For anyone see Viper a hard job it is not for you!

For anyone see Viper a hard job it is not for you!


the job is not meant to be 1 button each 2.5 second

it is not reaper
it is not samurai
it is not warrior
it is not black mage


just find another job

can say the same to anyone who dislikes the upcoming changes

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Originally Posted by Melethron123

can say the same to anyone who dislikes the upcoming changes

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the devs design this job in a way makes sense.. changes is for players feedback

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Originally Posted by Melethron123

can say the same to anyone who dislikes the upcoming changes

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If you prefer even easier jobs (let's not pretend that viper is hard) you already have a plethora of choices. Can't you let us have this one?

Hopefully they are just removing the positionals on 2 abilities and not removing OGCDs.

We really need to cultivate the mindset that if you really want to play a specific Job, then you sit down and learn it. Not dumb it down and then have everybody else who enjoyed how engaging it was lose interest and get bored out of their minds.

I may still play Dark Knight, but man am I still annoyed to this day at how much they gutted the Job.

The devs are changing the job to make it more accessible. Clearly the job is meant for a wider audience and I support square in making the changes to appeal to more people.

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Originally Posted by Wolf_Heartnet

The devs are changing the job to make it more accessible. Clearly the job is meant for a wider audience and I support square in making the changes to appeal to more people.

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It's literally the easiest melee DPS Job in the game already. Any more "accessible" and it's gonna turn into the "No thoughts, head empty" meme of melee Jobs.

What we need are condensed tooltips, because people apparently don't want to read.

Viper definitely isn't hard, just looks this way until you play it for an hour or so. It's probably easiest melee dps right now. What I don't like about this job is that his only gimmick is a massive pile of ogcds. If I'm not mistaken, only first two attacks in basic combos and reawakening do not have ogcd to press after. This is insane. Incredibly busy and boring at the same time. But maybe it's just me. I will not demand to change it. Some people probably like this kind of gameplay, and I will just move to something else, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Barachim

It's literally the easiest melee DPS Job in the game already. Any more "accessible" and it's gonna turn into the "No thoughts, head empty" meme of melee Jobs.

What we need are condensed tooltips, because people apparently don't want to read.

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That's your opinion. I see many conflicting arguments on this forum about Viper. One side says its supposed to be hard and another side says that its not hard. It seems obvious here to me that Viper is not easy for some and seems easy to others.

I support making the job accessible enough for everyone to use.

Thank you for sharing your opinion with me Barachim.

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Originally Posted by Wolf_Heartnet

That's your opinion.

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Well, what is your opinion? Have you laid hands on the Job yourself? As someone who played all the melee Jobs, Viper is way more simple leveled fully to 100, than the other melee jobs at level 90.

Once I got my hotbars figured out, I even have an open space left on both of them, compared to other melee jobs that require I use every available space.

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Originally Posted by Barachim

Well, what is your opinion? Have you laid hands on the Job yourself? As someone who played all the melee Jobs, Viper is way more simple leveled fully to 100, than the other melee jobs at level 90.

Once I got my hotbars figured out, I even have an open space left on both of them, compared to other melee jobs that require I use every available space.

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Yes. I leveled Viper to 100. Yes, I laid hands on it. I myself have played all the melee jobs but I have not mained any of them except for Viper. Yes, I understand how to play Viper.

To point out my previous point, some people adapt to Viper better than others. Not everyone finds it easy.

I appreciate you asking for my opinion. Thank you. I have written this out for you but the post didn't go through so I will copy paste what I wrote in a prior thread about my feedback since I dont want to rewrite this again.

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Personally, I would like to see positionals removed. This is a big thing for me as I see positionals as kind of a waste when you have several bosses in the game that are wall bosses that you cant use rear positionals on. I personally find it pointless to give a class positionals and then create bosses where you can't use some of the positionals. Even if all positionals work on a wall boss, I want to be able to get in that position as that is how the rotation should be done. TL;DR having bosses in the game that defeats the purpose of positionals makes positionals pointless to me and should be removed. Its just adding needless complexity that can't always be applied.

Compacting Skills: I would like to see either the single target melee combo or the aoe melee combo to have the combos compressed down to 1 or 2 buttons like it is in pvp. Preferably the AoE melee combo to reduce combo bloat. Normally I would have the combos in the main hotbar but there is no room die to the sheer amount of combo buttons the viper has and would be alot easier to manage and reduce business if at the very least the aoe combo is done like the pvp skills where u can combo on one button alone. To be clear, I am not asking for the removal of total skills but to compact the combo to less buttons.

Job Gauge: I would like the job gauge to more clearly represent if your main combo is a rear or flank positional. Correct me if I am wrong but as it is now, it just tells you left or right in ur 2nd combo step and that determines whether u end in flank or rear but doesnt specifically tell you on its own if it is flank or rear. Which can mess you up at the heat of the moment.

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Originally Posted by skooma_dealer

Viper definitely isn't hard, just looks this way until you play it for an hour or so. It's probably easiest melee dps right now. What I don't like about this job is that his only gimmick is a massive pile of ogcds. If I'm not mistaken, only first two attacks in basic combos and reawakening do not have ogcd to press after. This is insane. Incredibly busy and boring at the same time. But maybe it's just me. I will not demand to change it. Some people probably like this kind of gameplay, and I will just move to something else, I guess.

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I mean, I think it's about as complicated as NIN is these days, NIN has gotten extremely simple. (it's hilarious that the RDM opener is way more complicated than the NIN opener now) But yes, viper is pretty easy to pick up and play.

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Originally Posted by angienessyo

I mean, I think it's about as complicated as NIN is these days, NIN has gotten extremely simple. (it's hilarious that the RDM opener is way more complicated than the NIN opener now) But yes, viper is pretty easy to pick up and play.

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At least NIN has it's mudras. Still a very fun and satisfying mechanic for me personally and it gives some depth to the job.

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Originally Posted by Wolf_Heartnet

To point out my previous point, some people adapt to Viper better than others. Not everyone finds it easy.

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You can say this probably about every job in the game. I don't find BLM easy, but I will never ever ask to simplify it, because I have skill issues. They already killed SMN, I do not wish this fate for people enjoying their jobs :(

Job accessibility to me was always a case of punishing the majority for the failings of the minority. Yes, you will increase the number of people that will be able to play the job, but at the same time decrease the amount of people that enjoy it.

Why can't jobs be classified into low, mid and high tier jobs? Why does everything eventually have to become low tier? If I want to grind dungeons, while watching a sitcom on my 2nd monitor, then I will choose the Job accordingly. But I also like playing a Job that requires me to lock in.

I was one of those people who didn't care to read the Viper tooltips, because they are honestly massive, so I just winged it. Then I heard news of people complaining about positionals and I was like "Wait... combo enders have positionals?" Upon learning that, it look me less than a minute to speed run the tooltips, look for the words rear and flank and I figured out: red combo enders = rear attacks, green combo enders = flank attacks.

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Originally Posted by Barachim

Job accessibility to me was always a case of punishing the majority for the failings of the minority. Yes, you will increase the number of people that will be able to play the job, but at the same time decrease the amount of people that enjoy it.

Why can't jobs be classified into low, mid and high tier jobs? Why does everything eventually have to become low tier? If I want to grind dungeons, while watching a sitcom on my 2nd monitor, then I will choose the Job accordingly. But I also like playing a Job that requires me to lock in.

I was one of those people who didn't care to read the Viper tooltips, because they are honestly massive, so I just winged it. Then I heard news of people complaining about positionals and I was like "Wait... combo enders have positionals?" Upon learning that, it look me less than a minute to speed run the tooltips, look for the words rear and flank and I figured out: red combo enders = rear attacks, green combo enders = flank attacks.

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The problem with "majority argument" is that we don't know what the actual majority is. That is not to shut down any points you have, I just want to point out that as far as I know, there is no way to determine what the actual majority is. We see people complain about tank aggro being in the way of tank dps so they raised the aggro generations of tanks so now its much easier to manage and then people came out and complained that its too easy to manage and they want more difficulty. It's impossible to please everyone.

Being it impossible to please everyone, I go for the option where the biggest audience possible can enjoy a job.

The best way to appease what u and I both want in my opinion, would be to include hard mode and simple mode setup for viper or all jobs so it can remain accessible and at the same time have an option for players who want something more challenging. Both options not being a dps loss. I don't know how feasible that would be for the devs though.