How would you design the DPS kits for each Healer?

Bit of a fun post to see how everyone would approach this, I feel like everyone would have different opinions on how a theoretical DPS system for each healer should be handled and im interested to see it.

How i would approach the tool kits.

Scholar: Pretty much bring back Dots.

Remove Art of war and replace it with Miasma II, have broil do aoe damage if miasma is up on a target for aoe situations.
Keep Biolysis, have Miasma be plus on single target so you have to manage both, give them different fall off timers.
Energy drain becomes fester and does extra damage if dots are up.
Deployment tactics can spread dots as well as shields.
Shadowflare returns as a GCD every minute or so and upgrades into the new dot comes out in DT. Remove Ruin II.

White Mage, I don't know the job too well but heres how id approach it:

I would probably just turn Glare IV for a proc for something, such as Dia or a normal glare 3 like bard. Make Glare III cast time a little longer so the instant cast Glare IV feels better.
For AOE I would rework Assize into a weak AOE that can be spammed so holy in dungeons stun isnt a problem. Maybe add another spell on a CD to mix up the spam along with the occassional Glare IV proc.

Sage:

Dosis is a 1-2 combo. Every time you complete the 1-2 for Dosis you gain Addersting, Toxikon now works that it consumes all charges of Addersting but for each charge the damage increases. 1 = same potency as dosis. 2 = slightly more than the full combo, 3 = more than the full combo of dosis. Additionally Toxicon has a chance to lower the cd of Phlegma by 5 seconds. Remove the Dot, instead add that damage around to the other attacks. Dyskarisa is now a conal and is a channeling ability which if you complete the full channel gives you 2 Adderstings.

Astro, Honestly I would keep it the same:

The main change I would add is that instead of Combust being a dot it now accumilates damage that you deal and people who you buffed deal making it a mini-wildfire, it has a 40 second CD.
Keeping it relatively the same I would just break the rule of the thread and touch on non dps kit, just make buffing way more often. There may be a better approach I dont know to be honest.

Always thought that Astro cards should be worth a set amount of potency that's acquired in a different way for each card, e.g. Spear adds X potency to the next 4 autoattacks, Spire creates a lightning aura that deals X potency for 4 ticks, Bole is a thorns effect that deals X potency thorns damage to the next 4 attacks.

So, you'd want to play Spear on an autoattacker (or yourself if soloing), Spire on a melee (or yourself if soloing), Bole on the main threat (or yourself, if soloing), and so on. The cards can also have minor sweeteners that don't affect potency in raid fights, like the autoattack card making autoattacks faster, the lightning aura being AoE, or the thorns card causing a 10s Slow on affected trash mobs in dungeons.

Presto, cards are now fun to use when soloing because you have to fulfill the varying conditions yourself, and they're fun to use in casual group content because of the sweeteners. That's a major complaint with current cards (that they're junk when solo or in light parties) solved. And the bonus damage should appear on the buff recipient's screen, too, to give visual feedback.

Honestly doesn't need that much:

- bring back aoe dots for all healers
- WHM: focus on simple, semi frequent heavy hitting gcd spells like tornado/quake/flood. This is probably the best healer to introduce procs or stack-building into their kit as long as it's simple and clean

- SCH: back to the roots with tactical poisons, frequent debuffs to expose and target enemy weaknesses, maybe a stance that turns most healing spells into a damage version like sacred soil turns into shadowflare - opportunity cost focused

- AST: a new card set separate from a support deck with no charges, that is focused on a variety of attacks but picked by rng which can be manipulated with shuffle/spread/royal road too. I think that would bring back their oracle side back without too much adjustments

- SGE: The hybrid heal+attack style on low recast is the way to go

SCH:
Let us spread our DoT [Biolysis] with [Deployment Tactics] Like in PvP.

[Broil] have 50% change to trigger an another ability [New ST Ability].

[New Dot]
Add another DoT ability,
which also can be spread with [Deployment Tactics]!.

[Art of War]
has increased radius.

[Energy Drain] has an addional effect:
inc your DoT(s) dmg by x% for x sec.
(does NOT stack).
(still used for weaving between Broils
and to dump aetherflow stacks)

[Dissipation]
Addional effect:
Make [Energy Drain] free to cast
during it's duration (30s)

This will make it so you want to use 1x [Energy Drain] in your opner to buff your Dot(s), both in ST and AOE.
With Dissipation, you will get something of a burst phase, where you weave a lot of [Energy drains] between broils and your procs.

White mage and Sage:

Remove DoTs.

for white mage Passive that heal party while doing DPS

for sage Passive that shield party while doing DPS

Abilities that enhance healing to be AoE

abilities that can turn shields to heals and vice versa.



Scholar:

Give debuff to enemies that any team member hit them they got healed by fairy.
seraphs fairy can convert healing to shield.

Astrologian:

Give buffs to team member that buff is that player got extra healing if the are attacking and convert to shield if they are not attacking.
Make cards system same like monk and ninja but for buffs

I appreciate the Thread. :)

Sadly i have not much new to add as i personaly prefer a more interessting support gameplay.

Maybe a two step AoE Damage Combo for White Mage.
Scholar should get there ranged AoE Back but more important there DoT-

How would I design a DPS kit? Badly, most likely. :p

However, I do like this take on WHM. (And there are links in there to takes on SCH, AST, and SGE.)

Burning all Aetherflow should give SCH a nice little finisher that's basically Assize.

White Mage damage would be perfect if Afflatus Misery was available by level 70, ideally 60. I loathe the WHM healing kit leveling process and think it feels awful before Afflatus Rapture, but it's a fun class at 80 all around.

Sage is okay but I would like Addersting at an earlier level.

I don't know astrologian well enough to have an opinion.


I think the basic two button damage rotation is a strength of healer classes, because it means you can focus on directing the group without juggling an intense rotation.

Personally I’d do the following:

WHM:
Add Water/Banish as a 2.5 second cast time spell, with a 20 second cooldown that later gains charges.
Add Thundercloud system to Aero.
Readd Aero III
Readd Cleric stance, but reworked to boost damage and healing actions, later upgrades to Plenary Indulgence and gives access to a use of Quake, Tornado and Flood that replaces Stone/Aero/Water respectively.

SCH:
Add Miasma, Miasma II, Miasma III as spells (Bio III as well), which later upgrade to Toxify when Biolysis is available. But give it a 21 second timer on it instead of a 30 second one.
Make a new DoT that works like old Miasma II, I’d call it Scan/Intel personally.
Bane gets added, either as an upgrade to Energy Drain or Becomes its own thing.
If Bane is it down thing made Energy Syphon an upgrade to energy drain.

AST:
Bring back Stella but have it work like the previously mentioned Water/Banish but as an instant cast. Genuinely I think AST can get away with so little because of the card system.

SGE:
Go crazy, make it have a bunch of actions that both heals and attacks, give it a 1-2-3 combo, either like PCT or like other jobs, give it a Dot that has a higher potency but is way shorter, or a dot that lasts longer but each tick is weaker. It’s the so called DPS healer like how GNB is a DPS tank, go crazy, make it something interesting

WHM:
change dia/glare back to aero/stone, leave the light magic stuff to holy and glare4(but call is banish).
Change aero from a dot to a spell that does stone levels of damage and grants you a 10% haste buff and higher MP cost
Add Water as a short cooldown GCD attack. All GCD actions lower the cooldown of Water by a small amount, but healing spells lower the cooldown by 2~3 times as much.
Put a spike effect on Regen.

SCH:
Add miasma back as a separate 42s dot.
Broil now burns off 3s of bio/miasma each time its cast for bonus damage equal to a tick (massively speeding up how fast the dots tick if you
Energy Drain now extends bio/miasma each by 3 seconds in addition to the upfront damage

AST:
add a separate draw/deck from the current one with a 20s cooldown that doesn't have stacks. randomly gives you either a direct damage attack, a spike effect buff, a %damage buff, or an effect that gives the target a small amount of MP while increasing the damage the final tick of all your active combust dots deal by a large amount

SGE:
increase the damage from toxicon to roughly 130% of a dosis.
Give dosis a 35% proc rate to give a stack of Addersting, and a separate 35% proc to lower the coolodown of phlegma by 10s.
Change eukrasia dosis from a dot to an attack that deal dosis levels of damage and gives an effect that grants 6 stacks of a large damage potency boost to GCD spells

WHM: Brought this up before but return Stone/Aero element spells as the regular attacks. Return Stone's cast time to 2.5s, and instead give it Water, which has the same potency but is instant cast and is on like a 15s CD. Make Stone have a low chance to proc Freecure. Freecure works on any non-lily healing GCD (not counting Raise) and also makes it instant cast. If freecure is spent, the next Stone will upgrade to Banish/Glare with at least double the potency of Stone.

SCH: Return Miasma, Bane, Shadowflare, Fester. As someone who's been in a savage PF with a SCH insisting on opening with 6 Energy Drains and blaming their cohealer for wiping to the opening raidwides I would prefer Shadowflare/Fester use a separate resource from aetherflow though. The UI also needs improvements to make tracking DoTs easier.

AST: Dualcast malefic (2GCDs unlike in pvp where it's 1GCD+oGCD) for more weave windows and mobility. That and some way to tame the RNG on Minor Arcana would've probably been enough to make EW's system likeable for me.

SGE: E. Dosis shortened to 15s but subsequent uses extends the dot by 15s, up to 30s. E. Dosis puts a barrier on the Kardion target instead of healing, and said barrier has a chance to grant an Addersting when absorbed. If an Addersting is granted through E. Diagnosis/Prognosis, give the Sage a buff that lets you follow up your next Toxicon with Psyche, where Psyche is a GCD with double Dosis' potency.

WHM
Each time you cast a spell you gain stacking buff -- let's call it Natural Stasis, and when you reach 3 stacks it turns into a buff -- we'll call it Tranquil Heart that lets you cast any spell instantly. Tranquil hearts can also stack up to 3 times. WHM gets 3 new cleaving damage spells, Gale, Flood, and Quake, they all have long enough cast times to where you don't want to be hard casting them so you want to be using your Tranquil Hearts to instantly cast them. Using gale grants a personal movement speed buff, lowers the cool down on the new dash, and grants a buff that turns Cure III into Assize, still an oGCD that deals damage, and heals. Using Flood heavies, and slows most enemies, and grants a buff that turns Cure III into Cure IV, an instant damage, and healing GCD. Using Quake will transform it into its follow up After Shock, and will grant a buff that turns Cure III into Stoneskin which is an oGCD that is just partywide barrier health.

SCH
Super buff Recitation, and Deployment Tactics by dramatically lowering their cool downs, and giving them multiple charges. Recitation can now transform Biolysis into a second DOT that stacks with Biolysis. Deployment Tactics can no spread more buffs that are on allies, and more debuffs that are on enemies including Chain Stratagem, and both DOTs. Give SCH Summon Statice every minute or so as a DPS fairy.

AST
Give AST two new abilities, Double Cast, and Timely Cast with multiple charges. Double Cast transforms into, and lets you, use, your most recently GCD spell as an oGCD. Timely cast gives you a buff that will copy, and store your next spell to be used later as an oGCD. Each tick of damage from Combust III now has a 50% chance to grant a stack of Stardust, at 3 stacks they turn into a buff that turns Helios into Nova, an instant spell that deals damage, and AOE heals.

SGE
Rework Toxicon. It now just has a cool down with charges. When a Eukrasian barrier breaks, it grants a stack of Adders Sting which buffs the potency of Toxicon. Rework Soteria so that it is basically Hypercharge for SGE where you can spam an instant 1.5 second recast time spell, and let 60 seconds be the default cool down time.

For SGE I would make Toxicon a DPS gain and continue working as is but also give the job a frequent source of OGCD shielding ala Divine Benison (Which I feel like WHM never even needed in the first place) that can trigger it.

Speaking only for SCH.

• Ruin's potency is as strong as a dot tick. The idea is that if you really have nothing else to do, then do this.
• 2-4 DoTs. The idea of having to maintain dots is that you have all the time in the world to fit in GCD healing.
• Removing clunky mechanics like Summon Seraph, and Aetherpact replacing those with... Rouse. While we can still summon, it is not our primary focus so by having access to a single summon ability is more than enough. Just flesh out the kit of the pet.
• While on the topic of pets, pet management needs a comeback. Allowing the fairy to take damage and accumulate enmity, all while having the tools for sustain and pet positioning will be another mechanic that can keep us busy.

Bonus points if they will allow us to control 2 pets at the same time: Carbuncle for offensive purposes, might even forego some of the dots mentioned above to accomodate for this, and the default fairy.

Reading this thread it occured to me that FFXIV has no 'channeled' spells except for something like Flamethrower. I wonder if such spells could find a home in the Healer spellsets? They do lack in the interactivity department but it does seem like an avenue not explored much in XIV... that or they got removed and I've forgotten amongst all the reworks. lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SeriousPan

Reading this thread it occured to me that FFXIV has no 'channeled' spells except for something like Flamethrower. I wonder if such spells could find a home in the Healer spellsets? They do lack in the interactivity department but it does seem like an avenue not explored much in XIV... that or they got removed and I've forgotten amongst all the reworks. lol

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Channeled spells could be good to reintroduce for aoe situations but in trials and raids the game barely accommodates casting currently so unless the movement cools off in the next couple of Expansions channelling won't be very viable.

I would say this for sage then should add the DPS more on each type of shield break would've interesting and value shielding alors more and have one for when you trigger Pepsi(I know it's Pepsis but ya haha xx))


whm should add a DPS on aquaveil when it expire or like a small aoe damage like the vengeance of warrior but weaker when you use the shield it can give you a stack of water that is insta cast but aoe like a 200 with a little damage over time.


astro will be a bit more tricky but I would add more infliction or like a debuff like the machinist mine thingy.


sch would more Dot's but when a fairy skill is used you could change broil for a better version for a use like ruin 4 on smn or when the fairy use her Regen link you could gain insta cast with aoe dots and more aoe damage

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

Channeled spells could be good to reintroduce for aoe situations but in trials and raids the game barely accommodates casting currently so unless the movement cools off in the next couple of Expansions channelling won't be very viable.

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The combat design lacks any depth and nuances, so designing for it is rather difficult if things that dont go against the design are rather limited.
Imagine we would get proper support buffs, debuffs and statuseffects outside of a short burst window.

I would make healers healer again. Let me explain. Note : I do savage and extremes, no fatal.

The problem I have with the current healer design is as follow. A correctly played healer is basically, 1 DPS gcd spammed (+ dot) and ogcd heals. Why? Because ogcd are way too powerful. But keep in mind that healing should accessible to brain dead player that don't know what they're doing.

What I suggest is to invert the logic. Every healer will have a base kit of ~5 gcd heals to keep tank and party alive. As for potency, this base should be able to keep everybody alive. To sustain this base kit, there should be a DPS rotation that will buff those skills. A simple 1-2-3 or something apporaching, nothing too complexe. But doing this rotation will buff the base kit and allow to have the same heal output but with added DPS.

To help a little bit the healing, or when high heal output is needed during encounter, I would add 2-4 ogcd heals (single and aoe) with fairly long cds.

For the DPS part, there is the base 1-2-3 gcd dps rotation. All other dammage should be ogcd with a fairly short cd (around 20-30 sec) and any ressource stacking mechanism (aka lillies, aether flow, etc..). Could add charges to them so if you want to unleash everything during burst, you can. So you weave ogcd DPS within gcd heals. That's the main idea "gcd heals, ogcd DPS"

This solution would solve the brain dead vs optimized player.
you want brain dead game play, you get brain dead rotation 100% of the time, no standing around doing nothing.
you want engaging play, you get : gcd DPS rotation -> gcd heals and you weave ocgd DPS in there for more fun.


Of course every healer would come with its own flavour. Here are some ideas:

WHM :
You're the pure heal. Shield and hot? Don't knwo those words. You're the healer version of the black mage : you cast powerfull heals standing still.

• a rotation of 2 gcd heal (h1..2), h1 buffs h2
• a rotation of 2 gcd aoe heal (H1..H2), H1 buffs H2
  
• a rotation of 3 gcd DPS (d1..3), rotation buffs h1
• a rotation of 2 gcd aoe DPS (D1..2), rotation buffs h1
  
• Your ogcd heals are pure healing burst.
• Your ogcd dps are pure dps burst and 1 dot.
• Your party utilies are stuns, interrupt and slow.

Typical rotation is (d1 d2 d3 h1 h2).
Typical aoe rotation is (D1 D2 h1 h2)
Brain dead rotation is (h1 h2)





SCH :
You're the hot guy ;) You apply shield and strong hots to refill health. More over, you're a mobile and short range healer (after all your class was born in the middle of the battle field to help your comarad on the front), your gcd are instant. Counter part your range is shorter than usual (but not melee) but you have the fairy to help on deported heals.

• 1 weak direct heal (h)
• 2 short hot (hot1..2), hot1 buffs hot2, rotation buffs d1
• 1 shield (S), buffs hot1
  
• 1 aoe hot
  
• 3 dps rotation (d1..3), rotation buffs S
• 1 aoe dot (Dot)
  
• Ogcd heals are deported hots and shield, through the fairy.
• Ogcd dps are 2 dots buffing each other and pure dps burst.
• Party utilities are mobility : combat sprint, nullifying gcd on ally and a second stack of rescue.

Typical rotation is (d1 d2 d3 S hot1 hot2)
Typical aoe rotation is (D S hot)
Brain dead rotation is (S h)





AST :
You're the shield guy. You do weak direct heal and apply strong shield. But you're also a buffer with your card.

• 1 weak heal (h) buffs d1
• 2 strong shields (s1..2), s1 buffs s2 and s2 buffs h
  
• 1 aoe heal (H)
• 1 aoe shield (S), buffs H
  
• 2 gcd dps rotation (d1..2), buffs h
• 2 aoe dps (D1..D2), buffs h
  
• Ogcd heals are retarded direct heal, like heartly start, and shields. And you're the one reading the future, excog should be yours.
• Ogcd dps are direct DPS and 1 dot.
• Party utilies are cards : can be single target mitigation or dps buff

Typical rotation is (s1 s2 d1 d2 h)
Typical aoe rotation is (s1 s2 D1 D2 h)
Brain dead rotation is (s1 s2 h)




SGE :
You're the dps heal, you heal through leech. You're the melee heal : all your gcd are instant but your dps is melee range (no positionnal). Counter part your heals have longer range.

• 1 weak direct heal (h)
  
• 1 weak aoe heal (H)
• 1 weak aoe hot (Hot)
  
• 4 dps leech rotation (d1..d4) each skill increase in leech power. Buffs h.
• 3 aoe dps leech rotation (D1..3) each skill increase in leech power. Buffs h a lot.
• Modifier that change the leech from single target to player centered aoe heals.
  
• Ogcd heals are leech buffing and hots.
• Ogcd DPS are pure DPS (that leech as well) and 1 dot.
• Party utilities are enemy debuffs : dammage output down, dammage input up.

Typical rotation is (d1 d2 d3 d4 h)
Typical aoe rotation is (D1 D2 D3 h)
Brain dead rotation is (h)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

Bit of a fun post to see how everyone would approach this, I feel like everyone would have different opinions on how a theoretical DPS system for each healer should be handled and im interested to see it.

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I still push this guys ideas. They are not only well thought out but they also use pre existing assets which means they don't need to spend money on development just time on balancing potencies etc...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF3XIhJm_N0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2YZ1dx34ug

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNJGY9B7VW4&t=683s

At an absolute minimum bane and miasma are back.
Miasma can be 21s.
Art of war applies miasmolysis giving it a use in single target (shorter duration higher potency dot ~15s maybe).
Fester effect on broil to incentivise dot upkeep above broilspam.
If possible, make dot timers like storm's eye, but rather than extending to double, just a tick or two leeway.

Potency upgrade on ruin 2 to make it enough that the second weave slot isn't free, but also isn't penalised as heavily if you chuck an energy drain in.
Potency upgrade on energy drain to ~180. MP generation on energy drain so you can get ~3.5-7k back in a hurry in case of death and it was a recoverable mechanic.

Quickened aetherflow is back.
A new button that converts all galvanise into eye for an eye/vengeance style counterhit. Damage type agnostic.
There could also be a spender for the fairy gauge since it usually sits at 100 because onion is rarely necessary. Or have a dh/whatever boost depend on how full it is.

Seraph, fey blessing, fey union all consolidated back into rouse and possible reduction on indom cooldown to compensate.
Baneful impaction is gone because it's not really a dot in the way that whatever gunbreaker's version of circle of scorn isn't really a dot. It's mechanically no different to an x potency attack. I guess they can't direct hit so whatever.

Fever dream bonuses:
Addendum: Black - this temporarily upgrades Broil IV to Fire V and Ruin II to Thunder V and grants astral fire 3 for the duration.
Addendum: White - this temporarily upgrades energy drain to assize - can't really give reraise here, but it'd replace seraphism as the broadly high healing throughput button.
Helices and Modus Veritas (dots and halves dot duration to double potency). For simplicity, 128s duration proteaohelix where the type depends on the current weather; Modus Veritas probably ought to cost an aetherflow per use.

For WHM I would leave it as it is for the people who enjoy a simple DPS rotation. I would change the leveling by adding a downgrade to blood lily early on (50 or 60) and while we are at it make medica 2 lower level because is insane you don't have it by AV. I feel the return of the full cast glare might also be interesting, so altought WHM would be the most barebonds DPS wise of the healers it will still have to think a lot about movement and weaving.

SCH I would add 1-2 more dots that you can spread to other targets. if we feeling spicy I feel another aetherflow damage spender that is AOE and has uses in single target might also be interesting (and lead to more chad SCH co healers while we are at it.

AST Im biased and would mostly keep it as it is. Cards would be like EW and minor and astrodyne would get a complete rework. what? idk! maybe having the option to turn lady into a buff extention would be interesting.

SGE would get a compelte rework. It would have a DPS rotation similar in complexity to PLD, you would get addersgalls by doing your rotation and get adderstings by using said healing. something more concrete would be having a 3 step combo with 2 finishers - one is a dot and the other gives you addersgal - and after using and adersgal you get an adersting to use in a different skill/combo that is very strong and the last hit puts a shield on your target and if thats broken you get another adersting.

I think this strikes a good balance between the healers. We got a simple one in WHM, SCH who would have to keep an eye on multiple dots while still healing, AST who would stil be fast paced on the 2 minute window, and sage being more close to an actual DPS.

Mostly healing as WHM, I can think of two attacks to add to it.

1. Seraph Strike, bring it from PvP to PvE. Make it cost 1 Lily to use and nourish the Blood Lily. Make the Lilies always be useful as you no longer have to wait for people to take damage, and even then Assize/Tetragrammaton is always better than Afflatus Solace or Rupture by being oGCD.

2. Bring back Fluid Aura in it's damage dealing form, though no need for knockbacks. And maybe at some level make it upgrade into Flood. It would also allow WHM to have some more connection to the CNJ roots by having spells that aren't just about Light.

Someone already linked my WHM, which makes me happy. But for those who have not seen my ramblings, here's WHM SCH AST and SGE.

Or, in shorter terms (and reduced to the absolute basics of the ideas):

WHM:
Dia reduced to 12s, potency adjusted to compensate
New skill, Water, introduced at level 15, has a 15s CD, is a GCD and is always 40p stronger than the current Stone/Glare level. Upgrades to Banish when you get Glare.

SCH:
Biolysis can stay at 30s
Miasma returns as a 24s DOT
Shadowflare returns as a 15s DOT, with 100% uptime possible. I'd suggest it be 120p on cast, and 40p per tick. By making the potency this, it's stronger than AOW (so you want to maintain it), but not strong enough to spam
Energy Drain upgrades to Bane, causing it to become AOE and spread the Bio/Miasma DOTs from primary target, to all others. If the DOT durations don't get reset by Bane, maybe include Chain in there too.

AST:
Rework cards (yes, again), so that all of them give damage, but in unique ways. For example, Bole could cause counterattacks based on Max HP, Arrow could increase Autoattack speed, etc. Have one card be 'best' for each role, with Balance being the 'wildcard' that can be used on anyone (but ideally DPS). By doing this, a 'Tank' card and 'Healer' card can exist again, allowing every party member to be a potential target, not just the DPS.

Add all 6 suits to Minor Arcana (instead of just the Crowns), and have their effects be the same as the Major Arcana of the suit, but weaker. In the idea above, they're all 300p total.

Re-add Royal Road, to sacrifice a Minor Arcana to empower a Major Arcana. The old 'Expand' effect (the AOE one) would be replaced with 'Echo', causing the card to play itself a second time, upon playing a card on someone else.

SGE:
Add two new actions, Neuralgia (a cone AOE) and Myasthenia (a line AOE), both with 2 charges and a 20s recharge time. When alternating between the two, the player would get a bonus 20p.
Add an effect to Dosis, which causes Neuralgia or Myasthenia (chosen at random with each Dosis) to reduce in CD by 1 second.
Rework Toxikon into a pseudo Enshroud, allowing for the execution of Neuralgia and Myasthenia without needing a charge.
Rework Pneuma into just the damage half, as the 'finisher' for the Toxikon window.
The healing half of Pneuma becomes a new OGCD action, Soma.

There's a lot, a LOT, more to the ideas than what is written in this post. If you'd like to see what else I'd do to fix/ruin the Jobs (depending on perspective), I'd love it if you gave my ramblings a look-see. I might be a little biased with that recommendation, though

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

Bit of a fun post to see how everyone would approach this, I feel like everyone would have different opinions on how a theoretical DPS system for each healer should be handled and im interested to see it.

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Keep in mind that I've exclusively played WHM or SCH in 100% of the content when it was new. My opinion is that AST is way too similar to White Mage to even call it different. Sage is different but the only time I ever encountered healing pressure was in the job quest it comes with. (Maybe because it was tuned for Sage and wouldn't work if you could play Scholar in it.)

Preface, the AOE is actually different between the three healers (Holy is positioned, Gravity is targeted, and Art of War is "caster centered"), but these aren't really different in any way that matters, just where you place your character when you cast.

WHM: Make use of the the "elemental" business it inherited from 1.0 Conjurer.
The two main "DPS" buttons just randomly picks 1 of 6 things - (Water, Earth, Air | Ice, Fire, Thunder)
This is largely cosmetic since the game only does unaspected damage, but when the WHM fires off a what is normally Stone/Glare, it would pick a short-cast version of 1 of the 6 elements the game.
The Dot would do the same, except apply a "DoT" that overwrites each other. So if your last cast was Fire, casting Water would remove the DoT and replace it with Water.
Holy same as normal, but stun always works on trash, but MP costs increase if cast consecutively while target stunned
Assize swaps between "Assize" (unaspected damage, refresh, and hp recovery) and "Dia II" (refresh, 1 minute long DoT, HP recovery)
(And before someone says "that steps on BLM's toes", no it doesn't, this is originally what conjurer was. Even only using Water, Earth and Air this is fine.)

As opposed to AST:
Draw a card first (no card drawn, the DPS buttons will only cast unaspected magic)
Main DPS button will cast a 5 second DoT on the target of the same card debuff + unaspected damage.
DoT DPS button will cast 30 second DoT with the same card.
AOE Gravity inflicts Heavy on trash targets, always works, but MP costs increase if cast while already debuffed
Player can either pick a card at random each cast, hold a card indefinitely


SCH:
Honestly Scholar works the way it should work, though I would give it two DoT's, and change the AOE back to the "poison field" effect.
It mostly needs to be able to cast debuffs as an AOE, and presently it does not.

Sage:
I'll leave this up to others as it's too new to call it "needing fixing"


So in short, WHM DoT's cycle between element DoT's, one at a time. (The game has Aero, Aero II and Aero III DoT's, Burns, Chilled, Filfthy, etc)
AST's DoT's can be chosen from the cards for both a debuff on the DPS and a buff when Party healing.

Like I get the intent with AST, but AST keeps getting nerfed, and WHM gets nerfed and I just see the "First time here" meme of the WHM to the AST.

Also again, careful what you wish for, any additional DPS options will come at the cost of the potency of existing ones. That's largely why they removed existing dots and extended the length of the remaining ones. The 1-1-1-1'ing comes from making the DoT's not as frequently renewed. If DoT's only lasted 8 seconds, and you had multiple ones to cast, you could just over lap them by the cast times (Which is how Scholar would have played if they didn't take them away.)

In solo content however a lot of this stuff just doesn't work. Imagine trying to do that final Zeno's battle with just short DoT's.

No matter what is suggested, The developers have decided that the healer DPS doesn't matter and thus it will always have a ceiling that makes it a joke compared to a DPS having more uptime from not having to self-heal.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

Sage:
I'll leave this up to others as it's too new to call it "needing fixing"

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I disagree with this Sage isn't really a new job it's far too similar to scholar. Sage honestly plays like a scholar spec instead of a unique job, even with astro and whm being forced to become incredible similar the cards are completely different from anything in WHM.
Sage is just... Easier scholar. Kardia is embrace most of sages moves are carbon copies of scholar and even addersting and addersgal are basically just aetherpoints except without ED.
I think sage desperate needs to be fixed and by that I mean uniqueness away from scholar because right now all it is easy scholar. Or I guess returning more pet management to scholar could have sage remain the same.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

I disagree with this Sage isn't really a new job it's far too similar to scholar. Sage honestly plays like a scholar spec instead of a unique job, even with astro and whm being forced to become incredible similar the cards are completely different from anything in WHM.
Sage is just... Easier scholar. Kardia is embrace most of sages moves are carbon copies of scholar and even addersting and addersgal are basically just aetherpoints except without ED.
I think sage desperate needs to be fixed and by that I mean uniqueness away from scholar because right now all it is easy scholar. Or I guess returning more pet management to scholar could have sage remain the same.

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I agree, I think Scholar lost a lot of it's uniqueness by making the pet basically invisible to use. Like I played Sage a little to try and get a feel for it, and really only the GCD's felt the same as WHM/AST, despite not working exactly the same. Contrast to Scholar where you have to hit a button to get the extended kit to light up, at least the GCD "cure 2(Adloquium) and medica equivalent(Succor)" have the net same effect.

So the other day, as I was prepping to for DT, I took all my gear off including the job stone, and, guess what I saw:
https://i.ibb.co/WWPsCJR/ffxiv-ARR20-conjurer.png

Behold it's all the spells we've lost since 2.0
We've literately lost everything except Cure, Cure 2, Medica, Raise, Aero and Stone.

personally:
WHM (on top of existing tools):
aero DoT, stone single target, water target-AOE--these either one-two into each other in preferred combination/with glare/dia etc,
secondary OGCD that can proc off these being applied to slap with a holy that has an additional effect based on the prior one-two combo (like aero-or-dia -> water spreading the DoT slightly thinner but across multiple targets, or stone -> glare making lilies cooldown slightly shorter, or stone/glare -> water making the potency redistribute to be 'spikier' in single target but with appropriately sharper falloff for multitargets, or aero -> dia making a floor-puddle on the target for ticks of damage a la deathflare/garuda, idk) my scant knowledge of WHM is largely secondhand, but basically mini-mudras is the idea. just a cute slightly-customizable thing to do instead of being (just) Glare-Mage (you just go one-two and hit the OGCD at some point before you do another one-two that'd overwrite it, without taking away the existing dawntrail glare4 procs for occasional added spice recently added).

SCH (on top of existing tools):
tbh i'm torn between just letting SGE take the forcibly-passed torch by the devteam and pivoting away from a dps rotation in lieu of more interaction with the fairy gauge (gainers and spenders, possibly bringing back the now-lost-to-time-forever selene skills in this new avenue), more steamlined and synergistic skills (making dissipation/seraph/seraphism stop locking you out of parts of your kit arbitrarily, etc) and so on to just fill what would be downtime with meter/resource management instead, or gaining new spells that debuff the enemy in various ways (strength+dex/int+mind that are overwritten by their larger role-action cousins? lower enemy crit chance as a smaller mirror/reference to chain strat, slightly slower auto-attack interval? theres a lot of existing debuff avenues that could be re-tooled to actually exist in a boss/raid capacity that doesnt read "fully resisted") rather than outright damage-dealing (to serve as an opposite/foil to AST's extreme party support focus)

or just largely bringing back old-SCH, since "my busted OP ogcd kit is specifically designed to free up GCDs that i can spend on spinning multiple DoTs like plates as intended in a fluid and well-designed manner" was a good shtick and i'm still mad to see it go having gained nothing in exchange.

AST (on top of existing skills):
tbh i'd say AST could be fine with it's current dps options if they fill that time with something else, like leaning further into cards etc like the old card potency/duration/aoe modifications and cash-outs you used to be able to do to micromanage your cards just so if desired. AST had a bunch of cool stuff that was stripped away pretty arbitrarily, and could probably see a comeback without much issue.

SGE (you get it by now):
-differentiate the current [short-cast slideable GCDs with literally identical potency in both single target and aoe (sole exception being phlegma)] swathe of moves, i dont care how--move the potencies around, add secondary effects (maybe this one gives kardion target a teeny shield, or a little regen, or debuffs the enemy a little, maybe the laser also doubles as an aoe-esuna since all those got snipped, idk), literally anything to provide a proper hierarchy of spells over the current illusion of choice more or less.
-toxikon is now an OGCD (maybe THIS is the one that slaps a small shield on the kardion target mentioned above, since it thematically fits with abilities like panhaima applying several small 'ablative' shields, and you gain uses of toxikon for your shields being broken anyway)

I've posted my designs in the healer megathread about a year ago now, I'll just relink to those.

WHM Rework 1:
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6261020

Lily system is replaced with a proc system that transforms your Aero DoT and a new Water buff into Dia and Banish when using Cures and Regens. Glare is also changed into a semi-finisher after 3 Stone casts. Dia and Banish also nourish the Blood Lily. Focuses a little more on longer cast times.

WHM Rework 2:
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6383926

What if BLM was a healer? Has a damage stance that increases natural MP regen, Glare = Fire IV, Banish III = Fire III, Banish = Fire, Dia = Xenoglossy. The healing stance is entered by casting any healing spell, each spell charges the Blood Lily and comes with a hefty MP cost. Swapping back to damage using Banish III changes Banish to Afflatus Misery if the Blood Lily has any charge.

Cure is also free, but does not charge the Blood Lily, it's a failsafe to make sure that healing is always available in some form.

SCH Rework:
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6266906

Revolves around stance dancing between White Grimoire and Black Grimoire. White Grimoire summons Eos and changes your basic heals into shields, while Black Grimoire summons Selene and upgrades your DoTs (including the returning Miasma). Eos focuses on bolstering heals while Selene brings defence utilities. Aetherflow abilities are also altered massively and focus more on modifying the GCD heals rather than oGCD heals. Breaking shields grants stacks of Enlightenment that allow the use of the powerful DoT Kaustra.

SGE Rework:
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6273539

Dosis III builds Addersting and can proc Dosis IV. Eukrasian Dosis is also changed to a debuff in similar vein to Death's Design. Addersting is now your primary healing and damage gauge, with a spender that deals strong damage and restores some MP, and Pneuma spending both MP and gauge for a strong attack and heal. Kardia is also a more central mechanic with Pankardia and different Kardia effects from spells.

AST Rework:
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6280109

Focuses more on time-based effects; regens, delayed heals, DoTs, doomsday comets, and abilities to snapshot, reverse, and speed up these effects. The seal system remains, but cards themselves have varied effects and buffs, with Divination also providing a very strong party buff for using cards of different varieties. The sects also make a return to swap between barriers and regens, and can even be swapped mid-combat. Malefic also procs stacks that let you use Fall Malefic.

I think I'm happiest with SCH, AST, and my 2nd WHM reworks.

There's also an unfinished "doomsday prophet" melee healer concept I made somewhere in that thread, but I'm not super happy with some of the mechanics and want to rethink that idea too.

WHM:
- Mostly like now because it's good to have an easy job in the role
- You need to cast a light-aspected spell (Glare/Holy/Afflatus _) every 15 seconds in order to maintain a self-buff (like BLM Astral Fire)
- The rest of the time you're spamming a slightly stronger filler spell (Stone)

SCH:
- 3 DoTs (maybe more!)
- Very weak Broil as a filler spell
- Cleric stance but with a more Scholarly name
- You can use Deployment Tactics to spread the dots (and Virus, which returns as a targeted mitigation)

AST:
- Something time magic flavoured, e.g. you use one spell to build up stacks on the enemy, then another spell to consume all the stacks for big damage
- Doesn't need a complex dps rotation since you should be using hotbar space and mental space to do stuff with cards

SGE:
- Damage kit should take up ~50% of your hotbar, like on tanks. This will mean a simpler healing kit and that's okay.
- Eukrasian Dosis maintains a haste buff on self, giving you a 2s GCD
- Multiple short-cooldown GCDs and oGCDs (think Drill and Gauss Round from MCH)
- Every GCD should have a Eukrasian version
- Some kind of busy-feeling burst phase borrowed from GNB/VPR/MCH
- High mobility, few cast times. But some spells require you to be in melee range

It's hard to say really but I really enjoy how PvP has more unique-ness vs PvE I'd take a page outta their book.

WHM:
-Give them Seraph Strike vs the dash they got in DT keep the free cure III proc too so there's synergy
-Chance on DoT tick to throw out a slightly weaker Afflatus
-Presence of mind increases spell speed and adds an extra hit per cast (not full dmg but like an extra small hit)
-Add back in Fluid Aura but take it's knockback away and keep it's dmg

SCH:
-DoT based gameplay Miasma II, Bio/2
-Bring back Bane also have it transfer DoTs from a dead target in the last 5 seconds to another (for add phases/dungeons)
-Bring back Shadowflare give it it's Slow Debuff (Let it also work on bosses)
-Change Seraphism to an ability where when your DoTs tick it heals the party for % dmg done (kinda like Vampiric Embrace from WoW) so it has offense and defense
-Bring back Selene and have both Eos+Selene bring unique buffs (old sks buff and have Eos debuff enemies like old Eye for an Eye)

Ast:
-Time magic back (Extending buffs)
-Royal road so it's able to enhance cards + Lady/Lords
-Cards giving haste, dmg, old bole and being able to spread them, keeping RNG as well for cards
-Macro Cosmos DPS neutral
-Noct Sect
-Remove Horoscope
-Add sleeve draw back in

As for SGE I have no idea I'm already bummed out that going into DT they didn't get much and the 2nd DoT can't be stacked so /shrug