Leave SCH Alone

Surely just because winrates are a little higher doesn't actually mean it deserves a nerf yeah? Surely people who get paid to do multivaried analysis of PvP data wouldn't come to work and say "winrate high, therefore nerf", right?

Crystal Tier SCH Main btw.

Usually that's how it works, but they don't really have to. I would rather buff the other healer jobs to match SCH, to even out the win rate % across all 4. I'm also a SCH main, it can also be that not many ppl play the job, just have a high success in wins. It's like a 90/100 wins and you leave it there. If they don't reset it then it'll keep it as a high win rate so it can be confusing overall. They just need a better reason to make ppl play SCH much much more than the other healer jobs. ..............I never quite ask the top tier pvp players if that data is accurate towards SCH.

SCH is always either terrible or the strongest healer :p It seems to never change

I wouldn't mind some adjustments, hopefully if they end up nerfing SCHs main kit, they will compensate at least a little by making mummification less janky to use.

It is pretty dumb as SCH in frontline you can just spread dots all game and get free 100 BH like crazy with 0 effort or danger attached to it, that' something that needs a change at least.

I'm not understanding the power of SCH I think.
(I preface this next bit to say that no animosity is meant in my findings, only my outlook.)

Broil IV hits for nothing
Mummification is janky and melee'ish range
Adlo heal and shield isn't worth the gcd
Expedition speed buff is "kind of" redundant with how sprint works
The Recitation mechanic being tied to the two longest cooldowns you have is awkward
And i honestly do not believe that that Biolysis damage or 10% debuff is very threatening

At least in CC I do not see a reason to bring a SCH over the other healers. FL is an entire different story however.

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Originally Posted by Cjhorn

I'm not understanding the power of SCH I think.
(I preface this next bit to say that no animosity is meant in my findings, only my outlook.)

Broil IV hits for nothing
Mummification is janky and melee'ish range
Adlo heal and shield isn't worth the gcd
Expedition speed buff is "kind of" redundant with how sprint works
The Recitation mechanic being tied to the two longest cooldowns you have is awkward
And i honestly do not believe that that Biolysis damage or 10% debuff is very threatening

At least in CC I do not see a reason to bring a SCH over the other healers. FL is an entire different story however.

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Well If you think about 1 vs 1 then sch isn't strong. However think CC as team battle is another story.
Expedient already sch and near by teammate speed boost + damage taken -10% for 10s + recitation.
Mummification is strong tool deal 6k damage + 25% nerf healing on 10s targets. So recuperate become heal 12k on target instead 15k.
Adlo First you mistake with Adlo. Adlo isn't for def or heal But is buff for + 10% dps increase So think it as dps increase buff instead heal at this point you can even call healing n shield just a bonus with a dps buff lol.
Biolysis is strong as hell without recitation it self is already 15k damage which is equal 1 recuperate 15k with spread is mean you force people to use 1 recuperate already and with recitation is 22,5k damage + 10% nerf damage on target 15s and also dot damage remain full damage before guard on.

Now you try to combo you ability Expendient + Biolysis+ deployment tactics= AoE 20% def buff without adlo or teammate def cd.
Now just try image sch with a mch. Adlo with Sch and mch and Recitation Biolysis on target and target use Guard after get hit by Biolysis and mch use Drill with this 5sec guard target take more then 36k damage while in guard with still left 2tick of 4,95k dot. without any LB or another dps support.
Now try to image adlo with sch and drg LB give damage 33k with 5y and with Biolysis 24,7k dot. Is only with drg LB.
Sch support toolkit is strong

Yeah, SCH is pretty well balanced in CC. It can't really do a lot on its own, but with any allies nearby it can shine thanks to its heavy support. This of course means you're heavily dependent on your group, but this is true of any support in any PvP mode in any game. IMO there's no point balancing around Frontlines with the kits, since they weren't made with that in mind. However, adding modifiers like 5 targets only I can see working, since that limits the damage that can be done without effecting CC.

I can see how SCH could be considered good, it has some great party support with AoE +10% damage dealt, -10% damage taken for allies and -10% damage dealt on enemies while also having a DoT tic on everyone for free damage.

But I’m surprised to hear people saying it needs a nerf. I preface this with I only play frontlines, but for all it’s support, as a HEALER, I feel like SCH is pretty weak. Adlo heal and shield feel like they do absolutely nothing and that is all you have in your Arsenal for actual healing. Other than that all you have is the LB and that also feels incredibly tame compared to other LBs, I barely feel the impact of my LB when I use it and the having to place it rather than just having your fairy follow you around makes me hesitate to use it as often as I feel like I could.

Honestly SCH feels more like a support tank than a healer and if it gets any kind of nerfs to it’s utility or damage I hope they make up for it with some increased healing.

I think SCH is in a pretty good spot. It might not have good self-peel tools compared to other healers but its entire niche is controlling teamfights towards its favor. I'm actually surprised people call SCH a weak healer when Seraph gives your entire team Excog, another shield, and crowd-control resistance. Combine this with Bio and Adlo and Mummification, it's going to be seriously hard to stop your team. My only issue with SCH is that Seraph takes so freaking long to spawn, she's dancing around for like 3 whole seconds before she actually does something.

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Originally Posted by flowerfairy

I think SCH is in a pretty good spot. It might not have good self-peel tools compared to other healers but its entire niche is controlling teamfights towards its favor. I'm actually surprised people call SCH a weak healer when Seraph gives your entire team Excog, another shield, and crowd-control resistance. Combine this with Bio and Adlo and Mummification, it's going to be seriously hard to stop your team. My only issue with SCH is that Seraph takes so freaking long to spawn, she's dancing around for like 3 whole seconds before she actually does something.

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And it causes undo grief because you die before you can get her to actually shield the team. T_T

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Originally Posted by flowerfairy

I think SCH is in a pretty good spot. It might not have good self-peel tools compared to other healers but its entire niche is controlling teamfights towards its favor. I'm actually surprised people call SCH a weak healer when Seraph gives your entire team Excog, another shield, and crowd-control resistance. Combine this with Bio and Adlo and Mummification, it's going to be seriously hard to stop your team. My only issue with SCH is that Seraph takes so freaking long to spawn, she's dancing around for like 3 whole seconds before she actually does something.

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Oh that. The cast is pretty instant, the animation is misleading. Had to try it out a few times myself. You can say excog is pretty strong…….if you not getting bun bumping with your opponents. If you cast Seraph while getting attacked, you won’t know that your excog already gotten used so it’s also misleading that it’s a strong LB. Yes, you get a free purify, but it’s also situational. If getting hounded by CCs, seraph’s purify is pointless. Consolation…….well, it’s something. I can’t see it as a benefit or a good ability….back to situation in matches.

I’m a SCH main, it’s a………..it needs a strong comp to be a great healer to have. Without it, it’s a gamble. Not saying it’s a bad job to play, but it falls on your other 4 members.

That makes SCH a true support. It can't do any real killing itself, but it can buff the party and debuff the enemies...and now I have the urge to start playing City of Heroes again to make a true support. Ahh, the old days of MMOs where a support had to party up to do anything. :p

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Originally Posted by Osmond

Oh that. The cast is pretty instant, the animation is misleading. Had to try it out a few times myself. You can say excog is pretty strong…….if you not getting bun bumping with your opponents. If you cast Seraph while getting attacked, you won’t know that your excog already gotten used so it’s also misleading that it’s a strong LB. Yes, you get a free purify, but it’s also situational. If getting hounded by CCs, seraph’s purify is pointless. Consolation…….well, it’s something. I can’t see it as a benefit or a good ability….back to situation in matches.

I’m a SCH main, it’s a………..it needs a strong comp to be a great healer to have. Without it, it’s a gamble. Not saying it’s a bad job to play, but it falls on your other 4 members.

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3 seconds was an exaggeration but the buffs still come out a little slow compared to every other LB tho it could be on my end. Even Bahamut doesn't really care about it since it snapshots everyone in the initial AoE.
Excog is an AoE 8k potency heal when you hit 50% HP. Maybe not as strong as Cure III, but once again if you combine that with everything else (Expedient's 10% defense buff, Bio's 10% damage reduction, Adlo, Consolation), it makes a big difference in a fight. A free purify is actually especially strong if you're getting pelted by crowd-control since you can keep your Resilience for later.

All jobs depend on your teammates to know what their buttons do in PvP. SCH may not feel impactful because it doesn't have anything immediately threatening to the other team like WHM's LB and polymorph. It stays on the sidelines, monitoring the fight to determine whether to spread Adlo or Bio and occasionally stepping in to place Mummification. Even if your team comp isn't very good at utilizing Adlo damage buff, Bio brings so much passive damage and Mummification makes the enemy team have to use up more mana to stay healthy.

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Originally Posted by flowerfairy

3 seconds was an exaggeration but the buffs still come out a little slow compared to every other LB tho it could be on my end. Even Bahamut doesn't really care about it since it snapshots everyone in the initial AoE.
Excog is an AoE 8k potency heal when you hit 50% HP. Maybe not as strong as Cure III, but once again if you combine that with everything else (Expedient's 10% defense buff, Bio's 10% damage reduction, Adlo, Consolation), it makes a big difference in a fight. A free purify is actually especially strong if you're getting pelted by crowd-control since you can keep your Resilience for later.

All jobs depend on your teammates to know what their buttons do in PvP. SCH may not feel impactful because it doesn't have anything immediately threatening to the other team like WHM's LB and polymorph. It stays on the sidelines, monitoring the fight to determine whether to spread Adlo or Bio and occasionally stepping in to place Mummification. Even if your team comp isn't very good at utilizing Adlo damage buff, Bio brings so much passive damage and Mummification makes the enemy team have to use up more mana to stay healthy.

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I’m not saying Seraph is bad, it’s in situations where you DO use it, you won’t notice that it’s proc’d when getting attacked by your opponent, trying to get a ko.. I’m not saying the tools are bad, you can have all that proc’d all you want, if you getting nuked it doesn’t matter. That’s what I’m saying. It’s a good ability nonetheless.

Yeah, you can say seraph’s purify is strong….until a chain stun or silence….womp womp….back to situations. I barely pay attention to it due to chaos of the match.

I just hate mummification as it is right now, that you have to close in to use it, but I understand that they need to have at least 1 somewhat a gap closer tool. …………hmm, they could give us a animation change. A teleport target mummification, but have the animation of Art of War, just be a small AoE spread instead of a cone. I just hate having to run to a target it use it.

Well they nerfed Adlo and Biolysis womp womp. Hey, I mean that 54% win rate was worth it lol. It's fine though, it'll be interesting.

Edit: Oh no lmao, they made AST even more nasty to have in the team with the new cards. Oh boy....

Edit 2: Also oof, they got rid of the spire. That's interesting there.

Not sure why they needed to nerf the potency there to 8%, considering SCH was so dependent on its team that it couldn't do anything on its own. Feels like an unneeded nerf, tbh.

I get that there is info we aren't privy to, but I assumed the perception is WHM is a strong PvP class while SCH isn't so would mean there wouldn't be any changes. I guess when more ppl play SCH in PvP things will change.