I was hoping that we would be able to duo Trusts, and players could use it as a teaching tool to help other players, or just being able to play with people who has issues with grouping in big parties, and want to go at a slower pace.
Oh wells.
I had hopes, but does not look like it will happen.
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09-19-2021, 06:25 AMWavaryenI had hopes, but does not look like it will happen.
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09-19-2021, 06:43 AMBacent
Trusts each have their own levels that vary depending on the player. Who would get the EXP to their trusts if one is a higher level than the other?
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09-19-2021, 07:10 AMWavaryenQuote:
Originally Posted by Bacent
The party leader but trust are so easily level now. That i don't think this matters. -
09-19-2021, 07:58 AMBacentThey are easy to level 'for now'. They can go up to level 90 in 6.0 so the system would be grandfathered in, same for any other expansions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wavaryen
A lot of people wouldn't like joining because they're missing out on the EXP.
There's other things that can be said, but I don't think this matters.
Plus with you saying 'just being able to play with people who has issues with grouping in big parties, and want to go at a slower pace' you're literally just saying what a party with trusts do. -
09-19-2021, 08:04 AMWavaryenQuote:
Originally Posted by Bacent
Again it is not about the exp it is about able to use the tools to teach players, or for people who just want to duo the content with friends.
Trust can be more than just a solo tool, and you can always level them up in your own time. I see no reason why duos can't be added to the system. Being able to have an extra tool to teach players with would be great.
Like even if the duo members get no trust xp. I know many people would still like to duo it. Even with less loot. Just being able to do content with a friend. -
09-19-2021, 08:55 AMDinahDemiurge
Trusts should be removed completely
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09-19-2021, 09:20 AMWavaryenQuote:
Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge
Yes something that helps players, and could be improved to be even better should be removed.
Please enlighten us why you have a wrong take? -
09-21-2021, 07:27 AMWavaryen
Well i guess the bad take did not have an answer for it. I'm just going to add to this.
Trusts are fine, it gives some extra lore about the place with your team, and npc talking. It is pretty neat system. Adding on to it, letting players duo them would not break the balance. If someone has problems with a fight. They could get help with learning it. They also giving up trust exp and extra loot. So that would balance it. -
09-21-2021, 07:30 AMBaxcel
This was a combat live letter.. trusts would fall under a system update which is the live letter were getting in Nov(I think that's what they said) please look forward to it
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09-21-2021, 07:34 AMWavaryenCool thank you for this. I still have some hope.Quote:
Originally Posted by Baxcel
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09-21-2021, 07:38 AMNishira
I’ve been curious about that myself, why you can join squadrons and trusts on your own but not with two players. I think it’s a great tool and there are days where I’d be happy to do a dungeon with my partner and two non-player dps. I’d probably do more dungeons then. On the other hand, I might join DF less. I’m curious whether that is part of the reasoning not to, but then again… those going solo with their AI friends aren’t in there either. It’s a bit of a mystery to me.
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09-21-2021, 10:21 AMIscah
From memory I think they said it's about how the trust AI works and how they prioritise you for healing and such. Apparently they would get confused with two players or something.
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09-21-2021, 12:45 PMStormfur
I like the Trust system. I use it to try out dungeons for the first time and get an idea of how mechanics work. I just wish we could go do Stormblood dungeons with them.
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09-21-2021, 01:06 PMVahlnirThancred clearly wasn't pulling fast enough. Seriously Thancred, you run right into danger 99.9% of the time with 0 regard for anyone's safety, especially your own, just to make yourself look like a cool kid. Why do you choose dungeons to be cautious?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wavaryen
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09-21-2021, 02:23 PMCaptainLagbeard
Three things I do want from the Trust NPCs
Now that we have enough of them to form a coherent Full Party, regardless of the player's role, the ability to do MSQ trials with them.
A button to tell them to attack a specific target. (Mostly to tell Thancred to pull instead of you having to do it)
And the AI to not completely stop everything during mechanics. -
09-21-2021, 05:04 PMDoru_NintendanThe second and third things do sound nice, but I really don't think the trust trial runs sound like a good idea. The trusts are good for dungeons, due to how little HP enemies and even bosses have in them, plus it's easier on mechanics than a Trial. Trials are more bloated and have more mechanics to them, and if trusts act like they normally do, then the trials would take far longer than anyone would like.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard
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09-21-2021, 08:19 PMLiam_HarperI hope not. If people run DF less to the point that queues suffer, that's DF's problem and for whatever reason it's just not as enjoyable. Restricting us from the enjoyable activity to populate the unenjoyable one wouldn't be good design.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nishira
Personally I think there's no big risk of that though. Trusts are slow (although they shouldn't be that slow). Squadrons exist too and queues are fine. You also can't do roulettes with Trusts. -
09-21-2021, 09:25 PMKaoru_NagisaThat's why you pull the extra mobs onto him!Quote:
Originally Posted by Vahlnir
Seriously, it's baffling to me how trusts can handle big pulls better than a lot of players lol. I'm planning to stick to trusts for dungeoneering on my new alt, simply because I've never really leveled them on other characters and thought it'd be fun to this time on my designated "Warrior of Light"; yesterday in Holminster I tested how big of pulls they could handle when I'm not the one healing, and boy... Alphinaud can heal G'raha up easily then squeeze some DPS out, and he doesn't even have a full SCH kit.
They are still much slower than real players, obviously, but also less of a headache usually. It's a fun system if only for being able to feel like you're fighting alongside your fellow Scions.
I echo the sentiment for these two wishes in particular. Don't really want them for trials though, and I don't think their AI as it is now could work well for those. But giving an Engage button like squadrons have, and figuring out a way for them to not drop everything - healing, dpsing, etc - during mechanics or avoiding AoE would be amazing.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard
I remember too many a time when Urianger just lets someone die because he won't heal while he's repositioning for something...
Honestly I feel like they may have plans to eventually expand it down to that. Many times in Stormblood, you're often with at least 3 other people when a dungeon crops up. It'd be easy to give whoever is with you at those points as Trusts, I'd think; plus it'd serve to bridge that gap from 60 to 70 where you don't have squadrons but can't do Trusts yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormfur
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09-21-2021, 11:24 PMHurlstoneIts not a perfect system, but I honestly I think Trusts where one of the bets things added into Shadowbringers. They allow you to learn a dungeon in real-time, without having to watch a vid before hand. Plus not having to que saves time and allows you to continue the story at ones own pace. Finally, I think its neat that we actually get to do these with the story characters in toe. I really like how they add extra dialogue in (Going through Holminster Switch with Alisaie makes it much more impactful) too.Quote:
Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge
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09-22-2021, 05:32 AMSkyCake
I'm pretty much down for any solo content being more accessible by multiple people in an MMO.
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09-22-2021, 05:41 AMTheMightyMollusk
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09-22-2021, 05:58 AMCeridwenae
Would've liked this as a thing, too. Off-the-cuff, I'm of the opinion that it's beneficial in MMOs to have scaling content + AI to plug shortfalls as standard - whether that's workable in this game is a different story. If
this is the case, sounds like the spaghetti got in the way again. I don't mind saying, although it makes me sound unnecessarily bitter, I'm going to do my best in future not to fall for another game that has more experience with pasta than my local Italian restaurant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iscah
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09-22-2021, 05:58 AMDPZ2Um, you mean you don't inch closer to the mobs until he's within target range and auto-pulls?Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard
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09-22-2021, 08:07 AMNishiraThank you for explaining :) That’s a bit of a bummer because it sounds as if, even if they were open to the option, they still couldn’t implement it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iscah
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09-22-2021, 09:22 AMTaleraRistain
Yeah this is my number 1 desire for Trusts because it would get my husband back to play with me again.
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09-22-2021, 09:27 AMWavaryenQuote:
Originally Posted by TaleraRistain
Ya, for me I could duo with this older lady who does not enjoy groups because of how fast they play.
Or friends who have trouble with a fight we could go in and duo it.
If they can get around the Ai issues, being able to duo (even if you limit it to dps duo.) would be a huge step forward with trusts. -
09-22-2021, 02:46 PMUnholychinchillaI just run in and start swinging, he grabs aggro quick enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by DPZ2
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09-22-2021, 02:56 PMCaptainLagbeardYou CAN do that, but it would be much better to just be able to tell him to go in.Quote:
Originally Posted by DPZ2
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09-22-2021, 03:11 PMIscahI don't think it would, really.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard
You'd have to stop and issue the order instead of just running in. Thancred will immediately rush past you and grab the enemies' attention, so it doesn't matter if you briefly go first. -
10-06-2021, 12:33 AMAshelI also have hopes on this subject!
I like to play with my wife or my son or daughter. Not always are they always online at the same time. I would love to see the option of having two or three people in a party with the extra slots filled by trust/trusts. Its cool to spend time with the family in game and this would give us more flexibility. SE, please review this!
Thanks,
Ash -
10-06-2021, 12:39 AMSnorkyNoQuote:
Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge
10/charcs -
10-06-2021, 05:12 AMLunalepsy
No hope around these parts!
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10-06-2021, 05:15 AMKyrj
I just want Trust NPCs to use AoEs. That is all. If they add duos awesome, but yeah AoEs.
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10-06-2021, 05:46 AMKaoru_NagisaI believe they mentioned somewhere that they don't AoE specifically so that they aren't a replacement for real players. I basically have given up on them adding AoE capabilities to the Trusts, and simply ask for some more fine tuning to their AI - maybe allow them to keep attacking when moving, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyrj
Or just an "Engage" button to make pulling less annoying when you aren't playing tank.
Ideally, I'd love to see them expand to have a sort of customizable Gambit system - but that's probably even less likely than them programming Trusts to AoE. -
10-06-2021, 06:06 AMShougun
Being able to group up with trusts, squadrons, or what have you, would be really cool. Or like if a queue has gone on for a long time the game may just be like "we can start you with trusts and you can let a player drop in if you want?". Similarly how to Diablo 3 you have a companion that will be with you until a player joins. This way if someone drops you might have a trust replace them shortly, allow your time to continue, and when they get back they can take their slot back (for content that can accept them, naturally Ultimate is going to laugh at you if you tried to bring in a trust member).
Also would love to see their progression mechanic change. I feel there are a number of issues with the level system currently since it doesn't add much in the way of enjoyable value, acts as a simple gate, but also has consequence that the older the gate gets the more frustrating using them again (after MSQ) would be. Level 100, trusts still level 70. Dead in the water like feeling. Of course they can give them 1,000% exp bonus or something but.. ... .. bleh? lol. I think it would be better if they scale to your level but have improvement quests and such that can take them from barebones functional to "nice!". Akin to how squadrons work (also I really dislike their current progression given the fact that squadrons have such a strong progression system while trusts are simply gates, maxed out squadron is super strong, maxed out trust is just open doors). Bioware/skryim-y quests with progression, merit system, choices, what have you. Just not a fan of the issue implications, and issues already, with the current system. Though I understand some of it was to disincentivize trusts from real players but I feel squadrons didn't ruin DF and they're certainly, imo, more interesting to progress than trusts - so I think they went too hard on plain / nerf. -
10-07-2021, 05:16 AMStormfur
I really like trusts. They help me with my tanxiety to learn a dungeon until I feel comfortable tanking it. I just wish they'd let us do stormblood dungeons with trusts too.
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10-09-2021, 07:57 AMSturmChurro
I pride myself on never doing a trust once, so my characters have no gained exp. :cool:
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10-09-2021, 08:43 AMShougunI like they make audio comments in theme to the content, it's just a bit more.. 'in tune' imo then, so I've tried them once each new content. I also believe the potential is pretty neat too, very fine control of the story- it feels a lot more curated experience (imo) and in some places you're playing a nice quality sRPG yet at the same time you get a living world and can then upgrade to that special DF AI ( ;) ) when you're in the mood. It's like in dark souls you get NPC invasions which is great, and honestly I wish there were more when offline, because sometimes you're not in the mood for either the god of video gaming to rofl stomp you or the cheater.. who is.. cheating.. so yeah.. lol. Yet I've also had a lot of fun as a sunbro and weeooweeooo blue boi, I can't bring myself to go red lol.. though I did have less guilty fun as the rat covenant.Quote:
Originally Posted by SturmChurro
Of course I've not used the system after that as I find the progression mechanic disappointing (obviously per my other comments lol), and by that I don't simply mean "it's not a merit system / sphere / blah" whatever ideas I've suggested so far (waah it's not my preferred progression system). I mean generally conceptually I don't find it exciting because the payoff is a on the 'meh scale'. Unlike squadrons where the payoff are these beasts that while a bit dumb lol can crank out power well worth their progressing (I understand beasts with good AI might be such a great proposition for some players it impacts DF more than they want, but currently I think they went too far in the conservative realm).