WHM healing question: Use Cure II over Cure?

I'm running my first healer in dungeons, and at 50 & below in leveling roulettes, I use Cure 80% of the time (400 MP), and Cure II (1000 MP) for emergency heals when someone gets too low.

I've had two players suggest in these runs that I forget about Cure, and just use Cure II. I tried this once, and ran out of MP in no time. Is there some MP magic other than Lucid Dreaming that will let me use Cure II all the time?

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

I'm running my first healer in dungeons, and at 50 in leveling roulettes, I use Cure 80% of the time (400 MP), and Cure II (1000 MP) for emergency heals when someone gets too low.

I've had two players suggest in these runs that I forget about Cure, and just use Cure II. I tried this once, and ran out of MP in no time. Is there some MP magic (other than Lucid Dreaming that will let me use Cure II all the time?

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you're probably overhealing. use Lucid Dream on cooldown and you'll be fine using Cure 2 because it takes the same amount of time as Cure, but heals significantly more.

Even when MP management is an issue (but seriously: Lucid more) - any time you could cast a Cure and get value out of it, you could have cast Regen instead for the same mana and same GCD, but received three times the potency spread across 18s. This isn't really a downside, because Cure is never going to be enough to avert an emergency at that level anyway - if Regen can't handle it, Cure won't either. If you get full effect from it, it's more effective than Cure *and* Freecure Cure II combined, and it saves an extra GCD.

Once you get Cure II, Cure genuinely is dead to you outside of the situations where you get synced below 30.

For most content outside of savage you wont really use either. Use Regen and then the rest of your healing should come from your abilities like the bubble, tetra, assize, and beni. If you need to GCD heal you get liliesaround 50ish.

In a pinch use Cure2 and Medica 2. You don't really use Cure 1 anymore. If everyone is stacked you can swap a Medica 2 for Cure3. Always remember that Regen is your biggest GCD heal. As a WHM you will spend most of your time spamming DPS and not actually healing with GCD heals. If you have to GCD heal often then something is going wrong.

It depends on what content you're running at level 50.
Doing a MINE run of Coils will require Cure usage.

WoD, depending on the group, you should be fine with Cure 2

Dungeons and the like, Regen is your bread and butter heal with Cure 2 as backup, assuming Holy isn't available.

Cure gets instantly replaced as soon as you unlock Cure II, you should never be using it over Regen + Cure II.

Use Cure II when the tank is actually below 30% HP lol, at lv30 it heals for like 50% of their HP without crit.

Don't forget to make or buy a few hundred HQ super ethers too, if you weren't carrying a pile around already.

“All the time”? If you spam Cure II after Cure II every GCD, not even Lucid can prevent you from running dry of mana quickly, even moreso on lower level. None of the healers are built to be casting healing spells ‘all the time’ without possibility of running dry of MP very quickly.

My advice is to get a good feel how much a single cast of Cure II heals, then only cast it on your tank when you know it will very likely get the most mileage on each cast. Nothing pains me when I que in as a tank and see a WHM tries ever so frantically keeping me at 100% HP while about half of all those cure potencies went to waste as overheals.

When a cast of Cure II will overheal, it’s safe to at least throw out your Aero DoT or fling your Stones in the meantime. Additionally like Sindele mentioned, if you can access Regen, toss it on your tank. It allows you more time to throw out dps spells to help culling mobs until you either need to toss Cure II or refresh the Regen. It’s a really good tool to have at pre lv50.

Also, Lucid Dreaming is more of a maintenance tool. Yes, it recovers you a total of 3,850 MP but it does so gradually in the span of 21 seconds. Another commonly made mistakes by inexperienced healers is to press it only when they’re critically low of mana. In a situation where you’ll be casting something constantly, popping it when your MP drops to 7k range is always a good idea to let you stay above the fray.

One of the first things I like to tell new healers is to go into a dungeon and over the course of that dungeon look closely and get a feel for how much each of your healing skills does on a tank and learn to connect that amount healed with when you should casting the spell

For example if cure 2 heals the tank for 70% of their health bar in general there is really no reason to start casting cure 2 till the tank hits 40% health, there is flexibility here based on how quickly the tank is dropping but in general it’s a good rule of thumb that is especially useful if you pick up a shield healer that has permanent passive regen

But yeah at your level in general you want to open with regen, only cast cure 2 when the tank is about 10% above how much you know cure 2 heals for and use lucid dreaming on cool-down (don’t hold it), as you get more skills you’ll come to realise how much each one heals and how much each slow the tanks HP dropping and can mix and match sets of those skills as you become more familiar with them

Meh. Cure 1 is for when you want the tank to die but need to make sure they can't say you didn't heal them... :P lol

If you regen a dps and they die from eating the stupid it's there fault not yours.

Healing in this game is vastly different in others. I've healed in WoW and others before where I yo-yo the tanks health almost constantly.

Here however you can actually get by with a ludicrously low amount of healing. If the tank uses their mitigations and the like you can pretty much just nearly DPSing the entire time while weaving in a oGCD. Pre 50 you do have to watch a tad because both you and the tank don't have their full kits but 50+ you are basically Green DPS.

Once you get to the level where you have Regen, you'll use that instead of either Cures. Cure II if someone gets to like 30 or 40% in a PUG, lower if you're with friends you know better. Also Asylum and Assize as needed.

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

I'm running my first healer in dungeons, and at 50 & below in leveling roulettes, I use Cure 80% of the time (400 MP), and Cure II (1000 MP) for emergency heals when someone gets too low.

I've had two players suggest in these runs that I forget about Cure, and just use Cure II. I tried this once, and ran out of MP in no time. Is there some MP magic other than Lucid Dreaming that will let me use Cure II all the time?

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The right answer is you use neither and spam holy cause stunned enemies that can't deal damage are literally also healing!

Jokes aside kick Cure from your list, you don't need that. If you have to spam cure your tank has a malfunction and doesn't know how to mitigate, in that case call your tanks manufacturer and order an replacement.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

The right answer is you use neither and spam holy cause stunned enemies that can't deal damage are literally also healing!

Jokes aside kick Cure from your list, you don't need that. If you have to spam cure your tank has a malfunction and doesn't know how to mitigate, in that case call your tanks manufacturer and order an replacement.

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Um...I lost my receipt.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Um...I lost my receipt.

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if you go back to the dealer I am sure they have the warranty records

in all seriousness... I am always pleasantly surprised if the tank actually knows they have mitigations and *le gasp* uses them....

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Healing in this game is vastly different in others. I've healed in WoW and others before where I yo-yo the tanks health almost constantly.

Here however you can actually get by with a ludicrously low amount of healing. If the tank uses their mitigations and the like you can pretty much just nearly DPSing the entire time while weaving in a oGCD. Pre 50 you do have to watch a tad because both you and the tank don't have their full kits but 50+ you are basically Green DPS.

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Also don't forget it also requires said tank to have appropriate gear. Though that seems to only come up in leveling duties. Most often the ones at the halfway point to that expansion's level cap. If they're wearing paper armor and using something like an accessory to barely meet the requirements they're going to 100% to dead on 1 pack of mobs faster than your cast bar will fill.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Also don't forget it also requires said tank to have appropriate gear. Though that seems to only come up in leveling duties. Most often the ones at the halfway point to that expansion's level cap. If they're wearing paper armor and using something like an accessory to barely meet the requirements they're going to 100% to dead on 1 pack of mobs faster than your cast bar will fill.

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or they havent bothered to repair it for... reasons...

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

I'm running my first healer in dungeons, and at 50 & below in leveling roulettes, I use Cure 80% of the time (400 MP), and Cure II (1000 MP) for emergency heals when someone gets too low.

I've had two players suggest in these runs that I forget about Cure, and just use Cure II. I tried this once, and ran out of MP in no time. Is there some MP magic other than Lucid Dreaming that will let me use Cure II all the time?

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Regen on the tank

Cure 2 Single Target

Medica 2 AOE

Benediction for emergencies on the tank

Lucid Dreaming at ~8k MP

If the tank is still dying, they need to learn to play.

Remember guys we all know sylphies by choice are annoying as hell but this guy is legit trying to learn and the idea of choosing your heals based on your inherent knowledge of around how much they will heal/how much they slow the tank dropping is not something you know immediately or even something that you know to look out for in an attempt to learn how to do it

Sylphies spamming cure 1 in aetherfont are a joke but responding to every healer advice thread with “cure 1 is useless” doesn’t help anyone, come on even us constantly online jaded healer vets you are sick of brigading every thread with know that

I’m gonna put a disclaimer here, I don’t mean I think cure 1 is useful, cure 1 is useless, I mean if someone is saying “should I use cure 1 or 2 and help me understand why” responding with “cure 1 is useless” and nothing else isn’t helping them

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Remember guys we all know sylphies by choice are annoying as hell but this guy is legit trying to learn and the idea of choosing your heals based on your inherent knowledge of around how much they will heal/how much they slow the tank dropping is not something you know immediately or even something that you know to look out for in an attempt to learn how to do it

Sylphies spamming cure 1 in aetherfont are a joke but responding to every healer advice thread with “cure 1 is useless” doesn’t help anyone, come on even us constantly online jaded healer vets you are sick of brigading every thread with know that

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But it's kinda true. The amount a non crit cure 1 heals is roughly the same amount if not more damage taken by the time the GCD can be used again. At best you are draining your MP to keep them exactly as they are and doing no DPS.

I rather Cure 2 once every 15 seconds than heal bot and spam cure 1 the very second the GCD is ready.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

Regen on the tank

Cure 2 Single Target

Medica 2 AOE

Benediction for emergencies on the tank

Lucid Dreaming at ~8k MP

If the tank is still dying, they need to learn to play.

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You should quite literally never save Benediction for emergencies in leveling dungeons

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Originally Posted by Renalt

But it's kinda true. The amount a non crit cure 1 heals is roughly the same amount if not more damage taken by the time the GCD can be used again. At best you are draining your MP to keep them exactly as they are and doing no DPS.

I rather Cure 2 once every 15 seconds than heal bot and spam cure 1 the very second the GCD is ready.

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I just give them the disclaimer beforehand that I don't actually have a medical license and am not a real healer. My profession is Necromancer/Undertaker... >.>

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Remember guys we all know sylphies by choice are annoying as hell but this guy is legit trying to learn and the idea of choosing your heals based on your inherent knowledge of around how much they will heal/how much they slow the tank dropping is not something you know immediately or even something that you know to look out for in an attempt to learn how to do it

Sylphies spamming cure 1 in aetherfont are a joke but responding to every healer advice thread with “cure 1 is useless” doesn’t help anyone, come on even us constantly online jaded healer vets you are sick of brigading every thread with know that

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Nah, cure 1 is useless, remove it from your bar when you get cure 2

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Originally Posted by Renalt

But it's kinda true. The amount a non crit cure 1 heals is roughly the same amount if not more damage taken by the time the GCD can be used again. At best you are draining your MP to keep them exactly as they are and doing no DPS.

I rather Cure 2 once every 15 seconds than heal bot and spam cure 1 the very second the GCD is ready.

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It’s not that it isn’t true, it’s that saying “don’t use cure 1” and then ending the comment there isn’t really helpful to someone who doesn’t understand why you shouldn’t be using cure 1 and wants it explained to them

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Originally Posted by Ivtrix

Nah, cure 1 is useless, remove it from your bar when you get cure 2

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Refer to above

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

It’s not that it isn’t true, it’s that saying “don’t use cure 1” and then ending the comment there isn’t really helpful to someone who doesn’t understand why you shouldn’t be using cure 1 and wants it explained to them

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Here: Cure II is 800 heal potency per GCD and Cure is 500, and Cure II is 0.8 heal potency per MP and Cure I is 1.25.

That means if MP isn't an issue, using Cure II is more optimal since it heals for more per GCD. This is the case most of the time.

The edge cases where Cure I is useful is when MP is an issue, e.g. right after resurrection. If you don't have an instant-cast for whatever reason and just need to top someone off for a raidwide, Cure I is also actually often more useful than Cure II. This happens when you die and lose all your lilies but need to get a DPS topped off before a raidwide so that they survive it. The reason is because they only need a few hundred potencies worth of heal to survive the raidwide, and any extra is wasted (because you have group heals to top everyone off from 1% hp afterwards for example).

When triaging, Cure I can be useful, for example if you just got raised and need to raise your cohealer while making sure the tank doesn't die, and don't have Thin Air for whatever reason. 2400 + 400 MP is plausible but 2400 + 1000 is absolutely not. On other healers, particularly sage and scholar, this is even more important since they don't have Thin Air.

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Originally Posted by Ivtrix

Nah, cure 1 is useless, remove it from your bar when you get cure 2

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Or don't remove it from your bar. I saw somebody take that advice once, and then they loaded into a pre-Cure 2 dungeon and have nothing to heal with without fumbling about with their bars.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

I just give them the disclaimer beforehand that I don't actually have a medical license and am not a real healer. My profession is Necromancer/Undertaker... >.>

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This is why we can be friends.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

It’s not that it isn’t true, it’s that saying “don’t use cure 1” and then ending the comment there isn’t really helpful to someone who doesn’t understand why you shouldn’t be using cure 1 and wants it explained to them



Refer to above

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Ok now that makes sense. I agree. If someone is gonna take a stance they do need to explain their reasoning. There is a reason teachers ask you to "Show your work".

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Originally Posted by Koros

Here: Cure II is 800 heal potency per GCD and Cure is 500, and Cure II is 0.8 heal potency per MP and Cure I is 1.25.

That means if MP isn't an issue, using Cure II is more optimal since it heals for more per GCD. This is the case most of the time.

The edge cases where Cure I is useful is when MP is an issue, e.g. right after resurrection. If you don't have an instant-cast for whatever reason and just need to top someone off for a raidwide, Cure I is also actually often more useful than Cure II. This happens when you die and lose all your lilies but need to get a DPS topped off before a raidwide so that they survive it. The reason is because they only need a few hundred potencies worth of heal to survive the raidwide, and any extra is wasted (because you have group heals to top everyone off from 1% hp afterwards for example).

When triaging, Cure I can be useful, for example if you just got raised and need to raise your cohealer while making sure the tank doesn't die, and don't have Thin Air for whatever reason. 2400 + 400 MP is plausible but 2400 + 1000 is absolutely not. On other healers, particularly sage and scholar, this is even more important since they don't have Thin Air.

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Perfect I like that explanation, it actually provides useful info to the person asking

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Originally Posted by Koros

Here: Cure II is 800 heal potency per GCD and Cure is 500, and Cure II is 0.8 heal potency per MP and Cure I is 1.25.

That means if MP isn't an issue, using Cure II is more optimal since it heals for more per GCD. This is the case most of the time.

The edge cases where Cure I is useful is when MP is an issue, e.g. right after resurrection. If you don't have an instant-cast for whatever reason and just need to top someone off for a raidwide, Cure I is also actually often more useful than Cure II. This happens when you die and lose all your lilies but need to get a DPS topped off before a raidwide so that they survive it. The reason is because they only need a few hundred potencies worth of heal to survive the raidwide, and any extra is wasted (because you have group heals to top everyone off from 1% hp afterwards for example).

When triaging, Cure I can be useful, for example if you just got raised and need to raise your cohealer while making sure the tank doesn't die, and don't have Thin Air for whatever reason. 2400 + 400 MP is plausible but 2400 + 1000 is absolutely not. On other healers, particularly sage and scholar, this is even more important since they don't have Thin Air.

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Adding to this with less newbie-friendly metaknowledge....

FFXIV has a combat system where your most valuable resource is time. Unless you're spamming expensive heals back to back (and if you need to do this, your party is actively running into the fire), your MP shouldn't be an issue after you get a few MP management tools. It also recovers pretty quickly outside combat. Cooldown timers also aren't usually a huge thing. Most of the healers have strong, free (or at least cheap) heals on cooldowns that let you use them nearly as often as unavoidable damage comes out.

I could go on, but the point is that FFXIV's combat is designed to diminish the importance of resources other than time. When time is your most valuable resource, the thing you're looking to minimize on healing is time spent. MP quickly becomes irrelevant. Cure 2 is head and shoulders better than Cure 1 because it 1. accomplishes the exact same goal, and 2. wastes less time doing so.

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Originally Posted by PirateRyanG

Or don't remove it from your bar. I saw somebody take that advice once, and then they loaded into a pre-Cure 2 dungeon and have nothing to heal with without fumbling about with their bars.

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This is where I wish we had bar setups that could be keyed to level and job. As healer, I want my party list just to the right of center where I can see and reach it easily, but as DPS, it just gets in the way there, so I move it off to the upper left.
This made for some frantic swapping when I queue as heals and realize it's in the wrong spot.
Solution: I saved the healer layout to slot 2, and put a hudlayout 2 macro on a bar for an instant switch when this happens.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Also don't forget it also requires said tank to have appropriate gear. Though that seems to only come up in leveling duties. Most often the ones at the halfway point to that expansion's level cap. If they're wearing paper armor and using something like an accessory to barely meet the requirements they're going to 100% to dead on 1 pack of mobs faster than your cast bar will fill.

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I had a run a few days ago with a super squishy tank, I constantly had to spam Cure II's on him, and he still died several times (On a level 50 run) I didn't even have time to look at his gear. I gave up on healing groups for a few days after that.

There's a certain segment of players that are pretty die-hard about never using Cure and only using Cure 2. If you're on the cutting edge doing Extremes and Savages where you'd really like to min-max your DPS, maybe they're worth listening to.

But in all other content, do what you want. In my experience, the leading cause of White Mages with mana problems is overuse of Cure 2; the runner-up is not casting Regen. For the times when Regen alone isn't cutting it, Cure is great, as it's rate of healing-per-MP is more efficient than Cure 2. If you need to do a bigger heal in time crunch, then Cure 2 is great.

But all of that is just my subjective advice. Don't let others tell you how to play. If you kept your party up, then you're doing a great job, and the rest is icing.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

There's a certain segment of players that are pretty die-hard about never using Cure and only using Cure 2. If you're on the cutting edge doing Extremes and Savages where you'd really like to min-max your DPS, maybe they're worth listening to.

But in all other content, do what you want. In my experience, the leading cause of White Mages with mana problems is overuse of Cure 2; the runner-up is not casting Regen. For the times when Regen alone isn't cutting it, Cure is great, as it's rate of healing-per-MP is more efficient than Cure 2. If you need to do a bigger heal in time crunch, then Cure 2 is great.

But all of that is just my subjective advice. Don't let others tell you how to play. If you kept your party up, then you're doing a great job, and the rest is icing.

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The biggest cause of mana issues on WHM is spamming GCD heals rather than using your wealth of oGCD’s and lilies while doing damage so the encounter is 20% shorter so you don’t have to heal as long

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

The biggest cause of mana issues on WHM is spamming GCD heals rather than using your wealth of oGCD’s and lilies while doing damage so the encounter is 20% shorter so you don’t have to heal as long

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I probably should have mentioned that I only ever see WHM mana issues in ARR content, before WHM's have the tools you're talking about. So that's the context in which I was offering advice in.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

The right answer is you use neither and spam holy cause stunned enemies that can't deal damage are literally also healing!

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It works only if the mobs die fast enough. Because they will become immune to your stuns when you stun them too often with holy.


Cheers