Warrior Material

What is good materia for warrior and what should we attach it too?

for dps - Heaven's fist double/triple meld on hands or weapon , STR double/triple meld hands or weapon, VIT body -enmity belt

for tanking - VIT or def on body (i'd say VIT as you get the boost to damage), HP where ever you can add it, maybe parry (I don't bother with it), maybe ACC (if you need it), +enmity belt

Try for double/triple melds on everything if you wanna be decent.

It's pointless to ever gear your warrior with -enmity. There is no scenario where a warrior can both pull hate and does not want to do just that.

Here's a WAR tank melding guide I made for my LS. Of course these would be different for a DD WAR. Materia is sorted most desirable to least desirable:

WAR
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Weapon

Touch of Rage
STR
Savage Might (+ Crit Attack)
Heavens' Eye (+ Accuracy)
Heavens' Fist (+ Attack)
VIT* (broken at 50)

Head

Manaflight (Magic Evasion)

Body

VIT*
Bloodthirst (HP)

Hands

STR
Heaven's Fist (Attack Power)
Heaven's Eye (Accuracy)
Bloodthirst (HP)

Waist

Touch of Rage
Bloodthirst

Legs

Ironman's Will (+ STR/VIT)
Bloodthirst (HP)

Feet

Manaflight (Magic Evasion)
Bloodflight (Evasion)

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Originally Posted by Frein

It's pointless to ever gear your warrior with -enmity. There is no scenario where a warrior can both pull hate and does not want to do just that.

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Wrong, a DD WAR can use -enmity and you would not want to pull hate from the tank. For example, I've been using the Flame Sergeant's Tabard on my WAR for DD and do not make up the -20 enmity with any other gear other than what's on the af head and pants. I would agree that touch of serenity materia IS useless for a WAR, however.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

Wrong, a DD WAR can use -enmity and you would not want to pull hate from the tank. For example, I've been using the Flame Sergeant's Tabard on my WAR for DD and do not make up the -20 enmity with any other gear other than what's on the af head and pants. I would agree that touch of serenity materia IS useless for a WAR, however.

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A DD WAR can't put out enough damage to ever pull hate from the tank unless you're in a an AoE spam situation, in which case nobody cares and BLM can tank just fine. You don't need -enmity.

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Originally Posted by Frein

A DD WAR can't put out enough damage to ever pull hate from the tank unless you're in a an AoE spam situation, in which case nobody cares and BLM can tank just fine. You don't need -enmity.

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False. DPSing on Ifrit with MRD and was red in the majority of the battle before hellfire. You could do it with WAR as well, just have to be more careful on combos.

WAR is NOT just a tanking job, so get that out your head please and thank you

Main tank dies and goes after whm or blm, mission accomplished.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

False. DPSing on Ifrit with MRD and was red in the majority of the battle before hellfire. You could do it with WAR as well, just have to be more careful on combos.

WAR is NOT just a tanking job, so get that out your head please and thank you

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Your tank must have sucked. WAR single-target DPS is not very good at all, and even less so at Ifrit where you can't just constantly go all out the way the tank can.

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Originally Posted by Frein

Your tank must have sucked. WAR single-target DPS is not very good at all, and even less so at Ifrit where you can't just constantly go all out the way the tank can.

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Your own opinion, but don't shove your opinion down everyone's throat. MRD/WAR can DD pretty decent if given the chance.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Your own opinion, but don't shove your opinion down everyone's throat. MRD/WAR can DD pretty decent if given the chance.

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With my GC gear on, I can out DD everyone in the Garuda fight but the BLMs.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Your own opinion, but don't shove your opinion down everyone's throat. MRD/WAR can DD pretty decent if given the chance.

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No, it's not my opinion. It's fact. You have DRG and MNK at 50, so you should know they blow WAR out of the water against a single target.

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Originally Posted by Frein

No, it's not my opinion. It's fact. You have DRG and MNK at 50, so you should know they blow WAR out of the water against a single target.

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But you have to realize they aren't the best pick.

What if your party so happens to mess up on nails and not get them all down? At least as a MRD I can heal myself plus I have at least 600+ more health than the other two classes/jobs you are talking about.

It's not ALWAYS about dps, sometimes it's about survival. And a MRD/WAR has a bigger healthpool which means more survival as a DD

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

But you have to realize they aren't the best pick.

What if your party so happens to mess up on nails and not get them all down? At least as a MRD I can heal myself plus I have at least 600+ more health than the other two classes/jobs you are talking about.

It's not ALWAYS about dps, sometimes it's about survival. And a MRD/WAR has a bigger healthpool which means more survival as a DD

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That's completely off-topic. The question was, can a warrior use -enmity? My argument was that in situations where you want to avoid aggro, you're not going to get it either way, and in situations where you want aggro, you don't want -enmity.

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Originally Posted by Frein

That's completely off-topic. The question was, can a warrior use -enmity? My argument was that in situations where you want to avoid aggro, you're not going to get it either way, and in situations where you want aggro, you don't want -enmity.

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Off topic? No it's not "off topic". I'm right and you are just saying that because you know I'm right lol. I can't tell you how many times I've survived hellfire because something happened with nails.. while the other dd's just died.

People can use -enmity. It's not a bad thing because WAR isn't JUST a tank. Get it out your head please and thanks

Since the topic is about which materia is best for WAR/MRD, I'm gonna step in here and say you'd never want touch of serenity on your gear. If it's on some gear with other awesome stats already such as the Flames Sergeant's Tabard where you can make up for it with jewelry, thats one thing. But you should NEVER add touch of serenity materia on your WAR/MRD gear.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Off topic? No it's not "off topic". I'm right and you are just saying that because you know I'm right lol. I can't tell you how many times I've survived hellfire because something happened with nails.. while the other dd's just died.

People can use -enmity. It's not a bad thing because WAR isn't JUST a tank. Get it out your head please and thanks

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You're completely ignoring what I say. I'm not saying WAR is always useless for any non-tank role, I'm saying there are no situations where you'd want -enmity. Do you not see how these are completely different things? At what point during Ifrit did -enmity help your survive Hellfire? It didn't, and that's not what we were discussing. We were discussing materia choices.

Non-main tank warriors work well in many fights like Garuda, Myrmidon Princess and Castrum Novum, but as DD against a single target (like Ifrit or Chimera), WAR kind of sucks. No matter what, you can't deal enough damage to pull hate from the tank even if he has 0 +enmity, unless he goes AFK during the fight, so you don't need -enmity. WAR DD is only efficient when you need AoE that is a) physical damage, b) provided by a sturdy character, or both.

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Originally Posted by Frein

No, it's not my opinion. It's fact. You have DRG and MNK at 50, so you should know they blow WAR out of the water against a single target.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FopyRHHlt3M

Some mean kitties in here.

War damage sucks. If you think can out damage other DD classes then you've played with other people that suck too. Getting hate as War is not a big deal, you can handle it unlike other classes. Why would you want to lower your damage even more by equiping -emnity gear for DDing. What a waste.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

Some mean kitties in here.

War damage sucks. If you think can out damage other DD classes then you've played with other people that suck too. Getting hate as War is not a big deal, you can handle it unlike other classes. Why would you want to lower your damage even more by equiping -emnity gear for DDing. What a waste.

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-enmity has no affect on your dmg output. And no my DDs in the garuda fight don't suck, quite the contrary. WAR as DD in the Garuda fight is boss. The extra dmg output in that fight comes from being able to kill the plumes before most of the other DDs can touch them. if your WAR DD is not out damaging the rest of the DDs, you will lose that fight because it means the plumes are hanging around for simply too long and you will not have enough rocks up for her 2hr.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

-enmity has no affect on your dmg output.

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If you equip -enmity gear instead of DD gear, you'll do less damage.

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The extra dmg output in that fight comes from being able to kill the plumes before most of the other DDs can touch them.

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Other DD have aoe too and it got improved, your damage & range got nerfed and it still makes you suck in damage on Garuda compared to other classes.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

If you equip -enmity gear instead of DD gear, you'll do less damage.

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Wrong, Flame Sergeant Tabard has -enmity, and it's DD gear. If we're only talking about rings, accessories, and materia, then I will agree. If this is meant to be more general, then it's simply not true as in the case of the GC tabard.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

Other DD have aoe too and it got improved, your damage & range got nerfed and it still makes you suck in damage on Garuda compared to other classes.

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Not true, look up. I've parsed the fight quite a few times and usually come up 3rd in dmg, 1st when ranked against other physical attackers. Also the nerf to the range of steel cyclone should have no effect on weather or not you can take down the plumes since you should be hitting them before they move out of range.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

Wrong, Flame Sergeant Tabard has -enmity, and it's DD gear. If we're only talking about rings, accessories, and materia, then I will agree. If this is meant to be more general, then it's simply not true as in the case of the GC tabard.

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It's not the best DD piece you can get. You are downgrading.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

Not true, look up. I've parsed the fight quite a few times and usually come up 3rd in dmg, 1st when ranked against other physical attackers. Also the nerf to the range of steel cyclone should have no effect on weather or not you can take down the plumes since you should be hitting them before they move out of range.

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Then you're playing with other suckers.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

It's not the best DD piece you can get. You are downgrading.

Then you're playing with other suckers.

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It's not the best, however the results speak for themselves. The GC tabard holds it's own against average melded gear. On top of that, the average party does not have better than average gear. If you don't listen to the facts, then you are a fool.

Lets take a look at the stats on the GC Tabard for comparrison:

Flame Sergeant's Tabard
HP : +60
Str : +10 << you can't put STR on a chest piece via materia
Accuracy : +5 << you can't put ACC on a chest piece via materia
Enmity : -20
Flame gear set (3): Crit Attack Power +40 << big plus if you have 3 GC items on and + crit rate accessories


Cobalt Cuirass
HP : +60
Vit : +7
Attack Power : +4 << STR on the Tabard is MUCH better than this even with + 7 VIT

* With more VIT, the cuirass could be better for DD than the GC tabard depending on how much damage each point in VIT is worth as a dmg modifier. In general though folks add HP to thier chest pieces because of the negligible damage mitigation of VIT. For DD, if you are using a meldable chest piece, it's probably a good idea to use something like crit attack power materia assuming you have the crit rate gear to back it up. The cost of such materia makes it so that it's not really an attractive option, however.


Fighter's Cuirass
Redirects magic damage during Vengeance
HP : +50
Attack Power : +6
Accuracy : +6
Vit : +7 << again, the +10 STR on the tabard is better for DD, but with the +6 attk probably evens out
Evasion : +3


In the end, I do more damage wearing my GC tabard than I do with my any of my double melded cuirasses (I have 3) or my Fighter's Cuirass. For DD, it's definately not a downgrade in most situations. (a melded cobalt cuirass may be an exception depending on what's on it, such as double or triple melded one with VIT.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

War damage sucks. If you think can out damage other DD classes then you've played with other people that suck too.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4

Oh you people. Always good for a laugh.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

It's not the best, however the results speak for themselves. The GC tabard holds it's own against average melded gear. On top of that, the average party does not have better than average gear. If you don't listen to the facts, then you are a fool.

Lets take a look at the stats on the GC Tabard for comparrison:

Flame Sergeant's Tabard
HP : +60
Str : +10 << you can't put STR on a chest piece via materia
Accuracy : +5 << you can't put ACC on a chest piece via materia
Enmity : -20
Flame gear set (3): Crit Attack Power +40 << big plus if you have 3 GC items on and + crit rate accessories


Cobalt Cuirass
HP : +60
Vit : +7
Attack Power : +4 << STR on the Tabard is MUCH better than this even with + 7 VIT

* With more VIT, the cuirass could be better for DD than the GC tabard depending on how much damage each point in VIT is worth as a dmg modifier. In general though folks add HP to thier chest pieces because of the negligible damage mitigation of VIT. For DD, if you are using a meldable chest piece, it's probably a good idea to use something like crit attack power materia assuming you have the crit rate gear to back it up. The cost of such materia makes it so that it's not really an attractive option, however.


Fighter's Cuirass
Redirects magic damage during Vengeance
HP : +50
Attack Power : +6
Accuracy : +6
Vit : +7 << again, the +10 STR on the tabard is better for DD, but with the +6 attk probably evens out
Evasion : +3


In the end, I do more damage wearing my GC tabard than I do with my any of my double melded cuirasses (I have 3) or my Fighter's Cuirass. For DD, it's definately not a downgrade in most situations. (a melded cobalt cuirass may be an exception depending on what's on it, such as double or triple melded one with VIT.)

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Why are you listing those for DD and not for example a cobalt haubergeon melded with crit attack
or even now the sexy Darksteel Haubergeon:

Str+7, Attack+7, Acc+8, Crit Attack+10 , meldable.

If you're trying to get the set bonus, then you're downgrading other equipslots.

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Originally Posted by Kagato

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4

Oh you people. Always good for a laugh.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-iPlnvBjHc

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

Why are you listing those for DD and not for example a cobalt haubergeon melded with crit attack
or even now the sexy Darksteel Haubergeon:

Str+7, Attack+7, Acc+8, Crit Attack+10 , meldable.

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I ignored the darksteel stuff because it's prohibitively expensive. Like I said, the GC tabard isn't the best, but it holds it's own against average gear, being that the darksteel hauby is so expensive, it doesn't fit the "average gear" model. If we're gonna consider the darksteel gear, then we should also consider the darklight gear, and well, the GC gear won't hold a candle to that stuff.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

If you're trying to get the set bonus, then you're downgrading other equipslots.

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Not really, you can't put acc on your waist via materia for example. So by wearing the Flame Sergeant's Sash in addition to my gc tabard (the two having a combined 15 ACC), I can replace an ACC ring with the flame segeant's ring, which gives me 20 more attack power. Also, I could be wrong on this, but I believe the extra DEX on the sash helps add dmg to weaponskills as well.

Believe me when I say I did my homework before I bought the stuff. I thought it would be a bit of a downgrade, just as you obviously do, but I didn't think it would be huge. But it turns out I was wrong, for DD, the GC gear is very decent. The parse results don't lie. Again, you can make better gear with materia but it better have double melded tier IV's all over the place, and not just any tier IVs will do.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

Some mean kitties in here.

War damage sucks. If you think can out damage other DD classes then you've played with other people that suck too. Getting hate as War is not a big deal, you can handle it unlike other classes. Why would you want to lower your damage even more by equiping -emnity gear for DDing. What a waste.

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Do you not realize -enmity is equippable on the belt slot? How on earth does that take away from damage output? I don't understand...

And honestly, you must not be a full hearted MRD/WAR then if you think their damage sucks. Seriously dude, go troll somewheres else.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Do you not realize -enmity is equippable on the belt slot? How on earth does that take away from damage output? I don't understand...

And honestly, you must not be a full hearted MRD/WAR then if you think their damage sucks. Seriously dude, go troll somewheres else.

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I wouldn't even bother trying to argue with him. He really has no earthly idea what he's talking about.

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Originally Posted by Kagato

I wouldn't even bother trying to argue with him. He really has no earthly idea what he's talking about.

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Lol I just had to put some sense into his head that -enmity on a belt or any place else doesn't take away from damage. That's more damage you can do in actuality. Aye, some people are giving me headaches on these forums recently.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

I ignored the darksteel stuff because it's prohibitively expensive.

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That's why I said Cobalt version first.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Do you not realize -enmity is equippable on the belt slot? How on earth does that take away from damage output? I don't understand...

And honestly, you must not be a full hearted MRD/WAR then if you think their damage sucks. Seriously dude, go troll somewheres else.

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Accuracy, Crit, Crit Attack Power. I guess you aren't up to date.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Lol I just had to put some sense into his head that -enmity on a belt or any place else doesn't take away from damage. That's more damage you can do in actuality.

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No, because you're not going to take main hate. And even if you do, if you really are as awesome as you say you are, no one cares since War is expected to tank anyway. Just flip your Rampage on if you haven't already, stop being a pussy and tank.

No. Paladins are expected to tank.

Warriors are expected to be able to do whatever the situation calls for. Is there no one to tank? Warrior takes over. Is there already a Tank? Warrior piles on the damage gear, pops berserk and goes wild.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

That's why I said Cobalt version first.





Accuracy, Crit, Crit Attack Power. I guess you aren't up to date.



No, because you're not going to take main hate. And even if you do, if you really are as awesome as you say you are, no one cares since War is expected to tank anyway. Just flip your Rampage on if you haven't already, stop being a pussy and tank.

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A p*ssy? LMAO I can't take you seriously anymore... just stop while you're ahead of yourself

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Originally Posted by Kagato

No. Paladins are expected to tank.

Warriors are expected to be able to do whatever the situation calls for. Is there no one to tank? Warrior takes over. Is there already a Tank? Warrior piles on the damage gear, pops berserk and goes wild.

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If you honestly think Berserk comes even close to making WAR as much of a DD as MNK or DRG is, you play with some amazingly bad people. Let's make the comparison to DRG, because it's mechanically more similar to WAR than MNK is:

WAR DD advantages:
- Berserk

DRG DD advantages:
- Power Surge (over time much more potent than Berserk)
- Better WS arsenal
- Jump
- Invigorate
- Blood for Blood
- Hawk's Eye

The only thing WAR has going for it is the ability to withstand blows with ease while dealing decent damage at the same time. This makes the job perform exceptionally well in encounters where that actually comes up in, which does not iclude things like Ifrit. I'd be pretty damn impressed if the best equipped DD WAR in the world could pull hate off me tanking Ifrit while wearing defensive gear with no +enmity.

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Originally Posted by Frein

If you honestly think Berserk comes even close to making WAR as much of a DD as MNK or DRG is, you play with some amazingly bad people. Let's make the comparison to DRG, because it's mechanically more similar to WAR than MNK is:

WAR DD advantages:
- Berserk

DRG DD advantages:
- Power Surge (over time much more potent than Berserk)
- Better WS arsenal
- Jump
- Invigorate
- Blood for Blood
- Hawk's Eye

The only thing WAR has going for it is the ability to withstand blows with ease while dealing decent damage at the same time. This makes the job perform exceptionally well in encounters where that actually comes up in, which does not iclude things like Ifrit. I'd be pretty damn impressed if the best equipped DD WAR in the world could pull hate off me tanking Ifrit while wearing defensive gear with no +enmity.

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You forgot Mighty Strikes (all attacks are crits while it's active), and the steel cyclone combo (which increases crit rate), and the godsbane combo (which also increases crit rate). If you stack accuracy, crit attack, and crit rate gear on WAR, it makes a beastly DD.

Please don't bring 15min abilities into this. And that Godsbane crit doesn't even come close to for example a Dragon Kick.

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

Please don't bring 15min abilities into this. And that Godsbane crit doesn't even come close to for example a Dragon Kick.

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Now you're comparing to a straight DPS job. Be gone

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Originally Posted by KumaAkuma

Please don't bring 15min abilities into this. And that Godsbane crit doesn't even come close to for example a Dragon Kick.

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why not? I can use it in a fight, can't I? and godsbane might do less damage, but that doesn't make it useless, it's damage and that of the increased number of crits from using it in a combo is counted in your total damage output so it should not be ignored here.

We're not comparing single skills to single skills here, it's the total package that matters.

I've never said that War abilties are useless. I'm saying that when you compare War damage to DD class damage it's a lot lower. Mighty Strikes does not miraculously increase War damage output so that it's suddenly on par with DD classes.

Frein listed abilities that DRG DD had over War. Why didn't she list Godsbane & Steelcyclone? Actually she did: Drg has a better WS arsenal. Meaning DRG ws > WAR ws.

You are the one focusing on single things Molly. Like Godsbane, so I gave you a single focus example with DragonKick. Frein was focussing on the total package and you nit-picked.