Names for Hrothgar Queens

So we got some new lore of the hrothgar which i'm happy. But what i'm wondering is how an Helion tribe would call her Queen or Queen to be?

Like will she have her last name change like other member of the tribe changing their last name if a new queen is leading the tribe? Or will she have a title or something like that? That is the part i'm confused.

Unclear. We only know one to the best of my knowledge, and Queen Gunnhildr is most likely not a representative sample size.

Speculate and headcanon all you want from that, I'm just pointing out the lack of concrete facts here.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Unclear. We only know one to the best of my knowledge, and Queen Gunnhildr is most likely not a representative sample size.

Speculate and headcanon all you want from that, I'm just pointing out the lack of concrete facts here.

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I just we got more information about it soon.

Encyclopedia Eorzea II or III had a helpful section about cat naming conventions that touches on this, if I recall. I don't have my copy at hand right now but if no one beats me to it I can give you the excerpt when I get home tomorrow!

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Originally Posted by Aedwyn

Encyclopedia Eorzea II or III had a helpful section about cat naming conventions that touches on this, if I recall. I don't have my copy at hand right now but if no one beats me to it I can give you the excerpt when I get home tomorrow!

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I checked, it doesn't give any information on the naming of queens whatsoever. 'Queen Mira' is mentioned in the Helion nomenclature section, and deceased queen Branka in the Lost section, but there's no indication that 'Mira' is or isn't a birth name, or even that 'Queen Mira' actually exists.

In this case I'd call absence evidence, though. If there's supposed to be a thing where Hrothgar queens take on new names on becoming queens, why would they not mention it when that would be a pretty big deal from a cultural standpoint? Sure, logically speaking it means the rest of the tribe would take on a new name on getting a new queen, but the queen's name is treated as a given. Why would she change her name? It's her name, and she's the queen.

Picking a new name on taking a leadership role is a pretty rare thing in real life, too; in real life, regnal names (which is the term for this) are less common than you might reflexively think. For the most part when you look at them in history, it's less a traditional thing, and more 'one guy decided to take the name of his predecessor', or 'an allied nation already has a King John II'. The three big exceptions there are the Roman Empire, the Pope, and English monarchy (until fairly recently), which itself explains why an English audience assumes they're more common than they really are.

The different name thing also happens in Chinese royalty as well. Course Chinese names sort of get weird in general.

Either way, i just hope we can't get more info on how a leader of a hrothgar tribe is called and how a new queen is crowned. Like do they have the title of princess and once she became queen, they lost their last name and become Queen Stolla for example?

If Queen Gunnhildr IS the example we should follow, the title was given to the best astrologian of a convent of women specially trained in that, correct? The fact that she was a Roegadyn in a city overwhelmingly populated by Hrothgar was an anomaly, as the queen had always been a Hrothgar to that point just by probability.

So the Bozjan based clan, at least back then, chose a queen based entirely on who was best at a relied upon skill.

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Originally Posted by RedLolly

If Queen Gunnhildr IS the example we should follow, the title was given to the best astrologian of a convent of women specially trained in that, correct? The fact that she was a Roegadyn in a city overwhelmingly populated by Hrothgar was an anomaly, as the queen had always been a Hrothgar to that point just by probability.

So the Bozjan based clan, at least back then, chose a queen based entirely on who was best at a relied upon skill.

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Well, there was also the idea that Nevembya was intended as a sacrificial lamb and raised to queen since the then current queen refused to use the Save the Queen, so our only example of "queen chosen as meritocracy" was inherently tainted with political manoeuvring. We are told that it was simply a numbers thing, but we can't be sure since we don't have access to any records of other Queens Gunnhildr.

We also know that Bozja itself was far from a meritocracy, with very stratified society and slums, even before Imperial take over. I just wouldn't trust that the Queens Gunnhildr weren't hrothgar by default due to politics.

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Originally Posted by Zero-ELEC

Well, there was also the idea that Nevembya was intended as a sacrificial lamb and raised to queen since the then current queen refused to use the Save the Queen, so our only example of "queen chosen as meritocracy" was inherently tainted with political manoeuvring. We are told that it was simply a numbers thing, but we can't be sure since we don't have access to any records of other Queens Gunnhildr.

We also know that Bozja itself was far from a meritocracy, with very stratified society and slums, even before Imperial take over. I just wouldn't trust that the Queens Gunnhildr weren't hrothgar by default due to politics.

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Yea, and i can imagine many hrothgars leaving Bozja after it the incident 15 years ago.

What about the original queen? The woman that rallied the Hrothgar under Allagan enslavement to fight back? Did she have a name? She raised an army on her charisma and determination, and I thought the lore was that the idea behind "queens" was a direct result of her legendary influence.

Apparently said rebellion went badly, but the "Lost" mentality and way of life in deep mourning also grew from her influence as even her death rippled so hard in the Hrothgar population.


I remember that being in a Youtube video from a while back and I can't even confirm the info. I really should invest in those encyclopedias.

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Originally Posted by RedLolly

What about the original queen? The woman that rallied the Hrothgar under Allagan enslavement to fight back? Did she have a name? She raised an army on her charisma and determination, and I thought the lore was that the idea behind "queens" was a direct result of her legendary influence.

Apparently said rebellion went badly, but the "Lost" mentality and way of life in deep mourning also grew from her influence as even her death rippled so hard in the Hrothgar population.


I remember that being in a Youtube video from a while back and I can't even confirm the info. I really should invest in those encyclopedias.

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She was named Gunnhildr, but the practice of Bozjan queens having that name predates the Allagans (it's said to have originated after a civil war within Bozja, not a war of rebellion against the Allagans). The ruling class of old Bozja wanted to use Save the Queen (an Allagan relic) to save Bozja from the Fourth Umbral Calamity, which is how Nevembya (the Roegadyn) ended up as the host of the primal 'the Queen' since the queen herself refused to endanger herself by using the relic.

Queens of Bozja are also notably an ostensibly different thing from current tribal Hrothgar communities that are ruled/governed by queens. Old Bozja (c. Third Astral Era) was a unitary nation state under a single monarch, while the version of Bozja conquered by Garlemald was ruled by some sort of oligarchy; the culture described in character creation is more contemporary and localized. Most Hrothgar communities according to EE3 don't even have any direct line of succession; when a Hrothgar woman comes of age she either joins the service of her current queen or founds her own clan. I would assume that when a queen dies there's a power vacuum that a woman in her service could fill to keep the gang together, but otherwise they disperse and become Lost or join new clans (this is the sort of vague eventuality you can really go wild with in RP).

To the topic at hand, however, there is really no abundance of information, as has been said. It's stated that the name and title Gunnhildr was 'given' to the first queen (and every subsequent one) after a civil war in the distant past (prior to Allag), so there could be some mechanism in contemporary culture corresponding to this, but I'd say there's been every opportunity to expand upon that fact by now if that was the case either in Encyclopaedia Eorzea or the naming conventions post that's now sat unrevised for over a year. There are definitely queens still alive today in Bozja if the names given in the field record are any indication, but their names all exist in the existing name generator too.

Wow. I had a lot of info wrong and was missing details! Thank you!

I really hope we get some more on Hrothgar soon.