Feedback: Crystalline Conflict (Ranked)

Feedback: Crystalline Conflict (Ranked)

As we near the end of the expansion, it has become apparent in almost every season of Crystalline Conflict that the queues stop popping when people feel comfortable with their ranking on the leaderboards until the last few days of a season. I don't know if this is a problem affecting other data centers, but it is very noticeable on North American servers.

All win-trading and account piloting aside, I think it would be beneficial for the life of the ranked PvP community as a whole to introduce some form of rank decay or other change to keep games alive. Some possible iterations of this that I could see potentially remediating/addressing these issues:

1. Remove the "Highest Tier/Rank" metric and cause rank to start decaying after X amount of days/weeks of not playing X amount of ranked matches.
2. Keep the peak rating system, but introduce a penalty where that peak value gets affected after not playing X amount of ranked matches for X amount of time.
3. Remove the ability for players to queue for Casual matches up until Diamond rank and combine the Casual/Ranked queues for Platinum and below. (Oftentimes, it is players in the lower ranks that suffer greatly at the end of the season as Diamond + Crystal players will continue to pop games to fight for top 100).
4. A more controversial resolution, remove the separation from Casual/Ranked matches altogether and make just a single Crystalline Conflict queue. (A lot of the times, casual ends up being comprised of higher skilled players who just want to stomp on newer players and harass them over the course of the game which dramatically affects their interest in learning Crystalline Conflict and adding more players to both Casual and Ranked queues).

I think Crystalline Conflict is a million times better in terms of queue popping than Feast ever was, but I do think there are some improvements to be made by the development team going forward. As it was in the Feast days, most of the players seen keeping ranked alive at Diamond and Crystal, are players who have alts on every data center and are part of top 100 on every DC.

While I don't think my ideas are that great to resolve these issues, I do think that it is important to bring up to hopefully have Square Enix acknowledge and address it in a better and more effective way going forward in Dawntrail and beyond.

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As we near the end of the expansion, it has become apparent in almost every season of Crystalline Conflict that the queues stop popping when people feel comfortable with their ranking on the leaderboards until the last few days of a season. I don't know if this is a problem affecting other data centers, but it is very noticeable on North American servers.

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This happens on EU as well, at least on Chaos.

And I somewhat agree with point 4 (altough I have a proposal of my own that I'll detail later). If ranked isn't getting more meaningful and frequent rewards that encourage people to improve and play to win, and to keep playing during the whole season, I'm not sure what justifies its existence. I assume the idea behind the distinction between casual and ranked is that competitive players play for the sake of competition itself, but this has been proved to not be enough to keep ranked alive during the whole season. The rewards added in the form of weapons available through Commendation Crystals have proven to be insufficient too.

-THE PROBLEM-

Right now, my experiencie has been that ranked dies after about two to four weeks of each season, and after that, if you want to play the mode at all, you are forced to play in casual, where matches are incredibly unbalanced given how the matchmaking can pair total newbies against veteran, high-rank players who are either willingly or unwillingly playing on casual too, because qeues on ranked take too long or don't pop at all. And the random nature of the matchmaking averaging your defeats and your victories doesn't make it feel any better, because when you get a good team it might feel good (depending if you enjoy easy victories of if you prefer them hard-earned), but when you get a bad team... it doesn't feel bad, it feels awful, especially when you are paired with absolute newbies to the mode that die to not knowing how to use guard or even recuperate, that completely ignore the crystal and that keep engaging on 1v5s.

-PROPOSED SOLUTION-

As I see it, casual should be a place for people to learn the mode, try new jobs or just play for fun without pressures, and it should give little to no rewards both in terms of currencies and series exp.

Ranked instead should give significant unique (as in otherwise unobtainable) and abundant, both short and long term, rewards, not necessarily tied to your rank or time-gated, but that require winning games and not just participating in order to get them. One way to do this would be add new achiviements for victories or kills only obtainable in ranked mode. Also, the Commendation Crystals reward pool should be heavily expanded.

This, I think, would help to keep casual for the players who want a casual experience, instead of an easy way to get the rewards from playing pvp, and help keep ranked alive longer during the season and not just during a few weeks.

I think the issue is the ranking system itself. I'd be much happier if rewards were based on a number of wins. That way if you want to be at a 'Crystal' level, you need to keep playing to remain on the leaderboards.

I also think one of the problems with Ranked CC, is that it resets far too slowly. If they made Ranked a weekly thing, and lowered the amount of Commendation Crystals awarded, Ranked CC would be a lot more active. People rush at the start to push out of Bronze. If you take too long to get out of the early ranks, you hit a wall because no one over Platinum queues once they've achieved the rank they've wanted.

By having frequent resets, this eliminates the problem.

If the ranking resets every week it could be bad for not so good players maybe who need more matches to tier up. They wouldn't have enough time to do all the matches they need to tier up.

The Real Reason Ranked dies after 2 weeks is that many players PLAY RANKED ONLY FOR THE REWARDS. No matter how many claim otherwise. One of the Reasons Rival Wings only opens on Events.

PvP in its current form is just not fun for many Players and they stop after having a comfy Rating. I too was for a rank decay after a certain amount of time but i think it would make the situation worse since many players might just go with: "Ahh well then i wont even bother." You might end up with the same people in every match over and over or matches simply not opening for more than 3 hours a Day.

As far as i know the Devs planned yet another pvp overhaul for the next big patch after the xpac released so we should wait and see until we have more info.

Wake me up when more than the usual people add 2 and 2 together and realize incentive as motivation matters for the carbon copy of Casual Mode with multiple restrictions and hardships.

We can design the ranking and queueing system as perfect as we want, but player retention in this game usually is kept by offering a carrot on a stick for sticking around.

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Originally Posted by ValG

As I see it, casual should be a place for people to learn the mode, try new jobs or just play for fun without pressures, and it should give little to no rewards both in terms of currencies and series exp.

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You'll just kill casual altogether with that kind of changes. It may pop occasionally with enough players wanting to try out a new job at the same time, and it may actually at best turn into a hidden sweaty mode where all the top rankers congregate to try out other jobs (like they do already). Actual casual players don't queue into the mode to try new jobs, they queue to farm their series xp and/or have fun. They also do not want to deal with the stress of ranked. If you remove them the series reward, you'll essentially be sending them the message that CC isn't for them and they should queue instead exclusively for FLs which rewards similarly anyway.

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Originally Posted by Valence

You'll just kill casual altogether with that kind of changes.

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Well, if I have to choose between keeping the mode alive for the people who only care about getting easy rewards and keeping it healthy for the people who care about the mode itself... I'd rather keep ranked.

But even if casual is not touched at all, all the ranked stuff I mentioned can still be done to make it more appealing.

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Originally Posted by ValG

Well, if I have to choose between keeping the mode alive for the people who only care about getting easy rewards and keeping it healthy for the people who care about the mode itself... I'd rather keep ranked.

But even if casual is not touched at all, all the ranked stuff I mentioned can still be done to make it more appealing.

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I don't see how removing the gateway mode would keep ranked alive. Playing casual matches and thinking "Hmm, I wonder what ranked is like" is almost a universal constant in PvP regardless of game. People getting bored and leaving(the game or the mode) is inevitable, so there needs to be something to get fresh blood in.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Wake me up when more than the usual people add 2 and 2 together and realize incentive as motivation matters for the carbon copy of Casual Mode with multiple restrictions and hardships.

We can design the ranking and queueing system as perfect as we want, but player retention in this game usually is kept by offering a carrot on a stick for sticking around.

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Fair enough. Unfortunately I think the devs are done offering time exclusive rewards for Top 100; as much as that did help keep the game mode alive in the later seasons (with armor seasons being noticeably more alive than mount seasons). I wouldn't mind seeing a return of that system but with the caveat that a rise of players will come up and once again complain about how it's impossible for them to get rewards, why is cool stuff locked behind PvP, win-trading, yadayadayada.

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Originally Posted by Igono

Fair enough. Unfortunately I think the devs are done offering time exclusive rewards for Top 100; as much as that did help keep the game mode alive in the later seasons (with armor seasons being noticeably more alive than mount seasons). I wouldn't mind seeing a return of that system but with the caveat that a rise of players will come up and once again complain about how it's impossible for them to get rewards, why is cool stuff locked behind PvP, win-trading, yadayadayada.

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There are other systems that can be used. I am not a fan of the pure Top100 reward structure anyhow, as it does nothing to incentivize the lower ranks to keep playing, which is what we need to enable first. There is no fresh blood flowing into the top ranks and actively contest their spots if anything below can't form games actively, so this takes prioeity if you ask me.

Like a basic currency system exclusive to Ranked, available at any Rank, promoting active play in a season and not just placements. So basically points for winning and draws (not for losses though). Make em spendable on highly sought-after rewards, maybe a new weapon series aside from Augmented Hellhound, new Ranked gear or hell, the old Feast Rewards (you heard me right).

And if Top 100 were to be any more meaningful again i.e. like Feast Season 20 and before, I'd suggest those Top 100 rewards to cycle back into a ranked shop.

Point is, you want to reward players for playing well and you want to reward players for having to put up with hardships and harder battles, in a way only that mode can. Otherwise "what's the point" if you can farm it elsewhere.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

There are other systems that can be used. I am not a fan of the pure Top100 reward structure anyhow, as it does nothing to incentivize the lower ranks to keep playing, which is what we need to enable first. There is no fresh blood flowing into the top ranks and actively contest their spots if anything below can't form games actively, so this takes prioeity if you ask me.

Like a basic currency system exclusive to Ranked, available at any Rank, promoting active play in a season and not just placements. So basically points for winning and draws (not for losses though). Make em spendable on highly sought-after rewards, maybe a new weapon series aside from Augmented Hellhound, new Ranked gear or hell, the old Feast Rewards (you heard me right).

And if Top 100 were to be any more meaningful again i.e. like Feast Season 20 and before, I'd suggest those Top 100 rewards to cycle back into a ranked shop.

Point is, you want to reward players for playing well and you want to reward players for having to put up with hardships and harder battles, in a way only that mode can. Otherwise "what's the point" if you can farm it elsewhere.

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All super valid points. I actually agree with everything you're saying here. It also removes the feeling of FOMO a lot of players experience and get frustrated with when it comes to the old Top100 rewards structure. I would actually love to see a ranked shop cycling in all of the rewards you mentioned in the second line (including old Feast rewards).

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Originally Posted by Igono

All super valid points. I actually agree with everything you're saying here. It also removes the feeling of FOMO a lot of players experience and get frustrated with when it comes to the old Top100 rewards structure. I would actually love to see a ranked shop cycling in all of the rewards you mentioned in the second line (including old Feast rewards).

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Agreed, but personally I'd only do one small thing is that were to happen - essentially just putting something small, like a star in the item name of the original 100 itemsets or mounts per season. Nothing special that differentiates glamour, but a small keepsake for those who own an original. Hardly the end of the world, they retroactively did this with the White Ravens earring if I recall by making the newly obtained ones Replica.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Agreed, but personally I'd only do one small thing is that were to happen - essentially just putting something small, like a star in the item name of the original 100 itemsets or mounts per season. Nothing special that differentiates glamour, but a small keepsake for those who own an original. Hardly the end of the world, they retroactively did this with the White Ravens earring if I recall by making the newly obtained ones Replica.

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I think another solution would be to make it so the originals are dyeable but the new ones aren't. It doesn't completely sit right with me as a solution, but it's something that would be fairly noticeable for people that want to differentiate themselves while not completely locking people out of the glams themselves.

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Originally Posted by Igono

I think another solution would be to make it so the originals are dyeable but the new ones aren't. It doesn't completely sit right with me as a solution, but it's something that would be fairly noticeable for people that want to differentiate themselves while not completely locking people out of the glams themselves.

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I think that would be unnecessarily limiting. Part of the greatness of customization is the ability to dye things, I would not limit this from the replica sets.

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Originally Posted by ValG

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-PROPOSED SOLUTION-
Ranked instead should give significant unique (as in otherwise unobtainable) and abundant, both short and long term, rewards, not necessarily tied to your rank or time-gated, but that require winning games and not just participating in order to get them. One way to do this would be add new achiviements for victories or kills only obtainable in ranked mode. Also, the Commendation Crystals reward pool should be heavily expanded.

.

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Well... I know this is getting old, but l think Se should use Guild wars 2's approach. There is a unique reward track i gw2's arena that you have to play ranked to progress, and its reward is pretty good. So l would say that keep the current reward in casual, but add in that new ranked only series, and make it that the reward is not locked behind certain rank but you have to win to progress it. So can remove some stress factor while encourage people to get better.

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Originally Posted by Eastwall

Well... I know this is getting old, but l think Se should use Guild wars 2's approach. There is a unique reward track i gw2's arena that you have to play ranked to progress, and its reward is pretty good. So l would say that keep the current reward in casual, but add in that new ranked only series, and make it that the reward is not locked behind certain rank but you have to win to progress it. So can remove some stress factor while encourage people to get better.

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Can you elaborate a bit more on the differences between how rank is handled in terms of who can queue against as well as how the reward structures make it more appealing for the playerbase? I read the wiki on the PvP Leagues and their rewards but having a hard time translating the meaning of some of the stuff you get from chests into their FFXIV equivalencies.

Some questions I have if you know the answer:
1. How "alive" are queues throughout the days/seasons? Are their periods of extreme drought after the initial grind of a new season?
2. What is unique about the ranked rewards compared to the normal casual rewards? Is it cosmetics? Gil? Minions/Mounts? etc etc
3. Using the ranked reward structure from GW2 as a baseline, what would the ranked reward structure for FFXIV look like?

Rank system itself is a total mess and needs a do over. While I have a ton to say about it I'll point out the biggest pet peeve here: the star system. If you want the playerbase at platinum there should absolutely be no reason why everyone is taking any penalties for losing below platinum. It's a waste of time. Adding rewards to this system isn't going to fix the issue with keeping rank alive. Start there, and maybe some other things will fall in place.

As for trying to get rid of casual mode refer to Valence's post:

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Originally Posted by Valence

You'll just kill casual altogether with that kind of changes. It may pop occasionally with enough players wanting to try out a new job at the same time, and it may actually at best turn into a hidden sweaty mode where all the top rankers congregate to try out other jobs (like they do already). Actual casual players don't queue into the mode to try new jobs, they queue to farm their series xp and/or have fun. They also do not want to deal with the stress of ranked. If you remove them the series reward, you'll essentially be sending them the message that CC isn't for them and they should queue instead exclusively for FLs which rewards similarly anyway.

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Regardless, hope they are able to do regional DF someday. Not only would it mean a bigger matchmaking pool, but think it sounds more exciting to have a top 100 or whatever of NA, top 100 of EU, etc.