In the current version, it is a necessity to level multiple crafting classes to 45 to acquire beneficial abilities in order to HQ items. We understand that this can be a bit frustrating so the development team did their best with the current system limitations by making edits to crafting actions in patch 1.22 to help alleviate some stress players may be having.
In A Realm Reborn we will be adjusting crafting actions and making it so a portion of them are class-specific so when leveling a single class it will be possible to acquire the necessary abilities to make an HQ item. With these changes, the need to level multiple classes to 45 in order to HQ will be eliminated.
HQ Crafting Actions
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08-15-2012, 10:22 AMRukkiriiHQ Crafting Actions
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08-15-2012, 10:38 AMDuuude007
I do like that you are looking out for the little guy in this adjustment, but as you move forward with this, please consider this quote:
"If you make everyone special, then noone will be."
I suppose my point is, what motivation apart from adaptiveness would there be to max out multiple crafts?
I agree with satisfying legitimate concerns, but please be balanced in your design of casual capabilities and hardcore advantages. -
08-15-2012, 10:48 AMAllistar
Yea you may be right...but think, there are lot of players that still don't like lvling 1 craft job anyway...so I doubt there would be a significant increase of crafters with this proposed change.
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08-15-2012, 11:22 AMSirakitty
thats a bummer. i got several jobs up to 50 now and in 2.0 it wont even matter anymore? all the effort for nutin ....
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08-15-2012, 11:24 AMEstellios
Being able to make and repair multiple types of items is reason enough to level a crafting class. If they do end up going with craft specializations down the road, it would be a good idea to make sure that each craft is able to stand on their own two legs to a degree.
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08-15-2012, 11:27 AMSephrickAll a matter of perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirakitty
The more self sufficient you are, the more potential profit you have in each item you sell, and the more room you have to price competitively.
Sure someone with one class may be able to make a final item HQ easier, but it still takes HQ ingredients to make it. Who benefits better, the person with one craft who has to buy other HQ mats, or the person with multiple crafts who can make them all? -
08-15-2012, 11:45 AMXatsh
If anyone can level a 1 craft and make as much money as someone with all crafts the markets will crash.
NO barrier = way too high of a supply + law of supply and demand = everything being near worthless. -
08-15-2012, 11:52 AMSephrickBut then you don't need as much money to buy things, so the less money you get from selling means you can buy things cheaper.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xatsh
And there's the added effect of things being cheap enough that people don't see the value in leveling a craft and just sell mats.
It all balances out. -
08-15-2012, 11:58 AMDuuude007If things become so cheap that the value of selling them at the wards is decreased, people will vendor them, removing the mats from the economy entirely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephrick
A balance in the mechanics is needed to keep this sort of problem from snowballing; Inflation is bad, deflation is worse. In any economy. -
08-15-2012, 11:59 AMSephrickI do think it's important not to devaluate people's hard work. Just trying to look at it from another angle is all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duuude007
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08-15-2012, 12:54 PMArcellYou'll still be able to make and HQ all of the craftable items in the game. Those who only take one will only be able to make and HQ the craftable items in their specific discipline. All they're saying is that you won't have to take everything to 50 just to HQ normally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirakitty
Edit: All this means is that any discipline will be able to HQ well on its own, nothing more. Those who leveled multiple crafts will likely still have an advantage. -
08-15-2012, 01:16 PMBagobones
I leveled all crafts to have all abilities to be the best crafter i can be, don't think it would be fair to give someone with just one craft leveled the same chance of hq. Things in this game are easy enough as they are, don't need to make them any easier...
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08-15-2012, 01:32 PMResheph
I think you folks are forgetting that leveling all the crafts to 50 still allows you to make all of the craftable items in the game and that in and of itself should be enough of an advantage. I have always thought it was dumb that to be an excellent level 50 Armorer, I also have to be a level 45 everything else. I have no problem with only being able to HQ Armorer stuff. :P
I'm glad to hear this news, and I'm keeping in mind that in order to actually enjoy the new system in ARR, I'll need to have a few classes that aren't 50 so I can experience leveling up in the new system without needing to make another character. Thank you, devs, and thank you Rukkirii. :)
Edit: I think this will also solve the problem of duplicate abilities, and some classes having a few more abilities than others. -
08-15-2012, 01:39 PMMikitaYou're right that it wouldn't be fair to give someone who only leveled one craft the same chance of HQing an item in a completely different craft.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagobones
But it sounds like they are saying something like: A level 50 Blacksmith should have a good chance of HQing a blacksmithing recipe, even if they haven't leveled up Carpentry for Byregot's Blessing, or Weaving for Culmination.
Someone who leveled up every crafting class will still have the advantage in being able to create and repair almost anything, but overall the change they have in mind sounds fair. -
08-15-2012, 02:55 PMCynthisIt sounds to me that those who level only one class gets enough abilities to have a chance to get HQ but those with multiple classes at 50 will still have a much better chance, kind of like it is today. You only need to level a few classes to 45 to get good enough abilities to have a decent chance of HQ but if you level all you have a lot more options and a better chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagobones
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08-15-2012, 03:45 PMGolnan
Please tell me you worded that incorrectly.
Do you mean to say that all the work I've been putting in to obtain all the abilities for HQing is now completely pointless?
This is bullshit. -
08-15-2012, 03:59 PMKraggyExcellent, the less crafters are able to gouge prices and control supply the better. Crafting should be a utility not a means of making cash, 'barriers' aren't needed to allow everyone to be able to craft their basic needs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xatsh
The price crafters are gouging now in the game means raising a new class is impossible for anyone not wishing to spend weeks and months crafting their own, it's impossible to gear up, anything that will prevent this is a Good Thing!
In any case, your comment is stupid, since the more crafts you have the more flexibility you have to make items of value that will sell; maybe you won't make a 'killing' like crafters have done in V1 but that's fine. -
08-15-2012, 07:53 PMKazai
As a Dragoon and Warrior I decided to level armorer so that I would be able to make my own armor and make a little gil on the side. I got half way through armorer and and realized I needed to level miner if I was going to take this craft seriously. Now that I'm a level 36 miner I found myself saying "wow! With all this ore it would be stupid not to level blacksmith and goldsmith." Later a Ls friend told me I should look into getting HQ skills from culinary and/or alchemy. I thought it wasn't fair that I would have to level something I didn't want to...but when I started thinking about it I started to get excited because I would have another useful discipline and a good flow of gil coming in. Now I want to level culinary not just for the skill but also for the benifit of being able to make my own food. This would have never happened if my armorer would have been able to HQ with out the help of other disciplines.
Also it's makes more sense that someone who has had more experience crafting a variety of things would have a great understanding of materials and be a master at making high quality items. -
08-15-2012, 09:57 PMKinseykinz
The saying goes: Jack of all trades, Master of none....
So yes, people who have all crafts, or at least multiple crafts leveled, should and still will have a benefit: You can make your own mats, and have the flexibility to change crafts as the market changes etc. Also, the post didn't say that ALL skills would be class specific, just some.
But for those who choose to 'Master' one craft, there should also be a benefit. Also, I'm sorry but there should be a different feel to Cooking than to weaving. This plan is one way to do this, and I see nothing wrong with it.
Also, a while ago it was announced that once level caps are raised, you will only be able to fully level one craft. (And no, I'm not digging for this information now). But if this is in fact still the plan, it would only make sense to change crafting in this way. -
08-16-2012, 01:27 AMKiara
Hi Rukkirii,
Thanks for the update. :) Like what others have said, I think it's great that 2.0 will be allowing those players who just level 1 Craft to be able to try for HQ Items.
But I hope you can pass along our concerns that if it's *just* 1 Craft that's needed to get all the benefits ("craft weaponskills / abilities") to HQ an Item, and that there's Zero benefit in leveling multiple Crafts to get an edge on HQ'ing, it probably undermines many aspects of the game for some:
1. Having just 1 Craft worth of skills to be able to HQ (and not gaining any advantage in leveling more than 1 Craft for HQ'ing) would take away from those dedicated Disciples of the Hand that have spent time leveling more than 1 Craft to be the best they could be (and help them get a better chance at HQ'ing things).
2. It would also further simplify (too much) Crafting in general. Right now, with the extreme amounts of EXP you can get (with Rested EXP Bonus and the Engineering Manuals (to Boost EXP)), it's really easy and fast to level up a craft. Having it so you have everything you need to HQ via 1 Craft would probably make HQ'ing and the process of Crafting in general, even more trivial, to the point that there's nothing special about a "Master Craftsman" (someone who really took the time to level multiple DoH classes and choose the right Crafting Abilities to challenge and make HQ items).
It's good to balance it for casual and/or mainstream, so everyone gets a chance for HQ'ing, but if it's truly simplified to be just "1 Crafting Class = 100% of what you need to HQ," that might be too simplified.
Thanks~ -
08-16-2012, 04:33 AMReika
I'm all for this change. The current game makes people rely far too much on leveling EVERYTHING to be an effective player, to include battle classes. It doesn't matter to me that I have almost every DoH to 50, it matters that they make it better for everyone in the long run. It's not like you still wont be able to level all your DoH's to 50 yourself, but now you wont have to if that isn't your desire.
Pretty sure this is another thing that will upset the "50 in everything" group, but that's ok with me :) Upset away! -
08-16-2012, 07:30 AMtymoraI don't understand this kind of mentality.Quote:
The current game makes people rely far too much on leveling EVERYTHING to be an effective player, to include battle classes.
You can be a good player with 1 class leveled and a better player with more classes leveled.
What's wrong with spending more effort to get better returns? That's character progression there.
You can learn programming in Java only and get a job. Learn C++ too and you have better chances of finding a job. That's just how the world works. (Replace "programming" with whatever real life skill, just about everything works) -
08-16-2012, 08:15 AMMitty_Tsuyoi
nooooooooooo!
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08-21-2012, 04:42 AMReikaBecause unless you just started playing after they did the whole class reform/job adding, it was a lot worse than it is now with the need to level multiple classes to be effective.Quote:
Originally Posted by tymora
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08-21-2012, 05:33 AMOrophin
I could have had every crafter at 50 and still have been happy with this change. Being 50 in everything means you can make anything you want, so you're not limited to being that guy with a 50 craft and 45 in everything else and can't reliably HQ the top tier recipes for the lower crafts.
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08-21-2012, 09:15 AMLux_RaynaQuote:
Originally Posted by Duuude007
I dont think they'll go overboard. It is pretty ridiculous right now, I'm assuming they'll just do some minor adjustments. As it stands a crafting class cant even stand on its on two legs, while the other DoW and DoL jobs most certainly can. DoH should be balanced a bit more to reflect DoW/DoM classes. Yeah, you'll probably want/need cross-class skills to make your life so much easier, but it wont be necessary for you to function. HQ should always require cross-class skills, just not all of them at 45. Thats just retarded lol. -
09-04-2012, 01:48 PMKsenia
Crafting in FF14 is, like every other mmo pure RnG.
Besides Culmination every skill locks out great success or has no effect on if they fail farm you in to the ground. Even Culmination prenerfs you. I can get 100+ with a careful with no influence. Max I ever got for culmination is 70.
- Use fit for a King get 3 fails, you get no more quality than if you fluked one great success.
The only difference with FF14 over other single percent RnG is they hide it better. I had a straw hat to 81% chance of HQ.
"Would you like to double down dump junk and save yourself the trouble of discarding"?
- Confirm
- Botch -
09-05-2012, 12:51 AMtymoraThat is just bad luck. The RnG range can be pretty large.Quote:
Even Culmination prenerfs you. I can get 100+ with a careful with no influence. Max I ever got for culmination is 70
Mine can go from 90 to 150. -
09-05-2012, 04:53 AMReika
Yep. just bad luck. All 'Super successes' vary in how much they are going to give you no matter if you use a guarantee-super success skill. Normal success guaratee skills all prevent super success of any kind too. And btw, use culmination - careful during prismatic glow for best results.