Bring Skillchains to FFXIV

Hi SquareEnix,

I would very much like skillchains be implemented in FFXIV.

It's abit too intricate and difficult in FFXI, so it would be nice to keep it simple, so that it can be easily implemented into fights.

It would also be good to give the skills of all jobs the possibility to combo with all jobs to avoid some jobs being favored over others.

A nice extra touch would be to have the end effect of the skillchain to give certain buffs to the group or debuffs on the enemy or enemies.

Fun fact: There actually was a form of skillchains back in 1.x called "Battle Regimens." They were meant to complement another system whereby large enemies could have parts broken off to debuff them. Once 2.0 was in the works, the Battle Regimen system was discarded in favor of the Limit Break system. In other words, it's doubtful we'll be moving back in the direction of skillchains.

Battle Regimens went away long before 2.0 was a concept on the horizon, it didn't last very long post release at all.

How would you even implement it? You spend 90% of the time auto attacking in FFXI so timing weaponskills is easy. It would be impossible to implement into XIV.

Its also pretty unnecessary to have in XIV honestly.

An idea of a simple skillchain system :
-each role get a gcd action (separate long recast) : red, blue and green.
-each give a corresponding color debuff with a base duration of 5s.
-each time the debuff change color it gets +1 counter but the duration is reduced by 0.5s by counter.
-when the debuff end it cause damage based of it's counter.

But I don't really see It working in XIV :
-the lack of elemental attribute lessen the point
-it worked if XI because it was a core gameplay element
-in XIV You'd see more people blaming other for missing their turn ; even if it was just for bonus damage

The only way I could really see it working is if they added it as a bonus thing similar to LB's where you have a TP bar you build up. It would be a balancing nightmare though if it actually gave like buffs/debuffs along with the damage it did.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

How would you even implement it? You spend 90% of the time auto attacking in FFXI so timing weaponskills is easy. It would be impossible to implement into XIV.

Its also pretty unnecessary to have in XIV honestly.

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Ninja applies "Trick Attack", causing the next 3 "Burst" skills to the target to deal 25% more damage and critically strike.

Dragoon grants their partner Dragon's Eye, giving them increased damage for 20 seconds. Using a burst skill ends the Dragon's Eye.

All jobs have burst skills, but some jobs exchange stronger burst skills for having no set ups. This means in solo play a Ninja can abuse their own trick attack with uh, Hyoshu Ranryu, but in party play, it's more beneficial to let the Black Mage / Samurai take as many of the charges as possible.

This is a very simple example of having a high five mechanic in FF14 and frankly I think we need some.

That's not a skillchain, that's just applying a buff/debuff to skills....Skillchains in FFXI were combining weaponskills together within a window and it created an elemental weakness for the black mage to magic burst into.

And your idea would go against FFXIV's design philosophy. Back in ARR certain buffs/debuffs simply made having double bard and a job with a piercing debuff absolutely mandatory. SE will never go back to a system that causes that.

I can't imagine adding skill chains or magic bursting to the game with the expectations from player skill with SE in FF14. The game isn't designed at all for a system like that as the only real synergy between jobs anymore is just buff alignment and who gets the biggest benefits from your buffs.

Too much skill needed and too much balancing needed
Not against it but its wouldn't happen

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Originally Posted by Amenara

I can't imagine adding skill chains or magic bursting to the game with the expectations from player skill with SE in FF14. The game isn't designed at all for a system like that as the only real synergy between jobs anymore is just buff alignment and who gets the biggest benefits from your buffs.

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Even in FFXI players stopped doing skillchains after a time because it wasn't really worth the effort for the magic burst damage over a simple TP burn party. I dunno how it is now a days, but from CoP all the way to ToAU TP burn parties were the norm. I only played Wings for a short time before I deployed and lost interest in the game.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

Even in FFXI players stopped doing skillchains after a time because it wasn't really worth the effort for the magic burst damage over a simple TP burn party. I dunno how it is now a days, but from CoP all the way to ToAU TP burn parties were the norm. I only played Wings for a short time before I deployed and lost interest in the game.

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The SC/MB meta is back for the crazy damage the Darkness and Light SCs can do. And yeah I do remember the TP burn meta back when I played it last time in the 00s. I am honestly enjoying the game a lot more now than I did back then, though.

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Originally Posted by Amenara

The SC/MB meta is back for the crazy damage the Darkness and Light SCs can do. And yeah I do remember the TP burn meta back when I played it last time in the 00s. I am honestly enjoying the game a lot more now than I did back then, though.

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Did they remove the elemental resistance build up? For a long time no one would play BLM in end game and no one did SC's because a boss would build immunity towards the element they were weak to and MB's would speed up that process.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

Did they remove the elemental resistance build up? For a long time no one would play BLM in end game and no one did SC's because a boss would build immunity towards the element they were weak to and MB's would speed up that process.

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Doing some more reading, SC/MB parties can be pretty effective in CP parties. I know I was doing some solo CP farming last night as PLD/DNC and was just Light SC spamming with one of my trusts. When I can get Shantotto II trust next week I will start using her cause she is a MB fiend apparently. As for high end bosses, I think some of them have high magic resistances so mages are less effective while others are magic weak. Some of the more mid tier stuff I have been fighting can be horrible to be a physical attacker or be horrible as a mage. Seems like they are trying to balance it out somewhat.

if they have not included this back into the game by now all the demanding will not force them to do so.

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Originally Posted by Calysto

An idea of a simple skillchain system :
-each role get a gcd action (separate long recast) : red, blue and green.
-each give a corresponding color debuff with a base duration of 5s.
-each time the debuff change color it gets +1 counter but the duration is reduced by 0.5s by counter.
-when the debuff end it cause damage based of it's counter.

But I don't really see It working in XIV :
-the lack of elemental attribute lessen the point
-it worked if XI because it was a core gameplay element
-in XIV You'd see more people blaming other for missing their turn ; even if it was just for bonus damage

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In my opinion, the key reason skillchains won't work in FFXIV has nothing to do with the game mechanics. It has more to do with how the game urges us to play the game. Hear me out.

In FFXI, before the level 75 cap was removed, you shouted in Jeuno for a PT. You might have been in a static and occasionally had a random pickup to fill that last spot in case someone couldn't show. Or you played with 5 strangers every time. Then, you headed out to your camp and played with the same players for hours. If a skillchain got messed up, you had time to discuss it and correct it in-between pulls or weapon skills.

In FFXIV, the only "statics" are raiding groups. Every other aspect of the game is designed around tossing you together with 3-7 other random players... for ~20 minute forays into a dungeon. There is little time to communicate. It is mash-mash-mash, wall to wall, boss - repeat. There is no time to coordinate skillchains.

FFXIV is very much a solo game. Even if the content you are doing has 3-7 other players around you, they might as well be NPCs with various levels of AI (some good, some not-so-good). You do your rotation, occasionally pick up the slack for someone that failed a mechanic and then go your separate ways. Skillchains just don't fit with that.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

In my opinion, the key reason skillchains won't work in FFXIV has nothing to do with the game mechanics. It has more to do with how the game urges us to play the game. Hear me out.

In FFXI, before the level 75 cap was removed, you shouted in Jeuno for a PT. You might have been in a static and occasionally had a random pickup to fill that last spot in case someone couldn't show. Or you played with 5 strangers every time. Then, you headed out to your camp and played with the same players for hours. If a skillchain got messed up, you had time to discuss it and correct it in-between pulls or weapon skills.

In FFXIV, the only "statics" are raiding groups. Every other aspect of the game is designed around tossing you together with 3-7 other random players... for ~20 minute forays into a dungeon. There is little time to communicate. It is mash-mash-mash, wall to wall, boss - repeat. There is no time to coordinate skillchains.

FFXIV is very much a solo game. Even if the content you are doing has 3-7 other players around you, they might as well be NPCs with various levels of AI (some good, some not-so-good). You do your rotation, occasionally pick up the slack for someone that failed a mechanic and then go your separate ways. Skillchains just don't fit with that.

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This is one of the best descriptions of the differences between FFXI and FFXIV I've ever read!