those who play on JP server how are you managing savage and others hard content ?

hi so a bit of context, i transfered from a EU DC to a JP DC few month ago, because i moved in japan for works reason anyway,
i love doing savage and ex trial, but while being in japan playing on a EU DC with 300 ping is ... try dodging a aoe with up to 2 seconds delay in savage ... yeah... so made the decision 2 month ago to move over in a JP DC,
ok so i can indeed speak japanese but not read or write (using romaji)
so here is the part you wanna hear

i am having the absolute WORST time ever in my years of playing ff14 ...
(regarding savage, trials, ultimate)
between the "JP only" or direct insta kick without even talking, or even straight up ignoring my "sugestion" or again if joining a grp farm, where all of us 8 ppl suposed to get a mount, and with bad luck im the last but, nop party straight up disband no question asked about if i still need it or not ...

how do you ppl that play in a JP DC manage to do hard content ? when you dont know/knew anybody ?

Oh man the "JP Only" tag....Brings back some FFXI memories.

I would suggest looking for a server where the Australian and Singapore players congregate ( I imagine most of the AU players didn't move to the OCE data center.)

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Originally Posted by Ransu

Oh man the "JP Only" tag....Brings back some FFXI memories.

I would suggest looking for a server where the Australian and Singapore players congregate ( I imagine most of the AU players didn't move to the OCE data center.)

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tbh honest im seriously considering, moving to a US server (still high ping but 150 is better than a EU 300)
but it kinda really annoys me in a way that, i wanted to take the chance to actually have some fun with japanese player, and eventually why not make some new friends !
from the look of it and despite my best effort doesnt look like its going to happen ...

like today, after getting kicked 4 time in a row from a parvis savage training "new player ok" party
decided to make my own, i litterally watched 15 similar grp fill up and go, while i was still waiting for a single player to join me ...

Not using kanji is a dead give away so I'm not surprised you're seeing social issues where you are.

Mana DC has very few English speakers from what I've been told so you're probably better off moving to Tonberry (Elemental DC) or an NA DC. Tonberry the unofficial OCE/SEA server so it's got the largest English speaking population of all JP servers while the DC as a whole is still heavily JP slanted so you'll have plenty of opportunity to play with Japanese.

Something very important to keep in mind is the JP data centers have an established way of doing things and making public suggestions to do things differently is going to be received rather poorly. If you want to raid, learn the JP strategies and customs, and don't deviate from them. If that doesn't sound like your cup of tea, you'll be much better served going to NA.

As far as ping goes, I live on the NA East Coast and play on a JP server. While I don't play savage, I don't find the ping to be a do-or-die thing 95% of the time. I do get the occasional lag spike death and loading times are a bit long, but not unbearable.

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Originally Posted by anguel

tbh honest im seriously considering, moving to a US server (still high ping but 150 is better than a EU 300)
but it kinda really annoys me in a way that, i wanted to take the chance to actually have some fun with japanese player, and eventually why not make some new friends !
from the look of it and despite my best effort doesnt look like its going to happen ...

like today, after getting kicked 4 time in a row from a parvis savage training "new player ok" party
decided to make my own, i litterally watched 15 similar grp fill up and go, while i was still waiting for a single player to join me ...

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I had similar issues in FFXI. I only typed in romanji and many JP players were pretty receptive of it, but most were just a complete hands off and I think a lot of that has to due with just how their culture is. JP players don't really talk publicly and keep most conversations in /tells and then you have someone talking to you completely in romanji is probably strange and puts them out of their comfort zone. A lot of times in FFXI I'd get replies in ENG because they were unsure if I could read the kanji, which to be fair I could read katakana and hiragana just fine, but a lot of kanji I still couldn't read yet lol.

JP players just tend to be pretty closed off and don't want to deal with non-JP players. It is what it is.

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

Something very important to keep in mind is the JP data centers have an established way of doing things and making public suggestions to do things differently is going to be received rather poorly.

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i was more meaning in a way that if a player keep dying in loop over and over rather than changing a strategy

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Originally Posted by Ransu

Oh man the "JP Only" tag....Brings back some FFXI memories.

I would suggest looking for a server where the Australian and Singapore players congregate ( I imagine most of the AU players didn't move to the OCE data center.)

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Back in FFXI days "JP ONLY" tags had exceptions to it as players with this in their search comments wouldn't have any issue playing with a non JP player that had an established positive reputation. This tag usually was set after multiple negative experiences with players that didn't speak Japanese or in some cases with me it was more of "It's late. Brain disabled. I forget English"

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Originally Posted by Ransu

JP players just tend to be pretty closed off and don't want to deal with non-JP players. It is what it is.

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Not that i care for it, but the bias there annoys me, why do we have to deal with mixed languages all the time lol

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Originally Posted by Ransu

JP players just tend to be pretty closed off and don't want to deal with non-JP players.

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The word you're looking for is "xenophobic".

Not too surprising tbh, in the same situation I doubt NA and EU players would act any differently.
The typing system is a pretty big hurdle I think most don't want to deal with.

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Originally Posted by Misplaced_Marbles

The word you're looking for is "xenophobic".

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"racist" works, too.

not so fun fact: it's 100% legal for companies in japan to confiscate the passports of foreign workers and often do so out of fear that they will "run away", it's also legal to force women to wear contacts instead of glasses and high heels instead of shoes as well as to falsely accuse foreigners of crimes they did not commit because japan has a 99% conviction rate and you don't get a jury unless the case relates to murder or something similar.

i quite literally have a JP-only license that for years i simply used emotes on and very, very carefully chose my words with. i watched, i read, i observed and slowly picked up terms and phrases that my japanese classes/studies weren't teaching me and slowly began to integrate them. i have yet to try and savage or primal content but i have found other english-speaking players and over the years many have been given free vacations or bans due to from what we can tell were completely fictitious reports made against them. at one point i began connecting to it via a ssh tunnel so my IP address appeared like it was coming from within japan.

this... idea that people don't talk on the JP servers needs to go. they just don't talk around -you- and when they do talk, a lot of them say some pretty terrible things about foreigners. you'll have the occasional person who tells them off but they'll often just be accused of kotobagari.

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Originally Posted by Denji

because japan has a 99% conviction rate and you don't get a jury unless the case relates to murder or something similar.

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It's such a problem in their society that it gave birth to the Ace Attorney series.

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Originally Posted by Misplaced_Marbles

The word you're looking for is "xenophobic".

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No. People like to make this statement all the time, but Japanese are not xenophobic.

You could try the Materia data center.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

No. People like to make this statement all the time, but Japanese are not xenophobic.

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Didn't you hear? If you don't accept the new thing 100% you are a xenophobe. Ignore the fact that the established rules and social norms would clash with the new thing, you are just a boomer who doesn't get it. :^)

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Originally Posted by Ransu

No. People like to make this statement all the time, but Japanese are not xenophobic.

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Not wanting to deal with 'others' seems like the definition of xenophobia though :/

It lines up with the comments I get from many foreigners, particularly when I used to volunteer for a foreigner meeting group with the purpose of learning English. Most of the Asian groups would intermingle and switch to English but the Japanese group was almost always exclusively Japanese and /multiple/ people told me they didn't feel welcome or wanted to go to the Japanese group because they wouldn't switch to English (the common language / purpose of the event) and would continue to speak in Japanese without including them into conversations or general activities.

Such issues are backed up regularly by people who lived there for a while, like how they might be nice to you but it takes exceptional effort to be included on the 'in group'. This has some benefits... Since those people are usually not expected to do as crazy hours lol. Though I would note most of these people are sharing their experience from like 5 years ago, so caution for that part..

Of course there are a lot of exceptions to the 'rule', like my best partner in crime for Warframe was a Japanese dude and though we usually didn't talk much we easily spent a few hundred hours grinding many days of the week as a duo only crew. And when we did we would spend hours just chatting stumbling through languages and google translate to get across topics from games, food, music, to religion, politics, and happy living.

In FFXI because my name appeared Japanese I was regularly invited to parties (and I knew what the basic dialog / courtesy steps were so I'd just type it in / paste if needed) while a friend whose name was clearly not Japanese was never invited and frequently ignored even when using auto translate (but they had /1/ Japanese friend who helped them get a lot of really expensive cool stuff, who spoke fantastic English because they were an ambassador sometime ago.. lol- very jelly...).

Then you have Koji, who appears to be well accepted and exceptionally important part of the company (not only person, everyone is important but at least he's allowed to be important and have a face too- so it seems like he is part of the crew for the purpose of this conversation, which is as it should be ~!). Also in relationship to FFXI / FFXIV, as far as I know it's the only MMO that makes it really easy to communicate with people who don't speak your language, so that's a point to SE there.

I think it's easy to find stories of racism in a culture (USA, Canada, whatever) but usually you'll get a lot of "that's disgusting / awful" from people who hear about them, like when Asians were being targeted due to COVID. It's been a while since I've talked to really extrovert Japanese but given the impression when I talked to them and to other foreigners.. being openly prejudice to foreigners is (or recently was) completely acceptable in a general sense. To which would be something in the states, and other places, would be considered blatantly racist (or other 'ists' like nationalist).

Though my sense tells me such things, like most places in the world, oscillate slightly but is generally moving to a more global and accepting view- I would think especially since they kindly opened their doors to some Ukrainian refugees, and as well in general have a population growth problem that will need to likely be solved with immigration.

Move to the Aus Data Center.

My suggestion from someone who plays on Mana DC for 8 years and retired from raiding is, find english speaker that interested in raiding and make a static. JP static only accept you if you understand what they want no matter if you speak JP or not. :)

As others have suggested, if you want to stay in a Japanese DC to ensure the lowest ping, you might consider moving to the Elemental DC where there may be more English speakers. Mana has very few English speakers, so it really helps if you can communicate fully in Japanese.

Otherwise, the Materia DC (Oceania) may be playable. I don't know about Savage level content, but I've played in trials on Materia up to Lv80 from Japan and it was pretty much okay for dodging mechanics.

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Originally Posted by anguel

i was more meaning in a way that if a player keep dying in loop over and over rather than changing a strategy

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

Something very important to keep in mind is the JP data centers have an established way of doing things and making public suggestions to do things differently is going to be received rather poorly. If you want to raid, learn the JP strategies and customs, and don't deviate from them.

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Illmaeran is right. There are established ways of doing things if you play on a Japanese DC, and most people will just keep at it through multiple failures until they get it right.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Snip.

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Based on my understanding, a lot of Japanese people don't speak English even if they can because they either find it embarrassing or disrespectful unless it's perfect.
And a lot of them have a very strong accent which they're frequently mocked for even if they're trying really hard.
But that's my limited understanding and I might be wrong.

Native English speakers very often have thick accents too when speaking other languages, and when it comes to languages like Japanese it's a lot more complicated than just being able to say the words.
The meaning of a word can totally change depending on tone of voice and context, it's like this in Swedish too and you can very easily be misunderstood and it's very hard to learn unless you grow up with it.
Even if someone speaks Swedish fluently if they have an accent it's going to be a pretty different conversation and more difficult to really gauge their mood and intent sometimes, unless they've really worked hard to learn to speak with a proper accent.

I also find that a lot of native English-Speakers will mispronounce things on purpose and sound like they're annoyed that they have to say something in a different language, and it comes across as really disrespectful.
And I mean there's a lot of cultural differences that can be perceived one way from the outside, I hear a lot of crap about Swedes all the time that I think is either pretty absurd or misunderstandings.
And it's difficult to really have a discussion about that especially online, most people aren't really interested in it it's a lot easier to just go '' wow I can't believe they're like that '' and move on with your day.

Tbh from my pov and impression I think that in the US people are overly pushy and hyper-social to a point where it's really overbearing and annoying.
But on the other hand a lot of Americans will think that Swedes are anti-social to a point of absurdity.
I think both hold some truth from a certain pov but are also kinda wrong and exaggerated.
And I have to imagine these things are only magnified when it comes to a country like Japan.

I think it's especially important to keep in mind too that the internet climate in NA and EU isn't really an accurate reflection of reality.
I think a lot of the stuff people online will say is disgusting and awful won't be as controversial irl.
The online climate is quite sanitized and lean more in a hyper progressive direction that doesn't actually exist in the real world.
In the US there's a ton of racism and tension between minority groups too that you don't really see in media and online but come through in polls and studies on demographics and social views.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

Based on my understanding, a lot of Japanese people don't speak English even if they can because they either find it embarrassing or disrespectful unless it's perfect.
And a lot of them have a very strong accent which they're frequently mocked for even if they're trying really hard.
But that's my limited understanding and I might be wrong.

Native English speakers very often have thick accents too when speaking other languages, and when it comes to languages like Japanese it's a lot more complicated than just being able to say the words.
The meaning of a word can totally change depending on tone of voice and context, it's like this in Swedish too and you can very easily be misunderstood and it's very hard to learn unless you grow up with it.
Even if someone speaks Swedish fluently if they have an accent it's going to be a pretty different conversation and more difficult to really gauge their mood and intent sometimes, unless they've really worked hard to learn to speak with a proper accent.

I also find that a lot of native English-Speakers will mispronounce things on purpose and sound like they're annoyed that they have to say something in a different language, and it comes across as really disrespectful.
And I mean there's a lot of cultural differences that can be perceived one way from the outside, I hear a lot of crap about Swedes all the time that I think is either pretty absurd or misunderstandings.
And it's difficult to really have a discussion about that especially online, most people aren't really interested in it it's a lot easier to just go '' wow I can't believe they're like that '' and move on with your day.

Tbh from my pov and impression I think that in the US people are overly pushy and hyper-social to a point where it's really overbearing and annoying.
But on the other hand a lot of Americans will think that Swedes are anti-social to a point of absurdity.
I think both hold some truth from a certain pov but are also kinda wrong and exaggerated.
And I have to imagine these things are only magnified when it comes to a country like Japan.

I think it's especially important to keep in mind too that the internet climate in NA and EU isn't really an accurate reflection of reality.
I think a lot of the stuff people online will say is disgusting and awful won't be as controversial irl.
The online climate is quite sanitized and lean more in a hyper progressive direction that doesn't actually exist in the real world.
In the US there's a ton of racism and tension between minority groups too that you don't really see in media and online but come through in polls and studies on demographics and social views.

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Just for the context of my experience with international people was in person (to reference your point on internet vs person), but I agree internet and in person vary. I also would probably agree to US people are overbearing which can be both sweet and icebreaker or "OH MY GOD GET OFF ME DUDE" lol. My wife, who wasn't born here, is almost appalled that I (and others to me) greet each other even though we don't know each other just as we're walking around (context being it's a casual walk, if you hit main cities it's usually too busy to do that).

That said the propensity to be 'xenophobic' has been something I've seen, and hear, very frequently both online and offline for Japanese - though all of this is mostly from 5 year old information. I assume, like most social issues, they'll slightly oscillate but almost always are trending upwards aka improving (for most places at least). As I don't do some of the things that put me in contact with people as often now, more of a quiet life lol. This also lines up historically.. so I wouldn't think it's out of bounds or rude or vaguely inaccurate to call out that this is probably a 'downside' (just like having some person approach you for no good reason and start asking you weird question you didn't want to answer, AND GIVING THEIR OPINONS ON IT lol, might be a downside for Americans).

Also can confirm that the usual response to why they excluded others or were more in a group was because of fear of looking bad / disrespect. But the thing is because they did it the other people felt they were rude lol, so the fear of looking bad made them look bad :p. Did not play out in their favor. I addressed this to some of the more open to communicate and they made direct attempts to fix that which was endearing. (This isn't a post to say how evil the Japanese are lol, just that I find that people tend to not have a very international view and will usually make one sided comments or worse weirdly biased ones.. like when you see "worse racism is in X country, everywhere else is a paradise" and anyone with any sense of outside is like.. "LOL".. though that doesn't change the importance of solving whatever issue is to be had. Nothing really gets done if everyone is doing 'whataboutisms'.

JP strats are usually good, and is way more orderly than NA because they mainly use macros for positioning/order and that's it. You will abide by that or leave the party. That means you don't have deal with the NA weird party finder types where some player demands they get southeast spot because they don't know the fight well enough to do any position, or suggest something that is far left-field.