/o a problem and everyone else's actions seem responsive and fluid too he finds a mob that aggros and BAM BAM!! combos it to death with that army of ppl following him no waiting 10 mins of clicking ability to finally go off

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Originally Posted by Warlock

You obviously weren't there on the 11th final event and how we weren't able to move or do shit at all for that matter with only 200 ppl in mor dhona which is a HUGE zone bcuz of massive lag that alpha footage is pulling off something x1000 better already so STFU with that over used card already

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So just because ARR Alpha is looking better than 1.0's terrible server structure means that it's flawless and can't be criticized or improved upon?

Saying that it's only Alpha/Beta as a defense for the game is what's overused and what happened too much for 1.0.

Oh, and yeah, I was there for the 11th event.

Stop the griefing already! The topics been linked and answered why must that mean the topic can keep going and decompose into a cesspool again... It is break time for us can we stop this already. ( ofc it wont i know this. But this is just annoying now)