CC needs SERIOUS changes

1 - MAX 1 healer & 1 tank per group
2 - One shot kill abilities need to be removed (ninja LB, sam LB, etc)
3 - Pick up potions should be removed from the map
4 - Remove time limit for claiming end of season rewards

1 - Why? Roles are agnostic. Neither tanks or healers are actually tanks or healers and PLD is the only one that is actually "tanky."
2 - The UI tells you if someone has LB or not. Bait the NIN and keep your HP above 50%. Its not difficult to make them waste it. SAM is literally as simple as marking them with the do not attack marker and then just ignoring them or stunning them and kill them.
3 - Why?
4 - Why?

I agree with adjusting the instant kill abilities since they all feel really bad to use/go up against. I don't know what you are referring to exactly with #4 though, since I don't know if you mean series battle pass or ranked rewards, but I think. The other two issues are not issues at all since being a tank/healer has no direct advantage and map spawn potions are perfectly fine.

Not getting killed by SAM LB is so easy though... how do so many on the forums have problems with it?

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Originally Posted by Ransu

1 - Why? Roles are agnostic. Neither tanks or healers are actually tanks or healers and PLD is the only one that is actually "tanky."
2 - The UI tells you if someone has LB or not. Bait the NIN and keep your HP above 50%. Its not difficult to make them waste it. SAM is literally as simple as marking them with the do not attack marker and then just ignoring them or stunning them and kill them.
3 - Why?
4 - Why?

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1- For better balance in a match
2- What does ui have to do with what I said, I never said it was a ui issue, also if your suggestion is "just ignore them" then LOL
3- There is already enough healing
4- why? why tf not? lol imagine having an issue with #4

#4 is just receiving previous season rewards if you didn't collect them before the new season started

what everybody reads:

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Originally Posted by Ransu

1 - Why? Roles are agnostic. Neither tanks or healers are actually tanks or healers and PLD is the only one that is actually "tanky."
2 - The UI tells you if someone has LB or not. Bait the NIN and keep your HP above 50%. Its not difficult to make them waste it. SAM is literally as simple as marking them with the do not attack marker and then just ignoring them or stunning them and kill them.
3 - Why?
4 - Why?

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what I read :
1 - I'm better than you ( blablablabalbalablabal, I posted 3000 time on this forum)
2 - I'm better than you ( Blbalbalablabalbalabla, I posted 3000 time on this forum)
3 - I'm better than you (blablablabalbalbalabla, I posted 3000 time on this forum)
4 - I'm better than you (balbalbalabalbalbala, I posted 3000 time on this forum)

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Originally Posted by Josebm

#4 is just receiving previous season rewards if you didn't collect them before the new season started

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New seasons generally start as soon as previous ones end. At what point would you like people to collect their tier rewards if not given even a millisecond to do so?

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Originally Posted by Canadane

New seasons generally start as soon as previous ones end. At what point would you like people to collect their tier rewards if not given even a millisecond to do so?

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i think they want the FOMO nonsense to end.

I find it unlikely CC matches will be balanced any time soon, the whole removal of the class limit was actually a stated feature to differentiate it from Feast. Queue time wise it also helps as forcing role restrictions was a major reason why queues would struggle to amount to anything outside of the briefest period of Feast Seasons starting up, Crystalline Conflict avoids that problem... somewhat.

Execution abilities in general are indeed a bad match for FF14, the server response is often too slow, and for some cases the threshold is far too lenient versus the work that defeating opponents would otherwise take. Health loss is childishly easy in the current PvP game mode, crowd control effects even easier, and with so many snapshots to worry about it's easy to see why people get so frustrated when forced to deal with classes that have Executes in their kit. Ironically MCH probably receives the least amount of flak these days despite technically qualifying, as it's more down to RNG and no longer outright kills someone, just mostly.

Have no real issue with the other two details, potions are a tactical option and don't detract from gameplay, though I do wish that standing on them for three seconds while injured would actually result in a pickup reliably... they did say they increased the range. :X

As for rewards, again, that's just icing on the cake. They are also available for a long time, though wouldn't be opposed to it being available for purchase at a later time, heavens' know the currency just goes to waste most of the time.

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Originally Posted by BRVV

Not getting killed by SAM LB is so easy though... how do so many on the forums have problems with it?

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Server tick rate often is an issue in regards to this, though that works both ways, as people playing SAM often times find their Chiten ends up being useless too. So it's basically more lenient are mechanic for some people versus others as you can end up trapped into hitting enemies despite trying to avoid it. This is even more pronounced for ranged classes like Dancer or BLM or who typically can't help it even if aware.

Of course it could also be people just not paying attention too, but 7/10 times it's a case of the system taking too long to provide feedback and allowing reaction, and again, it goes both ways as some SAM players suffer extra hard to achieve the same results, typically debuffs wear off while the LB is casting for such folks.

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Originally Posted by maximesan514

what everybody reads:



what I read :
1 - I'm better than you ( blablablabalbalablabal, I posted 3000 time on this forum)
2 - I'm better than you ( Blbalbalablabalbalabla, I posted 3000 time on this forum)
3 - I'm better than you (blablablabalbalbalabla, I posted 3000 time on this forum)
4 - I'm better than you (balbalbalabalbalbala, I posted 3000 time on this forum)

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Has "playing the game since 2014 and simply being an active forum member" become some sort of crime for you?

You can disagree with their opinion, that is your full right - but what you're doing is just being childish.

1.) There are more problems in the match making than just role stacking though I wouldn't mind them testing this a bit better since a full dps team winning seems to be the outlier result in such matches.

2.) The NIN LB is in fact a bit too much, but they don't seem to understand what about it needs adjusting. SAM isn't really an issue in CC because at most you only have to deal with one at a time and you can see their limit gauge. You can even make it bigger and reposition it if you aren't noticing when it's full. MCH LB is only ever a one shot if you play sloppy or people dedicate damage to you. Chainsaw is so rare it's kind of a meme to say it's a problem.

3.) Potions represent a fun and depending on the lobby important part of gameplay.

4.) Personally, I don't get why they don't just spawn the rewards in your inventory upon the first log in post season.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Has "playing the game since 2014 and simply being an active forum member" become some sort of crime for you?

You can disagree with their opinion, that is your full right - but what you're doing is just being childish.

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i personally cant blame him though, people are tired of em.

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Originally Posted by BRVV

Not getting killed by SAM LB is so easy though... how do so many on the forums have problems with it?

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My issue has more to do with it feeling really bad to use, since the design of it just feels really bad to use. The game registration and server ticks don't help it feel any better either.

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Originally Posted by Josebm

#4 is just receiving previous season rewards if you didn't collect them before the new season started

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That makes sense. I don't see particular harm in having protection like this at all. If they could it would be cool for them to remove FOMO, even if it's for something that small.

Edit: Would be simpler if they just mailed you the seasonal rewards like they did with Firmament stuff to prevent this issue, but I don't know why they don't

So basically you want the feast again? Where basically the match will go to whomever took out the other teams healer first? No thanks. Now CC has some issues but I still like it much better than the feast especially as a healer player.

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Originally Posted by SweetPete

So basically you want the feast again? Where basically the match will go to whomever took out the other teams healer first? No thanks. Now CC has some issues but I still like it much better than the feast especially as a healer player.

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Focusing healer constantly was probably the worst idea that you could do in Feast. You only really went for them if they were badly out of position or that you needed 2 kills to win.

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Originally Posted by Elfidan

4.) Personally, I don't get why they don't just spawn the rewards in your inventory upon the first log in post season.

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To prevent you from missing them if you don't have enough inventory space. Why we need to use an item to unlock a profile background is beyond me. Just unlock the background SE.

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

i personally cant blame him though, people are tired of em.

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I'm also tired of dealing with some people in forums, but I prioritise etiquette and try to look at the response here-and-now rather than the past. Ransu said a lot of things I probably disagreed with, but he also said things that were perfectly reasonable, so I don't discriminate for the former.

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Originally Posted by BRVV

To prevent you from missing them if you don't have enough inventory space. Why we need to use an item to unlock a profile background is beyond me. Just unlock the background SE.

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People and their inventory woes. I'm not even going near that can of worms.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

PLD is the only one that is actually "tanky."

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I agree with everything you said, except this

Also isn't there a positional/distance trick to SAM LB to survive? I've seen in a few matches where someone triggered the LB but was left with a sliver of hp

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Originally Posted by Josebm

1- For better balance in a match
2- What does ui have to do with what I said, I never said it was a ui issue, also if your suggestion is "just ignore them" then LOL
3- There is already enough healing
4- why? why tf not? lol imagine having an issue with #4

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1.) You're never going to have perfect balance, but limiting roles in a mode that is now role agnostic isn't going to make things better. If you all actually cared about better balance you'd be playing ranked instead of casual mode. Ranked mode isn't perfect, but with the ranked tiers at least you have "some" form of matchmaking.

2.) It has everything to do with it. It alerts you to who has an LB so that you know to look out for it. NIN LB is easy to deal with as long as you keep your HP above 50%. If a NIN is firing off multiple KO's with their LB then you were in a losing fight anyways. The outcome would have been the same. SAM LB is literally just watchout for the chiten animation and stun him or ignore him and then kill him after chiten wears off. Some jobs can also avoid the OHKO with barriers/shields and everyone can avoid it by just being out of range of it. Yes it sucks when a AoE clips it and I absolutely agree that AoE's should not trigger the debuff on chiten, but SAM LB overall really isn't that hard to deal with, which is why you rarely saw SAM's in crystal rank because most crystal players could avoid it easily.

3.) Healing points are part of map control. Also, TTK is really fast, so I don't understand how you feel there is enough healing already.

4.) You have months to claim those rewards... That's on you.

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Originally Posted by RyanCousland

I agree with everything you said, except this

Also isn't there a positional/distance trick to SAM LB to survive? I've seen in a few matches where someone triggered the LB but was left with a sliver of hp

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GNB is reliant on junction and they can be sorta tanky with the tank junction and pretty decent survivability with the healer junction, but their design is completely RNG at this point.

DRK is pretty squshiy outside of their LB

WAR is incredibly squishy and easy to kill.

PLD is the only one that really has a consistent skill set that feels like a tank.

The tanks don't feel like tanks in pvp, which they are obviously not supposed to since the mode is supposed to be role agnostic, which is a good design overall imo. Its way better than how it was with the strict queue system with the feast that required 1 tank, 1 healer, 1 melee and 1 ranged.

Yes, if you are far enough away and have a shield/barrier of some kind up you can survive the OHKO from SAM.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I'm also tired of dealing with some people in forums, but I prioritise etiquette and try to look at the response here-and-now rather than the past. Ransu said a lot of things I probably disagreed with, but he also said things that were perfectly reasonable, so I don't discriminate for the former.

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no you don't, you come off as SUPER passive aggressive sometimes lol

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

no you don't, you come off as SUPER passive aggressive sometimes lol

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And yet I try my best to not outright dismiss anyone's comment because of things I dislike about them.

You should know, because regardless of how hard I disagree with you, I don't dismiss what you say for something like "you're always negative, why should I listen to you" but rather give reason why I disagree with you.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

And yet I try my best to not outright dismiss anyone's comment because of things I dislike about them.

You should know, because regardless of how hard I disagree with you, I don't dismiss what you say for something like "you're always negative, why should I listen to you" but rather give reason why I disagree with you.

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it aint my fault that the game has mostly negative things going on in regards to pvp, maybe if they fixed it CORRECTLY id be more positive about it.

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

it aint my fault that the game has mostly negative things going on in regards to pvp, maybe if they fixed it CORRECTLY id be more positive about it.

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Well, what is correct in your view might be what would be awful for someone else and vice versa. Some things definitely need to be objectively worked on, but opinions may differ in the how.

For all we know, they will change it in a way you or I might hate even more, but another group will be happier about it. So finding a middle solution is a real challenge.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Well, what is correct in your view might be what would be awful for someone else and vice versa. Some things definitely need to be objectively worked on, but opinions may differ in the how.

For all we know, they will change it in a way you or I might hate even more, but another group will be happier about it. So finding a middle solution is a real challenge.

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well, im pretty sure its not that hard to fix stuff to where everybody can be happy or find the middle ground at the very least... the real question is 'Will they?' and honestly im having a hard time being positive about it.

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

well, im pretty sure its not that hard to fix stuff to where everybody can be happy or find the middle ground at the very least... the real question is 'Will they?' and honestly im having a hard time being positive about it.

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Time will tell. For now all we can do respectively is advocate for what we find important and be vocal about it.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Time will tell. For now all we can do respectively is advocate for what we find important and be vocal about it.

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Yeah for example, all modes need to have CC's damage resistances since TTK is fast and it does not take an hour to kill one melee tank/dps

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

Yeah for example, all modes need to have CC's damage resistances since TTK is fast and it does not take an hour to kill one melee tank/dps

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I think you mean CC's lack of damage resist, tbh I got no real input on largescale PvP. Maybe completely removing it might be overkill but lowering/baselining it to be closer to what ranged have might be healthier overall.

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

it aint my fault that the game has mostly negative things going on in regards to pvp, maybe if they fixed it CORRECTLY id be more positive about it.

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No pvp in any game will ever be perfect. Your problem is you refuse to adapt to anything.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I think you mean CC's lack of damage resist, tbh I got no real input on largescale PvP. Maybe completely removing it might be overkill but lowering/baselining it to be closer to what ranged have might be healthier overall.

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You know what i meant, also having it down to where ranged dps are would also work.. pretty sure thats how it is in rival wings iirc

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Originally Posted by Towa-Musa

You know what i meant, also having it down to where ranged dps are would also work.. pretty sure thats how it is in rival wings iirc

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Dw I know what you meant. RW apparently has half the resist of Frontline (tank-melee 30%, ranged-healer 15%). Sounds more reasonable given RW's split-off nature for parties to handle multiple objectives.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Dw I know what you meant. RW apparently has half the resist of Frontline (tank-melee 30%, ranged-healer 15%). Sounds more reasonable given RW's split-off nature for parties to handle multiple objectives.

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RW should replace FL, hot take i know but i played RW for a bit and i had SO much more fun then FL or CC combined.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

1.)PLD is the only one that really has a consistent skill set that feels like a tank.

The tanks don't feel like tanks in pvp, which they are obviously not supposed to since the mode is supposed to be role agnostic, which is a good design overall imo. Its way better than how it was with the strict queue system with the feast that required 1 tank, 1 healer, 1 melee and 1 range.

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I mean I think most are aware that everything is pretty much a psudeo role so that's why I disagree when we're still using the term tanky/tank

I can't really talk about WAR but as far as GNB goes its still pretty good regardless of RNG
DRK is just "squishy" because of the drawback of using its own hp granted I'm more of a casual drk and gnb but PLD is the one class I can say that doesn't meet the standards of a "tank" as do neither of the others
If PLD healing was percentaged based and wasn't reliant on its damage or if it had HC I'd agree but that's not the case also HS doesn't really do much considering there are some classes that are equalizer with one WS (e.g whm blood lilly) , 1v1 sure pld can survive but outside of that it won't last more than 1 min in a 2v1
But this kinda applies to others as well unfortunately it's just a caddy or a glorified linebacker I prefer to think of it as the latter

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Originally Posted by Nanne

Focusing healer constantly was probably the worst idea that you could do in Feast. You only really went for them if they were badly out of position or that you needed 2 kills to win.

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That’s not how I remember it lol. The feast was a joke. Every-time I played healer I was a target and they didn’t stop until I was dead or my break took down their healer first. From my experience that’s what I went through. Healers were the saviours of your team.

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Originally Posted by BRVV

Not getting killed by SAM LB is so easy though... how do so many on the forums have problems with it?

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One answer: unfortunate AoE bleedover.

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Originally Posted by SweetPete

That’s not how I remember it lol. The feast was a joke. Every-time I played healer I was a target and they didn’t stop until I was dead or my break took down their healer first. From my experience that’s what I went through. Healers were the saviours of your team.

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This depended on your skill tier. In Diamond it was common practice to go after melee or ranged first to bleed out defensives and to release pressure early with kills.

Lower skill tiers like Gold were quite Healer centric though.

Yeah Diam in Feast was rarely targeting healers first because of their insane ability to survive almost anything (they were the only ones to have access to Purify). They required a lot more pressure to take down and they never ran out of sight of themselves to self heal.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

1 - Why? Roles are agnostic. Neither tanks or healers are actually tanks or healers and PLD is the only one that is actually "tanky."
2 - The UI tells you if someone has LB or not. Bait the NIN and keep your HP above 50%. Its not difficult to make them waste it. SAM is literally as simple as marking them with the do not attack marker and then just ignoring them or stunning them and kill them.
3 - Why?
4 - Why?

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1 - When you have a dps that outheals a healer or a dps that frontlines better than a tank in Crystal+ matches, you can say this. Otherwise this is just ignorant. That was the goal they went for but horribly failed for the most part.
2 - Say that when they have a bard strip, whm strip, meikyo etc., pld cover, sage lb in the background ready to counter something that basic.
3 - Extra map cheese without a real reason for being in the game to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

DRK is pretty squshiy outside of their LB

PLD is the only one that really has a consistent skill set that feels like a tank.

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I'd argue against that.

PLD - 12K Shield every 20s || 15% MIT for 10s every 20s || 6K Healing (flat) (over 3 GCD's) Confiteor every 20s || Every 4 GCD's = 4000 Atonement Heal (flat) || Stun/Dash Atonement buffing
DRK - 8K Shield every 15s || 20% MIT for 10s w/ 6K healing every 30s || 8-32K+ (scales) Quietus instant healing every 15s || Every 3 GCD's = 5000+ Soulstealer Heal (scales) || health/mana restoration on kill

If you're talking controlled burst engagements, especially in chokepoints for AoE, DRK blows out PLD from Quietus scaling alone. The PLD is also blowing Guard for covers and not necessarily when they're frontlining. And if they use Guard to frontline/escape like a normal tank, their covers get them killed a lot of times or they burn all their mana and have to pot. PLD LB has a longer charge time and doesn't personally heal the PLD while a DRK can LB at the last minute and get back to 50-100% health from the passive on it. A skilled DRK is always more cancerous to kill than a PLD. DRK's also put out a good bit more damage than PLD. Outside of cover & possibly LB group utility, DRK is better than PLD.