Ban premades from frontline, fix all issues

The new meta makes it impossible to play against premades, for the love of god make it solo queue, then they can q snipe each other.

At least not every new player is getting rolled in and never playing again.

Removing Pre-mades doesn't fix anything with balancing, it just makes the game worse when you can't play with your friends.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aidorouge

I don't want to see them banned per say, I just want them shuffled off into a Frontlines specifically made for groups.

But then I also think Crystalline Conflict (Normal and Ranked) should have a group-enabled queue too so people can have their duos and trios.

---

CC kinda satisfies that itch via custom matches. Something FL needs IMO.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nerfsmn

The new meta makes it impossible to play against premades, for the love of god make it solo queue, then they can q snipe each other.
At least not every new player is getting rolled in and never playing again.

---

Fix what issue?
It is just people can't blame on DRK any more because SE gave two hard DRK counters: 30 yards Knockback and Smite
The next victim to blame is the Premade that is all
As they lower down the barrier to obtain BH and new role action, the side has shot caller/commander will easily face roll the side with none
You don't even need a premade.

Lol, interesting name OP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mawlzy

CC kinda satisfies that itch via custom matches. Something FL needs IMO.

---

I can't exactly set up full customs just to queue up with my casual friend into CC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valence

I can't exactly set up full customs just to queue up with my casual friend into CC.

---

Oh good point. I guess they're utilized more by the streamers for their tournaments.

I don't really understand why there is ranked and casual in CC. Like if the MMR is any good, the lower tiers become casual. It's one reason I'd like crude tiering in FL.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

Fix what issue?
It is just people can't blame on DRK any more because SE gave two hard DRK counters: 30 yards Knockback and Smite
The next victim to blame is the Premade that is all
As they lower down the barrier to obtain BH and new role action, the side has shot caller/commander will easily face roll the side with none
You don't even need a premade.

---

You are just a contrarian and idc, you have no idea what you are talking about lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Astralrisk

Removing Pre-mades doesn't fix anything with balancing, it just makes the game worse when you can't play with your friends.

---

Try fighting a group of friends by yourself and die 50 times and tell me its still enjoyable knowing you cant get one shot off of anything cause 90% of players are ones that push back and pull in all the time. Not every player has 20+ friends to just up and join a FL. Was just in a match where the premade team targeted me out for an easy kill. Everytime they saw me they would stop what they were doing, chase me pull me in and destroy me. I left the match after dying 8 times in 1 min. Get rid of premades, push back, pull in and any kind of slowing or stun abilities and actually make players fight instead of cheap shotting till player dies.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goldolds1972

Try fighting a group of friends by yourself and die 50 times and tell me its still enjoyable knowing you cant get one shot off of anything cause 90% of players are ones that push back and pull in all the time. Not every player has 20+ friends to just up and join a FL. Was just in a match where the premade team targeted me out for an easy kill. Everytime they saw me they would stop what they were doing, chase me pull me in and destroy me. I left the match after dying 8 times in 1 min. Get rid of premades, push back, pull in and any kind of slowing or stun abilities and actually make players fight instead of cheap shotting till player dies.

---

Well I have good news for you, you only need 3. Not 20+.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goldolds1972

Try fighting a group of friends by yourself and die 50 times and tell me its still enjoyable knowing you cant get one shot off of anything cause 90% of players are ones that push back and pull in all the time. Not every player has 20+ friends to just up and join a FL. Was just in a match where the premade team targeted me out for an easy kill. Everytime they saw me they would stop what they were doing, chase me pull me in and destroy me. I left the match after dying 8 times in 1 min. Get rid of premades, push back, pull in and any kind of slowing or stun abilities and actually make players fight instead of cheap shotting till player dies.

---

I assume you are being hyperbolic, cause if you are dying 8 times, that's kind of on you.

Banning premades wont provide any solution to PVP. If anything, it will make matches more tedious. It's bad enough with people who have no map, score or ability awareness.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goldolds1972

Try fighting a group of friends by yourself and die 50 times and tell me its still enjoyable knowing you cant get one shot off of anything cause 90% of players are ones that push back and pull in all the time. Not every player has 20+ friends to just up and join a FL. Was just in a match where the premade team targeted me out for an easy kill. Everytime they saw me they would stop what they were doing, chase me pull me in and destroy me. I left the match after dying 8 times in 1 min. Get rid of premades, push back, pull in and any kind of slowing or stun abilities and actually make players fight instead of cheap shotting till player dies.

---

I would start to back off and bail out if there are more than 2 enemies on me.
Especially this patch they lower the requirement to obtain BH
Not sure why you think you can win against a group alone to begin with.

Yes, ban pre mades.

Make it solo queue like CC and if people want to really "play with my friends" then they should gather all their friends and organize a private tournament or matches.

And so no one complains, make it so that people in "private" matches still earn bonuses, points, etc...

That's about as fair as it can get.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AristocraticCorgi

Yes, ban pre mades.

Make it solo queue like CC and if people want to really "play with my friends" then they should gather all their friends and organize a private tournament or matches.

And so no one complains, make it so that people in "private" matches still earn bonuses, points, etc...

That's about as fair as it can get.

---

No. A lot of these people already do customs and tournaments. Doesn't change wanting to chill and game with your boys.

And lol, adding rewards to these customs means most of the people who queue up for Frontline (EXP and reward chasers) will stop queuing and just wintrade. You must be new here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atreus

No. A lot of these people already do customs and tournaments. Doesn't change wanting to chill and game with your boys.

And lol, adding rewards to these customs means most of the people who queue up for Frontline (EXP and reward chasers) will stop queuing and just wintrade. You must be new here.

---

Is that necessarily a bad thing? I know, I know, Q times.

Just had 10 "players" with less than 100k damage dealt on Onsal. It is miserable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atreus

No. A lot of these people already do customs and tournaments. Doesn't change wanting to chill and game with your boys.

And lol, adding rewards to these customs means most of the people who queue up for Frontline (EXP and reward chasers) will stop queuing and just wintrade. You must be new here.

---

There is nothing to wintrade for in FL.

You are the new one.

Everything can be earned in FL by grinding or just "being there". In CC it makes more sense to resort to wintrading.

lmao

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mawlzy

Is that necessarily a bad thing? I know, I know, Q times.

Just had 10 "players" with less than 100k damage dealt on Onsal. It is miserable.

---

it is not a bad thing

time-wise is just almost as time consuming as it would be playing honest, solo FL, think of the math

they would actually bore of it pretty quickly, because the fastest way to do it would be to let a team do everything and earn everything with zero resistance

wintrading would not exist in that format due to the large amount of people you would need to organize to make it work

unlike in CC where all you need is, what? 2 people? even one can be enough if they are helping their friends rise through the ranks

I swear if we could remove the FOMO gene we'd lose a lot of the AFKers. Why people waste time pretending to play FL so they can get the rank 25 chest full of garbage is beyond me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aidorouge

I want to say "oh, there's the achievements" but then that would require a mind-numbing amount of rigging to obtain all of those hundreds and thousands of kills and wins via wintrading, and just to get some title most people don't even use. (Or at least I've never seen them in the wild.)

---

Yes, indeed.

So let people play with their "friends"... turn FL into solo queue.

Everyone's happy, and riggers can try and rig it with their "friends". It's just going to take them a lot of time and effort and coordination lmao

There has been so many "ban premades" threads recently. This is I think a third one? The value of coordinated premade has been greatly reduced since 7.1 and 7.2 with purify changes and role actions, it's much easier to counter now. I had games where a significant portion of the alliance were solo chad players who just know what to do, and we bully a premade.

However, the problem with premades currently is balancing in some games. There are a looot of bad players in frontline at the moment. A lot. And a lot of them are entitled to get rewards for doing nothing.
What then happens is in games where there are multiple parties who are GOOD at the game mode in one alliance, and players who don't care on the other sides. It's no surprise that in those games it's no competition.
We really need to sort out balancing to spread bad players between alliances or even outright nerf their rewards because they haven't done anything :D, but SE won't bother.

Also LOL at "wintrading" conversation - I WANT the juicy gossip! who is wintrading who? where? please i want to know!

There's undeniably issues with Frontlines, but I have to ask why so many people's immediate solution they put forth is to ban people from playing with their friends? That just makes everyone more miserable in the end, because serious players can no longer guarantee that they have 3 less leechers/feeders on their team in every match.

Why not instead push for punishing lethargic play and giving people the initiative to push for a win? That would make every match more fun for everyone when the skill floor is raised.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aravell

Why not instead push for punishing lethargic play and giving people the initiative to push for a win? .

---

That would involve telling people that they don't even meet the current skill floor, implying they are bad at the game - which could possibly upset the player's feelings. That's not allowed on SE's watch.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nerfsmn

The new meta makes it impossible to play against premades, for the love of god make it solo queue, then they can q snipe each other.

At least not every new player is getting rolled in and never playing again.

---

The pvp in wow and ffxiv should not be taken seriously .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunhwapark

That would involve telling people that they don't even meet the current skill floor, implying they are bad at the game - which could possibly upset the player's feelings. That's not allowed on SE's watch.

---

You don't pay their sub. And SE needs and wants their sub.

Put premades in their own matchmaking queue.

Reduce queue pop requirement to 36 players. More can be added within first 5 minutes.

Problem solved.

I mean CC has a hidden MMR system, so why not FLs? We even have our own win rates shown in the pvp menu, which isn't even the case for CC. The data is already there. If the system tries to balance out each team's hidden MMR, then it could potentially help make things less lopsided.
But of course, it won't address the problem of leechers. I personally never really paid attention to them tbh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valence

I mean CC has a hidden MMR system, so why not FLs? We even have our own win rates shown in the pvp menu, which isn't even the case for CC. The data is already there. If the system tries to balance out each team's hidden MMR, then it could potentially help make things less lopsided.
But of course, it won't address the problem of leechers. I personally never really paid attention to them tbh.

---

I don't seed any point with Frontline and MMR.
There is also something called casual Crystal Conflict where it absolutely has no premade and there is no 3rd GC as random variable.
But they are not going there because you know why?
These people are the one with mindset of "I am so good that I will kill everyone I see, if I got killed, they are 100% premade"
Don't like fighting against premade or friend play together?
They can go play casual Crystal Conflict?
I go either casual or ranked during Seize myself

Aether or Crystal premade comes play on Primal frontline all the time by the way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AristocraticCorgi

You don't pay their sub. And SE needs and wants their sub.

---

I don't quite understand what this is supposed to mean, sorry.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunhwapark

I don't quite understand what this is supposed to mean, sorry.

---

It's an old inside joke.

Players who don't care about improving will never do it even if asked politely to do so for the benefit of their teams.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinemights

I don't seed any point with Frontline and MMR.
There is also something called casual Crystal Conflict where it absolutely has no premade and there is no 3rd GC as random variable.
But they are not going there because you know why?
These people are the one with mindset of "I am so good that I will kill everyone I see, if I got killed, they are 100% premade"
Don't like fighting against premade or friend play together?
They can go play casual Crystal Conflict?
I go either casual or ranked during Seize myself

Aether or Crystal premade comes play on Primal frontline all the time by the way.

---

I am genuinely confused by your post? I don't understand what this is supposed to be mean.
The only thing I expressed is that I see little drawbacks into having a matchmaking ensuring that FL get a bit more balance between each team in terms of skills.

You seem to be talking about people specifically unhappy about premades, sure, but what's your angle there? What does it have to do with having a simple system making FL more balanced? I just reacted from MMR balance, I'm not here to shit on premades or defend premades. If anything, premades just annoy me when they end on my team. I think I have a pretty solid track records on those forums actually defending the ability to queue up with friends, and even supported consistently the idea to introduce duo queues in CC (with safeguards).


Edit: my opinion on premades for anybody trying to fit me into any sides, tl;dr edition

-> If you're pissed because you die to premades, learn to play against them, or just understand that you just got played by people that are leagues above you and readjust the ego. Your team may not have the biggest chances to win without one yourself, but you never know, and that's not what matters in FL anyway. Play for yourself, and the good plays, and you'll enjoy it a lot more.
-> If you end up in a team of premades and usually enjoy pvp, then cross your fingers for the enemy teams to be competent, else enjoy feeling like a healer in a pve dungeon (borderline useless).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valence

I am genuinely confused by your post? I don't understand what this is supposed to be mean.
The only thing I expressed is that I see little drawbacks into having a matchmaking ensuring that FL get a bit more balance between each team in terms of skills.

You seem to be talking about people specifically unhappy about premades, sure, but what's your angle there? What does it have to do with having a simple system making FL more balanced? I just reacted from MMR balance, I'm not here to shit on premades or defend premades. If anything, premades just annoy me when they end on my team. I think I have a pretty solid track records on those forums actually defending the ability to queue up with friends, and even supported consistently the idea to introduce duo queues in CC (with safeguards).


Edit: my opinion on premades for anybody trying to fit me into any sides, tl;dr edition

-> If you're pissed because you die to premades, learn to play against them, or just understand that you just got played by people that are leagues above you and readjust the ego. Your team may not have the biggest chances to win without one yourself, but you never know, and that's not what matters in FL anyway. Play for yourself, and the good plays, and you'll enjoy it a lot more.
-> If you end up in a team of premades and usually enjoy pvp, then cross your fingers for the enemy teams to be competent, else enjoy feeling like a healer in a pve dungeon (borderline useless).

---

What Divinemights saying is that 9 out of 10 people here complaining about premades are disingenuous as shit and do not care about better games or matchmaking.

I'm just glad JP isn't over there complaining about it, so fat chance of this nonsense gaining traction.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atreus

What Divinemights saying is that 9 out of 10 people here complaining about premades are disingenuous as shit and do not care about better games or matchmaking.

I'm just glad JP isn't over there complaining about it, so fat chance of this nonsense gaining traction.

---

I'll give you 5-6/10.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mawlzy

I'll give you 5-6/10.

---

That's probably the real number. And if my defense, you were the 1 in my example. :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atreus

That's probably the real number. And if my defense, you were the 1 in my example. :p

---

Haha (tips enormous hat).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Exmo

Put premades in their own matchmaking queue.

---

The moment you can put 3 equal sized premade groups into 1 game, thats all that is needed. It doesnt matter that its just 4 people as premade per team, the remaining 20 people can still be random. This can make the requirement a lot lower. There is no need to demand a premade in every party then.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by UkcsAlias

The moment you can put 3 equal sized premade groups into 1 game, thats all that is needed. It doesnt matter that its just 4 people as premade per team, the remaining 20 people can still be random. This can make the requirement a lot lower. There is no need to demand a premade in every party then.

---

I think in principle this is an interesting step, but in practice it needs a little more. There are people queuing in as light parties on Aether who appear to do so to protect themselves against vote kicks, as they spend the entire match telling "jokes" and avoiding combat.

If you could somehow arrange matches such that each team had a premade trying to win, and featuring a shot-caller (which I think is your intent), my instinct is it would improve matches.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mawlzy

I think in principle this is an interesting step, but in practice it needs a little more. There are people queuing in as light parties on Aether who appear to do so to protect themselves against vote kicks, as they spend the entire match telling "jokes" and avoiding combat.

If you could somehow arrange matches such that each team had a premade trying to win, and featuring a shot-caller (which I think is your intent), my instinct is it would improve matches.

---

In my experience, the premades who are noteworthy enough to be a problem are either frustrating to play against or boring to play with. I don't want to be saddled with a premade by default, in lieu of simply matching them against one another exclusively which is the much simpler and more effective solution.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goldolds1972

Try fighting a group of friends by yourself and die 50 times and tell me its still enjoyable knowing you cant get one shot off of anything cause 90% of players are ones that push back and pull in all the time. Not every player has 20+ friends to just up and join a FL. Was just in a match where the premade team targeted me out for an easy kill. Everytime they saw me they would stop what they were doing, chase me pull me in and destroy me. I left the match after dying 8 times in 1 min. Get rid of premades, push back, pull in and any kind of slowing or stun abilities and actually make players fight instead of cheap shotting till player dies.

---

This feels very hyperbolic comment. Barring the fact that its impossible to die 8 times in one minute, but its also very common to just have groups single people out to kill with how the gamemode is designed. With or without a pre-made groups will always zerg to focus people down to just get any kill. Not going to assume if you were focused by a group or not since I wasn't in your game though. However, I will say you don't need friends to play FL, it just exists in-case you want to party up with a couple of friends/fc mates to just do a 15 min duty for some xp. You're thinking to hard into it if you think that you need some form of pre-made in your alliance to be able to win the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goldolds1972

I left the match after dying 8 times in 1 min.

---

Mathematically, this doesn't even add up. 5 second respawn timer, possibly an additional 5 to 10 seconds to actually respawn, and a 10 second invincibility timer.
Make what you will of it.

Admit it guys.

Pushing for solo queue will save FL.

Let's do it!