Time to remove Leve Allowances??

As the title says, I think ever since the introduction to Collectables and earning bank EXP with those it might be a good time to remove leve allowances.

Fellow guildmate got 4 crafters to 100 in a single day on collectibles alone. the time sink was just buying the mats (some I helped by mining)

Leve Allowances are no longer necessary so we should be allowed unlimited access to leves.

And trivialize leveling even further? Right, exactly what this game needs.

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Originally Posted by Venarius

And trivialize leveling even further? Right, exactly what this game needs.

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Leveling in this game for crafters and gatherers has always been a joke, I dont think this will do much, remove it, keep it, w/e.

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Originally Posted by DaveFishnomer

Leveling in this game for crafters and gatherers has always been a joke, I dont think this will do much, remove it, keep it, w/e.

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This isn't true. Leveling to 50 during ARR took weeks. Reaching 51 was also considered a wall for many. They only started easing it up in Stormblood and started handing out free omnicrafters from ShB onwards.

I actually find it disgusting how over the years people are asking for nothing but the path of least resistance. The generation instant gratification ruined gaming.

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Originally Posted by Venarius

This isn't true. Leveling to 50 during ARR took weeks. Reaching 51 was also considered a wall for many. They only started easing it up in Stormblood and started handing out free omnicrafters from ShB onwards.

I actually find it disgusting how over the years people are asking for nothing but the path of least resistance. The generation instant gratification ruined gaming.

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Right, sorry, not always, just for the last 10 years, ma bad.

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Originally Posted by Venarius

This isn't true. Leveling to 50 during ARR took weeks. Reaching 51 was also considered a wall for many. They only started easing it up in Stormblood and started handing out free omnicrafters from ShB onwards.

I actually find it disgusting how over the years people are asking for nothing but the path of least resistance. The generation instant gratification ruined gaming.

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Look, bud. I get that you feel like "We did it uphill, both ways, in snow AND sand storms!" is a valid reason for someone to have to do the same, but as someone who has been there since 2.0 as well, we're level 100 now, with over 30 Jobs across combat and non-combat. Let the people have easier ways to level, so they can actually catch up to us without having to pay for a level skip.

reason for allowce is to limit gils people can mines from it, remove allowce, then they have to remove gils reward might as well as remove leve all together

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Originally Posted by ShariusTC

reason for allowce is to limit gils people can mines from it, remove allowce, then they have to remove gils reward might as well as remove leve all together

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Yep that's the reason. Leves serve to make money not XP and you have collectables for XP. I don't see how it will improve the situation at all. You can go do collectables as soon as lvl 20 which should take at most 15 mimutes.

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Originally Posted by DRAGONxKING

As the title says, I think ever since the introduction to Collectables and earning bank EXP with those it might be a good time to remove leve allowances.

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You misunderstand what a crafter is supposed to be doing.

In a properly designed market-economy, the crafters should be supplying 100% of the goods. The game does not let this happen. Collectables, if the materials come from the market board, it should work as a "sink", but it doesn't, as most of the materials are provided or purchased from a NPC.

The entire design of how crafting should level, should be based on a combination of creating a HQ gear, and selling it. If you make 10,000 NQ pieces, then you don't level. Only the HQ pieces and HQ 5-slot materia pieces for a profit should earn you experience.

Likewise leveling gathering, is a joke. Diadem should not exist. Collectibles should not exist. You should only be able to level it by finding AND selling HQ items for a profit.

Because otherwise people will just produce an endless amount of garbage and sell it for 1gp to level. We've seen that in most MMORPG's. Few games actually care about the crafting mechanic in a way that just doesn't make it fustrating to play a crafter.

So collectibles just exist as a way to sink time and resources as a crafter. But as a gatherer? What is even the point, you find all these items you can not sell, and have no value to anyone but the collectible appraiser. Why is this a thing at all? That just makes materials even harder for crafters to get.

People just want to level quickly. So they do it by the most laziest means possible. We've seen this with combat as well. People would rather spend 300 hours grinding in POTD than play the roulettes more than once per day. Because every 10 floors in POTD is about the same time one FATE solo.

So the existing situation is bad, and Leve's are what keeps "new" botting in check. However the collectibles are a joke, and the fact you can just easily grind all the crafters from 60 onwards on collectibles alone in a day, tells you that the collectible system should not exist.

But as to what to replace it with. Have the store NPC's "buy" mispriced (items at a loss) items off the marketboard every hour, and have overpriced items (eg anything 100x NPC sale value) unable to be listed.

This is a 1.0 remnant, believe it or not.

Back in Shadowbringers, my sister, my brother in law and I decided to make ARR relics, but silly me had spent all her allowances on Coffee biscuits and I was time gated when we got to the Levequests segment of the saga. I don't really know why these allowances still exist.

Also, I don't know if this is an unpopular thought, but I miss combat leves. If they gave good XP they'd be a great alternative to dungeons and beast tribe quests for leveling, but sadly they just gave up on them.

Bots are unreasonably strong in this game, they would flood the market with infinite gil after no time. Only reason the bot makers refuse to push more powerful crafting and auction house flipping tools is they would draw to much attention to bot and plugin creators and get them cease and desisted.

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Originally Posted by Isala

Look, bud. I get that you feel like "We did it uphill, both ways, in snow AND sand storms!" is a valid reason for someone to have to do the same, but as someone who has been there since 2.0 as well, we're level 100 now, with over 30 Jobs across combat and non-combat. Let the people have easier ways to level, so they can actually catch up to us without having to pay for a level skip.

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First, you have the easy mode since Shadowbringers. It is called Firmament. Second, leves reward money and thus need a limit. Collectables used to reward money and are unlimited, it doesn't get easier than this. Lastly, no one - absolutely no one, uses leves to level DoW/M. The equivalent is FATE. Besides there's no level skip for DoH/L, thankfully.

Nice straw man though.

Nobody hinders you from leveling the old ways.

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Originally Posted by Venarius

First, you have the easy mode since Shadowbringers. It is called Firmament. Second, leves reward money and thus need a limit. Collectables used to reward money and are unlimited, it doesn't get easier than this. Lastly, no one - absolutely no one, uses leves to level DoW/M. The equivalent is FATE. Besides there's no level skip for DoH/L, thankfully.

Nice straw man though.

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There ARE no DoW/DoM Leves past a certain level, so I don't know what you're even talking about here.

And oh no, the pocket change for Leves. Not like you can literally take a handful of maps and make millions upon millions of gil just through the gil drops, let alone the multimillion gil items you can sell to other players. But nope. Those pesky Leves might give you enough to teleport a few times. Can't have that. Seriously. Have you looked at the reward for this crap? Even the large scale leves give you 5k. You're really worried that people can get multiple 5ks, when teleports are costing us 2k a pop?

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Originally Posted by Isala

Have you looked at the reward for this crap? Even the large scale leves give you 5k. You're really worried that people can get multiple 5ks, when teleports are costing us 2k a pop?

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~10k unless for some reason you are turning in nq. This is about 1m for dumping 100 leves. I would like it if the 12 hourly allowance was bumped up to 8 from 6, but I think it would start getting very silly very fast if it was raised much higher than that.

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Originally Posted by Isala

There ARE no DoW/DoM Leves past a certain level, so I don't know what you're even talking about here.

And oh no, the pocket change for Leves. Not like you can literally take a handful of maps and make millions upon millions of gil just through the gil drops, let alone the multimillion gil items you can sell to other players. But nope. Those pesky Leves might give you enough to teleport a few times. Can't have that. Seriously. Have you looked at the reward for this crap? Even the large scale leves give you 5k. You're really worried that people can get multiple 5ks, when teleports are costing us 2k a pop?

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casual player can easy make 8 characters per server no extra cost, it's easy to speedrun 1 new account through msq, level up CUL and ALC (since both usually has easiest leve quest) leave them there to generate allowce, need about 16 days to get full 100 allowce, you can do it 2 per month, double gil reward if you bother with HQ turn in, so it will be 8 - 16 million gil generate per account per month

when game in down time between patch i can make 1 gil generate character in few day, still has some day to spare from 12.5 days limit of spout account, hell i can even max island with my alts so i can do felitious every week for a chance of 3 milion mount

now let remove that 100 allowces limit and let bot farming it non-stop, MB would be fun, you see how many gil you get from 1 leve, but you never count how much that add up over years, and don't worry about teleport cost, i never pay more than 100 gils for teleport for years

it's passive gaining, you hardly need to work for it if you are smart with retainer, 8 characters 16 retainers, can gather whatever you need while waiting, you still has time to do whatever you do ingame, sell whatever multi million gil you get, same as GC subs, take alot of time to make 4 subs and it get you about 7-8 millions per month, but people still do it anyway

I believe they may have kept the leve allowance to prevent gil grinding. 100 leves = 1million gil for almost no work at all (especially if you can buy the item(s) for dirt cheap on the board.
It might seem like an inconvenience, but there's a lot of players who are time limited, and 60k a day for handing in X item is pretty nice imo.

I think leves needs reworking, and then uncapping from there.

If they are to uncap them though, then they would need to remove Gil as a reward and nerf the experience gain dramatically.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

I think leves needs reworking, and then uncapping from there.

If they are to uncap them though, then they would need to remove Gil as a reward and nerf the experience gain dramatically.

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You literally ask for remove it since collectibles not only give you xp but script, if leve give no gil and has xp nerfed, it's instantly turn in to trash that wait for remove later

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Originally Posted by ShariusTC

You literally ask for remove it since collectibles not only give you xp but script, if leve give no gil and has xp nerfed, it's instantly turn in to trash that wait for remove later

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Like I said, it needs reworking, and my main reason for the removal of Gil from leves is because it would be inevitable from their side. Uncapped with Gil rewards it would turn into a very easy and ridiculous Gil printing machine. They did the same with collectables, they'd do the exact same for levequests.

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Originally Posted by Venarius

This isn't true. Leveling to 50 during ARR took weeks. Reaching 51 was also considered a wall for many. They only started easing it up in Stormblood and started handing out free omnicrafters from ShB onwards.

I actually find it disgusting how over the years people are asking for nothing but the path of least resistance. The generation instant gratification ruined gaming.

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My memory is a little foggy but I don't remember ever leveling my crafters without leves and GC daily turn-ins (star). I've been here since 2.0

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Like I said, it needs reworking, and my main reason for the removal of Gil from leves is because it would be inevitable from their side. Uncapped with Gil rewards it would turn into a very easy and ridiculous Gil printing machine. They did the same with collectables, they'd do the exact same for levequests.

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Simplest solution to all of this is just make all leves "(poetics) scrip" and just hide all the crafter/gatherer gear behind scrip costs. No gil rewards.

Like it was always more efficient to do the beast tribe quests to level the crafter/gatherer first, because that at least had a storyline to it (and these stories are FAR more interesting than the collectible stories which just seem to repeat the "Hi, I'm so and so, we have a little problem (we kinda lack someone)", and you immediately go "I'll do it", yet there is pretty much nothing unique to the collectible quests, and you can pretty much level the entire crafter from it alone. But you only get to do that once. Where as the Beast Tribes you can do it repeatedly, just not as often. Hence they are the same as the leves. Limited by how many you can do per day.

What I want is there to stop being 500 different currencies in this game. Fold all the "scrip", "tomes/tokens", and beast tribe currencies into a general "combat gear", "crafting gear" and "gatherer gear" currency that directly scales off where it's earned. So under level 50 1:1, over level 50 to 60, 2:1, 60 to 70, 3:1, etc. Rather than the status quo which leads to obnoxious problem of being unable to determine who trades what, and in the case of dungeon drop tokens/parts ending up with 6 different item slots being wasted, per raid. Once it's no longer a current raid, collapse the content into a single "gear coffer" for what job you defeated it if ilevel synced, and one non-inventory "gear coin" with the same scaling like above, and dispense with the different tokens entirely. If you want the level 90 raid gear without doing the level 90 raid, then you have to do the syrcus tower 5 times as much. Or maybe the scaling can be even steeper to discourage that.

But with crafting and gathering, it just feels really insulting to basically make all this garbage that other players don't buy. It's an utter failure of a system that rewards players for the laziest method of doing things.