Thank you for VPR change!! [Positive thread]

I want to thank you !!!

- After reading positional changes, I was surprised Hunter's Coil/ Swiftkin coil were not changed.
(I would love for it to be no longer positional myself but I have skill issues:( )

This thread is no means to slander those who disagree, feel the job lost challenge.
I am only writing it as a person who struggled upkeep of "dot" (It is not a dot, but I have always called timers as such, sorry for confusion)
If you disagree, it is OK to post your thoughts/what you would like to see otherwise.
Perhaps I am a too simple person. (I do savage/raids/etc, but all the same, I am casual player with low skill) so I understand high skilled players may dislike this thread.


My first thoughts was:

- I never thought the short dot would go away. I hoped maybe extending it as change would be slight improvement,
but I never imagined it is gone! It has made this job SO much better, thank you so much for this decision!!
I feel more at ease playing VPR now! I am very happy, thank you.


The job was previously in my experience not easy because

- Hyperfocus on hotbars (I am still struggling with it but it is skill issues, not job issue)
- Then need to look debuffs on top / keep track / cry every time disengage enemies
- Then make sure of positional, even though not difficult, it is more than other jobs (If I am wrong, scold me!)
- Switched job from VPR because it was difficult to manage dot in the fights that require breaks or it has high ping issue interacting with poor timing.

- I think many people mistake "braindead jobs"
I feel Viper is actually most difficult even when it shows what button to press,
it's not about pressing the shiny button but pressing the shiny button in a correct timing.
This misconception of "less button means easier job" has been frustrating me. Maybe because I misunderstand the meaning myself.
(Please feel free to enlighten me)


- VPR buttons do not cancel out each other, so there is an important timing to it with buff. (I feel this gives me anxiety but a lot good feeling when done right!)
- All while steadily moving character and keeping the enemy gimmicks in mind is hard!
- It require brain memory of skill turn / gimmick movement and directions.
But now it has become less of a burden,, I am happy!

I want to make this thread to show appreciation of a struggle player, thank you!!!
Sorry for the long read.

Be kind in the comment section! If you disagree, please explain your feelings without attacking, thank you for reading!

https://media1.tenor.com/m/Yi-w8ByGs...niwasolder.gif

struggle players unite!

Noxious Gnash was not a dot

Looking over at the Japanese Forum, it seems most people are positive over the removal of Noxious Gnash with some lamenting it going away.

And even the positive ones sadden by its removal, they don't seem to mind as it made the job less "stressful" for them.

I was shock to see it removal when I played it today and I was wondering at first I miss pressed a button until I realized they removed it. But, I don't mind too much... I did find it annoying to always re-apply, because it felt like I was just only applying Noxious Gnash most of the time instead of using my other skills. If they kept it, having it start at 30 seconds might've helped, but I'm not too sad that it's gone and they have increase potency and I do like having to do an never ending dance of attacks on my foe.

Really love how faster the class feels now.

So, I don't mind the Viper right now. It's more or less the same, just a little faster.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aldondamar

Noxious Gnash was not a dot

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Haha, sorry! I tend to call everything "timer" as "dot" whether "damage over time" from own skill or damage to boss (for instance, Reaper I also call "dot"!) Sorry for confusion!

I found it to be a weird mechanic anyway.. It should just have been a dot. Instead they literally just repeated Reaper's upkeep gimmick again. It felt out of place.

I hate the change, but I try not to enter threads the premise I disagree with and completely disrespect them. You said that though this is a positive thread, you were open to other opinions.

My primary complaint is the removal of Noxious Gash. This was actually my favorite part of this job, as far as the fantasy of being a VIPER goes. A snake that debilitates their foe by injecting venom, then coiling around them (positionals) with fast and frequent strikes.

Fantasy aside, I loved managing the debuff. It kept my mind interested as opposed to just looking for blinking icons to press. Now I'm flat out bored.

As someone who loves Rogues in MMOs, I felt Ninja did not provide the feeling I look for in such a job. Viper was really scratching that itch as far as the combat went.

I loved the theme of this class, and now I feel I went from King Cobra to Garden Snake.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I hate the change, but I try not to enter threads the premise I disagree with and completely disrespect them. You said that though this is a positive thread, you were open to other opinions.

My primary complaint is the removal of Noxious Gash. This was actually my favorite part of this job, as far as the fantasy of being a VIPER goes. A snake that debilitates their foe by injecting venom, then coiling around them (positionals) with fast and frequent strikes.

Fantasy aside, I loved managing the debuff. It kept my mind interested as opposed to just looking for blinking icons to press. Now I'm flat out bored.

As someone who loves Rogues in MMOs, I felt Ninja did not provide the feeling I look for in such a job. Viper was really scratching that itch as far as the combat went.

I loved the theme of this class, and now I feel I went from King Cobra to Garden Snake.

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Wow, thank you for explaining your feeling! That makes me happy you share youir thoughts but also Sorry if my post may have offended you as it is quite the opposite. but that do not mean we cannoy talk calmly about it and learn appreciate from each!
this thread is "positive" but more so "Feedback with positive vibe". so even those who dislike it, I wish to give a place to calmly express.

So feel free to speak your mind to us, I will definitely listen to it and hope SE does too. With kind mind we can learn from each other. Unfortunately I am not aware of the characters, but somewhere I hope you find a way to enjoy the job.
I have a long road to go before becoming skillful and comfortably. I got to excited for Viper but RL complications holds me back. This is why for me it was a big gift.
There is many complications on my end that I do not take note because I do not want my disabilities that I name "skill issues" to impact game for normal players.
I appreciate your words ... what kind of feeling character/job would you very like? Sorry for the English

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Akamadoshi

Wow, thank you for explaining your feeling! That makes me happy you share youir thoughts but also Sorry if my post may have offended you as it is quite the opposite. but that do not mean we cannoy talk calmly about it and learn appreciate from each!
this thread is "positive" but more so "Feedback with positive vibe". so even those who dislike it, I wish to give a place to calmly express.

So feel free to speak your mind to us, I will definitely listen to it and hope SE does too. With kind mind we can learn from each other. Unfortunately I am not aware of the characters, but somewhere I hope you find a way to enjoy the job.
I have a long road to go before becoming skillful and comfortably. I got to excited for Viper but RL complications holds me back. This is why for me it was a big gift.
There is many complications on my end that I do not take note because I do not want my disabilities that I name "skill issues" to impact game for normal players.
I appreciate your words ... what kind of feeling character/job would you very like? Sorry for the English

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We can respectfully disagree - I never have a problem with that. I'm glad that you are now feeling better at the job and can enjoy it.

I only want to share that the job has only been out a few weeks, and I feel it would have been okay for the Devs to give people more time with it. A lot of jobs become easier to deal with the more time you spend playing them.

I dislike that this feels like a knee-jerk reaction when people barely had time to truly play the job long enough to claim that they cannot understand it or play it well. I think it's fine that some jobs are more complicated and take more to pick up. Viper clicked in my mind almost immediately, but I can see how for some it might have taken a little bit longer.

It's kind of like the people calling for nerfs on dungeon difficulty the day they released. Like please - let people gear up and learn mechanics. Come back later and say if they still need nerfs. Likely the answer is No, they don't need nerfs. I feel the devs listen to too much outcry from players who haven't truly tried to learn, because they don't think players should experience challenge or difficulty and overcome anything needed to be learned.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

We can respectfully disagree - I never have a problem with that. I'm glad that you are now feeling better at the job and can enjoy it.

I only want to share that the job has only been out a few weeks, and I feel it would have been okay for the Devs to give people more time with it. A lot of jobs become easier to deal with the more time you spend playing them.

I dislike that this feels like a knee-jerk reaction when people barely had time to truly play the job long enough to claim that they cannot understand it or play it well. I think it's fine that some jobs are more complicated and take more to pick up. Viper clicked in my mind almost immediately, but I can see how for some it might have taken a little bit longer.

It's kind of like the people calling for nerfs on dungeon difficulty the day they released. Like please - let people gear up and learn mechanics. Come back later and say if they still need nerfs. Likely the answer is No, they don't need nerfs. I feel the devs listen to too much outcry from players who haven't truly tried to learn, because they don't think players should experience challenge or difficulty and overcome anything needed to be learned.

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myself was very surprised. too.
they mention only on position.... so I expected no less... but it turns something else because of overwhelming feedback :pease dony change"
So positionals survived... To me I think it is also their choice of timing to release. I am also a bit going back and forth "Can I am main viper" but the real change come during savage, I wished to practice on Extremew.
I think it is very sloppy choice on them for sure but the result for me was more positive. But I do not wish to be selfish and hold out my hand for those disagree to listen ^^

I liked having a poison effect because I liked playing a rogue a long time ago in wow, but, upkeeping it was kind of just a combo that existed only to upkeep it. It wasn't hard for me at all to keep my buffs and debuff up, but it did act like a speed bump sometimes. VPR feels exactly the same except now you just have more incentive to not forget to do your 1-2-3. So the change is neutral-to-positive for me. ^-^

I understand that this long list is meant to represent the issues you have with the job, but at the end of the day the only actual change is that tracking a debuff was traded for an even stronger hyperfocus on hotbars since you now need to remember which combo starter you were on (and with Viper's button consolidation you actually can lose track of which to use, especially after Awakening). Well actually a lot of changes happened with combo buffs which are rather important but no one brings those up. They also didn't need the debuff changes so not too important to bring up.

Forgive me for doing this but I've edited your post to how the job works now and you'll notice most of your issues with the job still persist. I'm not doing this to be mean, if anything, I'm doing this to say that if this is the change that got you to finally being able to enjoy Viper, you probably didn't need it as much as a couple extra roulettes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Akamadoshi

The job was previously in my experience not easy because

- Hyperfocus on hotbars (I am still struggling with it but it is skill issues, not job issue)
- Then need to cry every time disengage enemies
- Then make sure of positional, even though not difficult, it is more than other jobs (If I am wrong, scold me!)
- has high ping issue interacting with poor timing.

- I think many people mistake "braindead jobs"
I feel Viper is actually most difficult even when it shows what button to press,
it's not about pressing the shiny button but pressing the shiny button in a correct timing.
This misconception of "less button means easier job" has been frustrating me. Maybe because I misunderstand the meaning myself.
(Please feel free to enlighten me)


- VPR buttons do not cancel out each other, so there is an important timing to it with buff. (I feel this gives me anxiety but a lot good feeling when done right!)
- All while steadily moving character and keeping the enemy gimmicks in mind is hard!
- It require brain memory of skill turn / gimmick movement and directions.

---

Also:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VirusChris

Really love how faster the class feels now.

So, I don't mind the Viper right now. It's more or less the same, just a little faster.

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Literally nothing was changed. Slither animation-lock is shorter, I guess. Irrelevant.

Thank you for making VPR another auto-pilot job like summoner, we really need more completely homogenized jobs like it

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LisseyCrowe

I understand that this long list is meant to represent the issues you have with the job, but at the end of the day the only actual change is that tracking a debuff was traded for an even stronger hyperfocus on hotbars since you now need to remember which combo starter you were on (and with Viper's button consolidation you actually can lose track of which to use, especially after Awakening). Well actually a lot of changes happened with combo buffs which are rather important but no one brings those up. They also didn't need the debuff changes so not too important to bring up.

Forgive me for doing this but I've edited your post to how the job works now and you'll notice most of your issues with the job still persist. I'm not doing this to be mean, if anything, I'm doing this to say that if this is the change that got you to finally being able to enjoy Viper, you probably didn't need it as much as a couple extra roulettes.



Also:



Literally nothing was changed. Slither animation-lock is shorter, I guess. Irrelevant.

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Ｔhank you for this post ! Yes, I wish desperately to main VPR but as of right now it is unable to ^^;
The less burden of the timing of poison is less troublesome, but it wasn't a huge deal. The problem is, it does become a burden during pull of trash/disengage enemies.
Eventually those who say "it is removed for nothing" I think would have persistent issue in the future and their boss design cannot allow too much of disengagement (I read this in another blog)
But I think for the time being the small change makes me feel less burdened, even if it is a bit of illusion!