refresh

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10-31-2012, 06:36 AM
Majidah

refresh

would you prefer for refresh to play a more important role in 2.0?
I kind of wish it did.
Like in XI refresh and haste gear made a brutal difference.
10-31-2012, 06:39 AM
vax

I don't see a class/job having to cast refrest and haste one by one working on XIV, also i don't see haste working. But i see some Refresh AOE like Ballad or the TP regen, also a spell AOE that reduce the cost of WS and spells.
10-31-2012, 07:07 AM
Punainen

That's just why we need a RDM. Since they wont be the master healers or master casters, they should be the master buffers.
10-31-2012, 07:09 AM
Urthdigger

I actually didn't like how in XI some stats were so ungodly important that they trumped absolutely everything. I'd rather refresh stay the way it is: Nice, but not something that completely makes or breaks the game.
10-31-2012, 07:12 AM
Antanias

I can kinda see Refresh working since mages will have to be in active mode to cast in 2.0, but not haste due to battles starting with full TP.
10-31-2012, 07:12 AM
Majidah

I was speaking about refresh and haste equipment btw! haha
10-31-2012, 08:14 AM
Orophin

I wouldn't mind some equipment having Refresh, but I agree with others that Haste became too valuable a stat to not have so maybe it shouldn't be on gear. Yoshi stated some time ago that he didn't plan on implementing a Haste spell anytime soon. Mages have gotten by well enough with a Refresh spell as well, so I don't see it being necessary to implement anytime soon either.
10-31-2012, 08:25 AM
Elexia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urthdigger

I actually didn't like how in XI some stats were so ungodly important that they trumped absolutely everything. I'd rather refresh stay the way it is: Nice, but not something that completely makes or breaks the game.

About that...the same thing happens in XIV.
10-31-2012, 08:59 AM
Rau

iirc, Yoshida said he hated how XI relied so much on haste+ gear and is going to try get away from that mentality.
10-31-2012, 09:14 AM
Undrentide

we already have autorefresh as BLM...it is noticeable...id say leave it as it is.....we want to move away from a class just casting the same few spells over and over again....
10-31-2012, 09:21 AM
Elexia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undrentide

we already have autorefresh as BLM...it is noticeable...id say leave it as it is.....we want to move away from a class just casting the same few spells over and over again....

Bard says what's up. Black Mage says what's up.
10-31-2012, 09:25 AM
Hohenheim

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punainen

That's just why we need a RDM. Since they wont be the master healers or master casters, they should be the master buffers.

They should master nothing that is Rdm's role in old final fantasy
10-31-2012, 09:25 AM
SwordCoheir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orophin

Mages have gotten by well enough with a Refresh spell as well, so I don't see it being necessary to implement anytime soon either.

Agreed, besides that the way the new TP system is going to be, it seems like it would nullify the usefulness of haste just like store TP.
10-31-2012, 09:47 AM
Wolfie

No, having one or two required and blatantly overpowered stats is bad.
10-31-2012, 09:52 AM
moriandrio

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undrentide

we already have autorefresh as BLM...it is noticeable...id say leave it as it is.....we want to move away from a class just casting the same few spells over and over again....

thunder/ra/ga flare did i forget something?
10-31-2012, 10:04 AM
Wilan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punainen

That's just why we need a RDM. Since they wont be the master healers or master casters, they should be the master buffers.

What part of Jack of all trades, master of none are you not getting?
10-31-2012, 10:04 AM
Elexia

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriandrio

thunder/ra/ga flare did i forget something?

Yeah, you forgot that melded Lightning Brand+1s are popular because they just look cool.
10-31-2012, 10:15 AM
Kiote

I'm fine with Refresh Gear. But I don't want any Class getting stuck doing nothing but casting refresh and haste again. Refresh and haste Ruined Red Mage in XI.
10-31-2012, 10:38 AM
Thunderz

Classes are always stuck doing some kind of buff all the time

As a Whm im stuck slapping regen or SS all the time!

As blm im rotating the same damn spell rotation all the time!

As (insert wtv job) blablabla

Refresh gear is nice, i'd like to macro in a idle set

Refresh Spell is needed to reduce downtime as much as possible (so people don't need to rely on elixirs and other type of pots when they run dry in a blm burn...they will be able to pop INT potions instead)

Haste in this game... why not you will run out of TP and the only thing you will be doing is auto-attack

What we need is Fast cast!

thats my 2cents for now
10-31-2012, 10:39 AM
Elexia

People ignore all of that to try and have an argument against something.
10-31-2012, 03:52 PM
Caine260

RDM is god in ffxi, or at least it used to be. I dont know how it is now with the 99 lvl cap. But back in the the days of the lvl 75 cap, rdm was god. Master enfeebler, main healer, De-buffer, mediocre DD but still able to deal damage, and an unparalleled ability to solo in almost any area. (sure bst could solo too, but rdm was still better.)
10-31-2012, 03:54 PM
Caine260

Refresh and haste made rdm a god among ants in ffxi...
10-31-2012, 06:23 PM
vax

Besides if refresh or haste gear should be or not, i'll love to see gear as much as important used to be on XI.
10-31-2012, 07:05 PM
AntonyB

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caine260

RDM is god in ffxi, or at least it used to be. I dont know how it is now with the 99 lvl cap. But back in the the days of the lvl 75 cap, rdm was god. Master enfeebler, main healer, De-buffer, mediocre DD but still able to deal damage, and an unparalleled ability to solo in almost any area. (sure bst could solo too, but rdm was still better.)

99 cap kinda killed RDM alittle, because WHMs can /RDM for self refresh and also the RDM cure IV was very weak for the HP needed to recover due to the new cap.
10-31-2012, 07:47 PM
Ingolf

BRD was always a better support than RDM, and nearly on par with debuffing.

These days, you can heal just as well as a RDM too, and DD pretty strongly.
10-31-2012, 08:31 PM
Delsus

Spells I would say no do not bring them in. Let's say RDM comes with both spells, that will be all they are doing, remember FFXI, refresh wears and isn't recast in 10 seconds "Where's my Refresh NOOB!" same with haste because they were so OP.

Gear I wouldn't mind to some extent, not to the extent you go for max haste build, and macro WS gear in (if they plan on gear swaps in fights) I would prefer players have to have some haste and some max DD gear, make gear choices personal or make people go 50/50 on haste and damage.

Refresh gear I would prefer the same, balance refresh with damage and cure potency, not macroing refresh for when you run dry.

"Hey Chimera, can you stop hitting me while I change my pants... you made me soil myself just then"
10-31-2012, 09:31 PM
Ruisu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elexia

Bard says what's up. Black Mage says what's up.

Bard is usually managing two songs, meaning running towards the melee and spellcasters to throw off said songs. They could also be rotating stoneskins, they could also be doing subpar damage/dealing with adds.

BLM on the other hand is a complete joke, so nothing really to say there.
10-31-2012, 11:31 PM
vax

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruisu

Bard is usually managing two songs, meaning running towards the melee and spellcasters to throw off said songs. They could also be rotating stoneskins, they could also be doing subpar damage/dealing with adds.

BLM on the other hand is a complete joke, so nothing really to say there.

She mean that BLM got the auto refresh trait and BRD MP songs for refresh.
10-31-2012, 11:41 PM
Wolfie

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caine260

RDM is god in ffxi, or at least it used to be. I dont know how it is now with the 99 lvl cap. But back in the the days of the lvl 75 cap, rdm was god. Master enfeebler, main healer, De-buffer, mediocre DD but still able to deal damage, and an unparalleled ability to solo in almost any area. (sure bst could solo too, but rdm was still better.)

Yeah, so why would I want another overpowered class in FFXIV?
11-01-2012, 12:48 AM
SwordCoheir

Quote:

Originally Posted by AntonyB

99 cap kinda killed RDM alittle, because WHMs can /RDM for self refresh and also the RDM cure IV was very weak for the HP needed to recover due to the new cap.

Not to mention Convert, giving other mage jobs more fast cast/refresh gear than I think even RDM has access too (T3+ traits being RDM's only saving grace), there has been the exclusion from various gear RDM always had access too after the introduction of Zeni NM's, no really beneficial unique spells outside of merits, no difference in enhancing power compared to AoE versions of spells, giving RDM so many single target spells with such short duration there's little time for anything but casting, lets not forget no non-stave version of elemental staves, pretty much everything worthwhile on RDM is sub-jobable, their enhancing spells scale poorly, T2 Enspells are plain broken, and lets face it the job's not seen anything worthwhile in 8 years. It's kind of ridiculous that SE still harping that RDM would be OP if they gave it anything worthwhile, yet you will see tons of MNK, WAR, SMN, SCH, NIN, BLM, BLU, THF, DNC, SAM, and even WHM's running around soloing 80% of the content in the game in often a fraction of the time RDM can.

In any case, the last thing SE needs to do is add RDM with FFXI's terrible bastardized vision in mind, we all know players skewered it into the backline, Enfeebles were never properly fixed nor have they introduced any that would be worthwhile on new content (IE: what good is slow on a mob that spams TP moves back to back), and SE doesn't know what to do with RDM after they pretty much gave everything it had away, so it's basically a vision-less job with no real purpose. Besides that, Buffing is BRD's thing and Enfeebling is going to Arcanist/SMN, we really don't have a need for a new magic role outside of that unless they're taking away all of MNK's magical abilities away and plan on making RDM a magic attacker in the future, we'll just have to wait and see.
11-01-2012, 12:58 AM
Ruisu

Quote:

Originally Posted by vax

She mean that BLM got the auto refresh trait and BRD MP songs for refresh.

The post she was referring to:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undrentide

we already have autorefresh as BLM...it is noticeable...id say leave it as it is.....we want to move away from a class just casting the same few spells over and over again....
11-01-2012, 02:09 AM
GreyJorildyn

These bonuses need to remain controlled and balanced along with other stat/attribute bonuses. The moment crap like refresh and haste become staple spells, the combat system becomes trivialized. Right now they are a bit low and could use some love imo, but bringing them up to XI-stature can he detriment. Not a fan of the way haste was done in XI. There needs to he a tradeoff when you hit faster. Make me leas accurate, lower my damage, or decrease my TP gain per hit. Don't make it win-win-win across the board though. That will just be bad all around.
11-01-2012, 03:21 PM
Caine260

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfie

Yeah, so why would I want another overpowered class in FFXIV?

You do realize that all that I described is achieved with lost of really good gear, and player skill right (back when lvl cap was 75, idk now)? Also, you missed my entire point... but i guess that is my fault for not being more to the point... I dont want an overpowered class, but I would like a class with versatility like that of a rdm.