Prohibited Behaviour

There are obviously many new players joining the game and i wondered if players know about the prohibited behavior and the chat rules the game has. Since they are basically really hidden and i can imagine not many players ever read them.

For example, standing with a giant mount on a quest npc is against the rules. Same as spamming actions in hubs like holy.

I have the feeling not many players actually know about all these rules and even some veteran players are puzzled when i bring them up.

Would like to hear your opinion on these rules, if you think they might be too harsh or if you like them as they are. And i also would like to know if you ever heard of these rules before.

>Link to the rules<

For player effects I've turned down everyone's effects but my party, makes combat a lot cleaner looking- and you can hear spam but you'll not really see it. Not a comment on the rule, but just thought some people might like that one.

As for the mounts, of course it's annoying when people cover npcs but also sometimes I can tell it wasn't really on purpose. Particularly the big mounts it's like you go from too far to talk to the npc to your entire mount is running over the npc lol. Being hyper aggressive on that rule might lead to some unintentional victims I think. Of course we have seen people go overboard I think Asmon was a recent obvious example.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

For player effects I've turned down everyone's effects but my party, makes combat a lot cleaner looking- and you can hear spam but you'll not really see it. Not a comment on the rule, but just thought some people might like that one.

As for the mounts, of course it's annoying when people cover npcs but also sometimes I can tell it wasn't really on purpose. Particularly the big mounts it's like you go from too far to talk to the npc to your entire mount is running over the npc lol. Being hyper aggressive on that rule might lead to some unintentional victims I think. Of course we have seen people go overboard I think Asmon was a recent obvious example.

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I agree with you on that, especially on patchdays etc. it's basically natural that players stand everywhere especially with their huge mounts. It just amazed me that players don't know about all these things, which is in my opinion SEs fault, they never really push the rules into your face so that you have to read them.

But they enforce them, as we saw with Asmongolds streamsnipers. I also know some players which got banned for spamming bluemage spells in hubs. It's crazy that people hear about these rules for the first time when it's already too late for them.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

standing with a giant mount on a quest npc is against the rules. <

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Hold x and you click right through them to the NPC.
A player doesn't have the ability to permanently prevent anyone from going about their business.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Hold x and you click right through them to the NPC.
A player doesn't have the ability to permanently prevent anyone from going about their business.

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Yeah. Players can't cover NPC's to prevent access. Atleast they cant for PC players. Dunno if an input command like that is built into Playstation controller layout.

The only NPC related progess block was stuff like Raubhan and Pippen EX...

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Yeah. Players can't cover NPC's to prevent access. Atleast they cant for PC players. Dunno if an input command like that is built into Playstation controller layout.

The only NPC related progess block was stuff like Raubhan and Pippen EX...

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Console players just hit the X button, and it targets the npc. Assuming, of course, that you are close and facing the npc.

Most of the chat rules seem to come down to "Be polite, be a decent human being". You know, things that really shouldn't be that difficult for people. Things that really shouldn't need to be spelled out.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Hold x and you click right through them to the NPC.
A player doesn't have the ability to permanently prevent anyone from going about their business.

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True BUT that's not the point. The point is that players who stand with a fat elephant on a quest npc risk to get reported for that. Doesn't matter for SE i guess if it can be prevented through stuff if someone takes offense in multiple players just standing around with their lunarwhales they could report them.

So as long as these rules exist that is always a risk. That's why i wanted to know if players actually know these rules, since most players i know never heard of them but i know some of them are actually often enforced. Like the holy spam in hubs.

Too harsh rules. Chairman rules but even stricter.
I don't do rule breaking but I don't condone someone getting banned for not walking on eggshells

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Originally Posted by Jin-

Too harsh rules. Chairman rules but even stricter.
I don't do rule breaking but I don't condone someone getting banned for not walking on eggshells

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Sounds like a fair opinion. Maybe SE wanted to literally have every little thing covered so "offending" players can't just say that it wasn't in the rules but i also feel they are a bit too harsh.

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Originally Posted by Jin-

Too harsh rules. Chairman rules but even stricter.
I don't do rule breaking but I don't condone someone getting banned for not walking on eggshells

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There are no eggshells, and there is really only one rule.

Don't be a dick.

The long list of rules is just there for the special kids in the class.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

For example, standing with a giant mount on a quest npc is against the rules. Same as spamming actions in hubs like holy.

>Link to the rules<

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"This means using chat (including Quick Chat and Emote) to obstruct another person's conversation" this is the vaguest rule ever. What counts as obstruct another persons behavior? As I see it a person has to actually have a public conversation (one anyone can read) and another person has to deliberately spam an action to flood the chat.

People excessivly using emotes in a city hub is not doing this. Is it usrd excessivly? Yes. Its a flooding the chat to obsecure a conversation? No.

Secondly what conversation does this apply too? If one uses a lot of emotes while you are in a tell, linkshell or FC chat does it really count? Cause that person is unaware what conversations you have in private.

The rules have to be vague, if not players will get as close to breaking them as possible without actually breaking them so they can cause problems without getting in trouble.

Double edged sword, now people who want to complain will complain and overreact about people breaking rules eventho they technically arent breaking the rules.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

There are obviously many new players joining the game and i wondered if players know about the prohibited behavior and the chat rules the game has. Since they are basically really hidden and i can imagine not many players ever read them.

For example, standing with a giant mount on a quest npc is against the rules. Same as spamming actions in hubs like holy.

I have the feeling not many players actually know about all these rules and even some veteran players are puzzled when i bring them up.

Would like to hear your opinion on these rules, if you think they might be too harsh or if you like them as they are. And i also would like to know if you ever heard of these rules before.

>Link to the rules<

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You are correct, i am one of those new players you mentioned. I had no idea about these rules. Not that i engage in such behaviour, watching cutscenes takes about %73 of my play time :D.

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Originally Posted by Juun

"This means using chat (including Quick Chat and Emote) to obstruct another person's conversation" this is the vaguest rule ever. What counts as obstruct another persons behavior? As I see it a person has to actually have a public conversation (one anyone can read) and another person has to deliberately spam an action to flood the chat.

People excessivly using emotes in a city hub is not doing this. Is it usrd excessivly? Yes. Its a flooding the chat to obsecure a conversation? No.

Secondly what conversation does this apply too? If one uses a lot of emotes while you are in a tell, linkshell or FC chat does it really count? Cause that person is unaware what conversations you have in private.

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Well it is under SE rules and i also saw people for that stuff getting suspended. Spamming emotes even tho you can turn them off is a bannable offense. Which is not that weird, every decent human being should know that you don't have to click laugh thousand times in a row and if so turn the chat messages off.

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Originally Posted by Ligier

You are correct, i am one of those new players you mentioned. I had no idea about these rules. Not that i engage in such behaviour, watching cutscenes takes about %73 of my play time :D.

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This is actually nice to know, i was really curious to hear it from a new players perspective! And yeah no way nowdays to offend others in cutscenes. Back then Gaius was always massreporting players for skipping his monologue.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

Well it is under SE rules and i also saw people for that stuff getting suspended. Spamming emotes even tho you can turn them off is a bannable offense. Which is not that weird, every decent human being should know that you don't have to click laugh thousand times in a row and if so turn the chat messages off.

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Like I said what is spamming in this case? If someone uses an emote every minute and no one talks in general chat for 20minutes then your chat box is also filled with 20 laugh emotes in a row. All you gotta do then is put in a report oh look at that spam my entire chat box is filled.

With vague rules like this anyone can bend it to strenghten their argument in their favour.

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Originally Posted by Juun

Like I said what is spamming in this case? If someone uses an emote every minute and no one talks in general chat for 20minutes then your chat box is also filled with 20 laugh emotes in a row. All you gotta do then is put in a report oh look at that spam my entire chat box is filled.

With vague rules like this anyone can bend it to strenghten their argument in their favour.

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That is true, i have the feeling most western players need really a fully specified rules book with everything covered to be a decent human being. I mean who could imagine that spamming /laugh as fast as i can for 5 minutes straight is a nuke for other players chats and especially console players who have the worst time of their life since they can't scroll that easily.

But i also think most offending players aren't reported cause yeah other players, me included, don't take offense in it. If someone calls me a mashed popoto if i again hit the floor as dragoon and then spams fifty times laugh on my sad corpse i just shrug it off. xD

But this isn't really about me here. There are people out there who will eventually hit the report button. And all i want is for others is to stay safe and don't lose their accounts. So i tell players and especially sprouts often about these rules so they are aware, not cause i benefit from it in any way.

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Originally Posted by Juun

Like I said what is spamming in this case? If someone uses an emote every minute and no one talks in general chat for 20minutes then your chat box is also filled with 20 laugh emotes in a row. All you gotta do then is put in a report oh look at that spam my entire chat box is filled.

With vague rules like this anyone can bend it to strenghten their argument in their favour.

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Except that a GM can put up a time stamped chat that is why you are asked to provide time and date and area. It is vague for a reason if you read those rules it is up to the GM to make the final determination if rules were broken and what punishment will be. They are strict apparently some people cant control themselves so they have to be. I am all for strict rules if it keeps people civil to each other.

most rules are created in the fairy tail assumption that people online have both common sense and respect for other players.

On the internet, this is generally not the case, so they are vague in the sense that a GM can determine if a behaviour is disruptive or harassing and act accordingly, and have their decision covered. If they were laid out in a rock solid manner, there are those people who would push it to the limit and then proudly say "well, I didnt do exactly this.. so its fine... you cant touch me".

I dont mind strict enforcement, but its impossible to come up with a codified laid out list of rules for player that wouldnt involve hundreds of pages to wade through since we all know at least someone that would push it to the brink just to take advantage of a loophole.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Yeah. Players can't cover NPC's to prevent access. Atleast they cant for PC players. Dunno if an input command like that is built into Playstation controller layout.

The only NPC related progess block was stuff like Raubhan and Pippen EX...

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It's not necessarily about targeting. Players were recently banned for obstructing Asmongold's experience by parking whale mounts on top of NPCs so that he couldn't even see the NPC at all. How can you target or get close to something that's hidden? Randomly walking around the room spamming 'X' or 'tab' until you hit upon a target that should have been readily visible is no fun. The ability to work around someone's obnoxiousness doesn't excuse their obnoxiousness.

This thread smells to me like someone 'playing police.'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR6A7R8Jqr0

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Originally Posted by TTiscancer

There are no eggshells, and there is really only one rule.

Don't be a dick.

The long list of rules is just there for the special kids in the class.

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There definitely are eggshells if someone can get banned for telling someone to play their class or pull their weight. Or vote kicking person like that.
That is walking on eggshells.

There is clear difference being a dick or not being a dick. If someone gets frustrated with the healer spamming cure 1 only and tells them about it, with bad luck gets banned that i don't condone at all.
Dick would say, from the start, this piece of S healer. That's being a dick.

See what people write on reddit, there they actually push people to mass report people who skip cutscenes on dungeons and start bosses before someone has seen the cutscene. Not a nice move but worth getting a permanent mark on your account? Gimme a break.

My opinion on the matter is that SE isn't paying me to babysit their players.

So far I've never ran across anyone who behaved so badly that I felt compelled to report them. Maybe I've just been lucky but I certainly don't go out of my way to hunt down the misbehavers to report them. I do report the gold sellers as soon as they pop up in chat.

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Originally Posted by KitKatnip

My opinion on the matter is that SE isn't paying me to babysit their players.

So far I've never ran across anyone who behaved so badly that I felt compelled to report them. Maybe I've just been lucky but I certainly don't go out of my way to hunt down the misbehavers to report them. I do report the gold sellers as soon as they pop up in chat.

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A report for behavior doesn't result in a ban unless it's a repeating offense with actual proof. If anything the Karens out there making asinine or bogus reports are the ones that get banned eventually for attempted abuse of the system.

Sometimes the wrist slap of saying "don't curse in shout chat" is good enough. But you'll get people who just think they are above the rules and you shouldn't retaliate in-chat. Just kick/remove from party and report. No need to play GM.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

For player effects I've turned down everyone's effects but my party, makes combat a lot cleaner looking- and you can hear spam but you'll not really see it. Not a comment on the rule, but just thought some people might like that one.

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Related to this, if the noise spam is a problem, you can also adjust other player noise settings. I had to do this since the charge up sound from samurai's iajutsu was causing me to have massive headaches to the point that I couldn't even run content if a samurai was in the party at all. So if the sound of holy or whatever else is an issue for you in the cities, you can adjust that too.

I think many players are aware, they just don't believe people would report, and/or a GM would ban for it. I've gone over them many, many times on the forums, and stated that I would rather not take the risk in breaking any of them.

You get a warning? That's a permanent mark on your account. You get a strike? Your account is that much closer to being permanently banned.

There should also be a rule where if player agroes enemies and they cover a npc or teleportal that makes it impossible to click on.