when to bring beast master in

i would introduce beastmaster when the sanctury island are being introduce

i also add limit job arena

aswell as squardon runs with limit jobs

I remember loving that movie as a kid (the sequel was terrible though)

https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/7fe...6309caa40.jpeg

It could also come when BLU makes the jump to 80.

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Originally Posted by Savagelf

i would introduce beastmaster when the sanctury island are being introduce

i also add limit job arena

aswell as squardon runs with limit jobs

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please no. no more limited jobs. real jobs that are different from what we currently have. i dont understand the obsession with limited jobs and jobs that are just reskins of current jobs.

Every Job in FFXIV except BLU is a bespoke piece of design, made to fit into the boss content of the game.

BLU isn't because it's a collection Job that has no bespoke elements. It is literally cobbled together from elements around the world.

BST would be no different.

You really want definite, bespoke designs in group party content, where Job performance falls within certain expected parameters.

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Originally Posted by Floortank

Every Job in FFXIV except BLU is a bespoke piece of design, made to fit into the boss content of the game.

BLU isn't because it's a collection Job that has no bespoke elements. It is literally cobbled together from elements around the world.

BST would be no different.

You really want definite, bespoke designs in group party content, where Job performance falls within certain expected parameters.

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The advantage of limited jobs is, they don't have to be compatible with the other skills, the raids.
They can also experiment with new ideas with limited jobs, and something like Beastmaster, for example, could be as unbalanced as BLU, and people would be happy about it, not angry.
We already get new regular jobs each expansion.

I'm sorry, but where does this idea come from that Beastmaster *MUST* have pets collectable around the world to essentially just be "FFXIV Pokemon: Gotta catch em all!" when Summoner exists as a pet-type job with a certain selection of pets you unlock / obtain canonically in their story line? Even BLU's ability learning couldve been questline gated, such as learning Bad Breath from a Morbol threat in their storyline or Magic Hammer learned from a quest-based "Apanda" (O3S add name, don't know the previous one), Martyn congratulating you on your victory and then you accidently slap him with a hammer as you shake his hand.

Beastmaster does not and should not require to become a Limited Job to justify its exstence as a pet-type job. It is in my opinion bad enough that one full job people looked forward to play in regular content (you can't even use it for MSQ quest instances) has been delegated to side activity status when said side activity could've been encouraged via normal party compositions. What we have now with BLU is likely never going to change, but let us not kid ourselves that BLU had to be this way for "tradition", because by same tradition Black Mage isn't abusing elemental weaknesses, Bard is hardly a bard and rather a singing bowslinger, Summoner for the longest time was not an intense summoning job like other FF games and Red Mage isn't nearly the "jack of all trades, master of none" as other games, something BLU could've done the same.

Additionally, blue magic learning differed from one FF game to another, FFXIV could've incorporated ability learning (and balancing) in a more structured manner or at least have three different types of BLU soul crystals / kits befitting a more designated role for BLU so you could still have BLU an actual jack of all trades, just not all of it at once.

My point is, Beastmaster could be a melee or ranged job with the usage of a pet similar to Summoner. I mean even Dark Knight and Machinist technically have pets, even if its just one right now, yet Machinist had two different auto turrets once, so there is that. You don't need an infinite amount of pets, three to six could be fine enough to create intricate gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I'm sorry, but where does this idea come from that Beastmaster *MUST* have pets collectable around the world to essentially just be "FFXIV Pokemon: Gotta catch em all!" when Summoner exists as a pet-type job with a certain selection of pets you unlock / obtain canonically in their story line?

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SMN pets are stances at this point, not what people who like traditional pet classes mean when they say "pets".

Ultima Online had you go out and tame, then train your pets. They fought for you, and your job was to heal them, and if you had the build for that, do some additional damage. Your pet became a personal thing, you'd look for stronger ones, you'd name them, they had to be fed. There was a relationship between you and your pet.

Dark Age of Camelot had the Bonedancer, a class that had a team of pets. You could spec into casters, healers or whatever, then add ranged/caster/melee DPS, and you'd have your tank, so you'd basically micromanage your pet party. The whole party had the strength of one player, it killed more slowly that others, but had basically unlimited sustain.

These are just two examples of fun pet class designs from the past. The best the FFXIV Summoner ever got was the Titan tank pet, and that was so janky, it never got really fun to play with -- but it was still my main job in ARR and HW, because it came closest to what I liked in other games.

We have a pet job that's been squeezed into the narrow boxes this game has, and after 8 years of no direction and the first decent rework, it's still a clunky, lacklustre peice of gameplay.
Pet jobs just don't work in this systemn that's why Beastmaster needs to be something different to justify it's inclusion.

It should be a limited job that works to expand the companion system.
The Companion Chocobo is the best pet system in the game, if Beastmaster could add more to this system it would not only be a great limited job in it's own right, but it could expand gameplay options for all jobs by way of giving us additional companion creatures.
Beastmaster could tame them, and bring them into duties as it's unique selling point, while every other job could still use them in world zones just like the chocobo.

I'd rather not watch another job I'd like to play get shunted into Limited Job status like BLU did. When BLU first released back in SB it was 20 levels below cap, barred from doing PoTD, and was relegated to playing old content. It took until Shadowbringers for their level cap to get raised to 60 and later on 70.

Who's to say SE wouldn't do the same to BST and cap them at 50 on release and have them run the same ancient content that's been ingame for 8 years now when the current cap is 90 now?

I'd rather not spend any resources adding pokemon style limited Beastmaster when after 8 years Summoners still don't have Ramuh, Leviathan, Shiva, or Alexander. I'd much rather it be a full job even if that means a smaller quantity of better monsters to call on. Hunter with animal pet is a pretty standard trope in many video games, there is no reason why that has to be so "special" as to be locked out of the most relevant and current content this game has to offer.

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Originally Posted by Shironeko_Narunyan

They can also experiment with new ideas with limited jobs, and something like Beastmaster, for example, could be as unbalanced as BLU, and people would be happy about it, not angry.

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In what universe? The moment it gets announced as unlimited the entire fanbase will toss it in the bin.

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Originally Posted by Mezzoforte

please no. no more limited jobs. real jobs that are different from what we currently have. i dont understand the obsession with limited jobs and jobs that are just reskins of current jobs.

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The focus is the required balance. It'd be exceptionally difficult to maintain the semblance of balance the game currently has if jobs like BLU were allowed into the foray. Not impossible, but it'd end up involving nerfing practically everything that makes BLU unique. That would also result in devaluing many spells even further into oblivion.

The beauty (and severe detriment) of limited jobs is that they can just do whatever they fuck they want. Balance essentially means next to nothing. It's its own content and they can create story quests and so on to their hearts content.

For one reason or another though, BLU is still treated the same way that a lot of old content was when they were introduced. Kind of half-assed, but certainly more effort put into place than others (e.g. Squadrons). A lot of the "issues" with BLU come from the fact it's so heavily limited in content, be it because of the lengthy time of being very low on level cap (doesn't have to be current) or because it can't access other areas it'd be fun to use it for even in smaller pre-mades (24-man raids). The same would likely happen for any other limited job, so while I wouldn't say no to BST as a limited job, I am also going to look at it the same "meh" way I do BLU due to its level and content limitations.

I’ll admit that I wouldn’t want it to be a limited job. Would love to have Lyon, Pagaga, and Clarricie in the job quest though. :)
With Lyon as our mentor perhaps.

I'm all for another limited job option, so long as it's sufficiently weird to set itself apart from BLU.

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Originally Posted by Mezzoforte

please no. no more limited jobs. real jobs that are different from what we currently have. i dont understand the obsession with limited jobs and jobs that are just reskins of current jobs.

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They can't be very creative with "normal jobs" since those have to fit the trinity and throughput based paradigm.

They should first concentrate on making the majority of dps jobs fun to play. Because when I need a special mouse+perfectly worked out keybinds + still an addon on top of it then there’s a problem.

WoW has learned that more buttons don’t equal more fun.

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Originally Posted by Kandraxx

WoW has learned that more buttons don’t equal more fun.

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Funny how the game actually became less fun around the same time they started to heavily prune abilities, also funny how they backpedalled on that stance with the last expansion and added a bunch of those removed abilities back into the game.

I don't know why beast master has to be limited like its clearly not like Blue mage in any sense
and even if it was what would they do? copy paste blue mage formula making blue less unique?just lord of verminion 2?

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Originally Posted by Duskane

I don't know why beast master has to be limited like its clearly not like Blue mage in any sense
and even if it was what would they do? copy paste blue mage formula making blue less unique?just lord of verminion 2?

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The issue is how the pet would work.

Does the Beastmaster get one pet that functions as an integral part of a strict rotation? Fine, normal job.

But if as many expect, Beastmaster is about using multiple pets that do different things, or taming pets yourself in the wild, then that's not going to work outside a limited job.

There's a reason why SMN has been pruned back to what it is today, and why summons aren't real pets anymore, they're just an extension of you that visually appears as a separate entity.