Ivalice may not continue

Hello all,

Hope all is well. Came across this video about mentioned title.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjS58l7RPo0

What are your thoughts about it

Not really bothered.

Bozja was reasonably interesting, but I thought the Ivalice raids were pretty naff story-wise and relied way too much on being an existing fan.

So all in all I'm same as Sotaris, not really bothered.

Ok.

I'm surprised how long FF14 was able to keep Matsuno pulled away from his own projects/company to be honest.

While a more longform story told through narratively interconnected side content is conceptually interesting, I don't really care for the Ivalice stuff.

I didn't care for the Ivalice raid and its storyline back in Stormblood. (too many cutscenes with long explanations.)
However, I really enjoy the Bozja sidequest, and I would love to see it get a proper conclusion, with cutscenes and gameplay content.
Considering the fact the game still has a huge playerbase, and is financially healthy for SE, rushing the end of such a long quest in a poor fieldnote feels like a middle finger to the players who enjoyed this content. And to be honest, it makes me fear for the futur of FFXIV if developpers start to rush things that way.

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Originally Posted by Sotatsu

I didn't care for the Ivalice raid and its storyline back in Stormblood. (too many cutscenes with long explanations.)
However, I really enjoy the Bozja sidequest, and I would love to see it get a proper conclusion, with cutscenes and gameplay content.
Considering the fact the game still has a huge playerbase, and is financially healthy for SE, rushing the end of such a long quest in a poor fieldnote feels like a middle finger to the players who enjoyed this content. And to be honest, it makes me fear for the futur of FFXIV is developpers start to rush things that way.

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But then again they might have had more planned that ended up gutted due to covid and that they couldn't fit into the rest of their future content.

I dont mind. it is not like it was left dangling at part 2 of 3 in an expansion.

as has been pointed out, the Garleans are in a bit of disarray. hard to continue a story with a lead interested in firming up a power base to be emperor and staying in the hinterlands when they could go back home and try and grab power.

I liked the Stormblood aspects, Bosja was, hit and miss for me, possibly because it was tied to relic weapons, I dont know. it does not fill me with dread for the future, people just move on, it happens. They could have something come up even better, we dont know yet.

I am sure Urianger would have something sage and somewhat vague to add in for wisdom, but I am not him, thankfully lol

Praise cthulhu! Everything that writer touches turns to boring. I have not started the save the queen stuffs yet but holy cannoli were the Ivilace raid quests ARR levels of awful. Character after character just.. talking. Blah blah blah talk talk talk mrt fields blah blah my play blah blah some royalty and the plight of my people blah blah. First off! I do not know who the heck you even are! How about we talk pay first, I am from this little place called Ul'Dah and time is Gil.

Then in comes the dargon lady with her technobabble who like most of that writer's characters treats the WoL like they are dumb dumb. Yeah yeah yeah I know what auracite is and you could have just stated the crystal reflects ones desires and makes them reality. Simple. It did not take fifteen paragraphs and a research thesis. Has he never heard of the words "exposition dump" before? Also why is this man obsessed with banquets and wine? Not everything medieval is banquets and wine and nobles squabbling..

One more thing. The Dramathurge. He can go find the nearest primal and let it devour his soul or leap from the nearest airship. If I had any control over my warrior of light I would have turned that man inside out then used cure spells to keep him alive and in perpetual agony.

That's rude, I'm sad about it.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

and relied way too much on being an existing fan.

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I'm going to use this to make another of my unpopular opinions. I wish FFXIV would stop dragging things in from other FF games. It makes me, and I assume at least some others who this as the only FF game they have played feel a little "left out". Even if content is good, you still get that feeling because "oh this is a reference to FF ## and means blah blah blah". Well I could never get into old FF games and didn't play FF ##.

It's also annoying when you hear someone spout some lore point and ask where that's from and you get "oh it was that way in FF YY". Take Male Viera as an example, so many people spouting all this lore about them "oh it was this way in [whatever previous game they were in], so it's going to be that way in FFXIV"

It really does start pissing me off to hear that about half the content it seems like.

Make more original stuff, and less transplanted stuff so we all experience together without the people who have played every FF since the beginning of time knowing half the story.

I mean, SE has at least some awareness of it when they actually made a big deal about the new raids being FFXIV original. I mean think about that, they had to make an issue of that, in every other MMO that would be a given.

And this as an issue is going to grow as more non long time FF players are coming to the game.

Now I'm not against easter eggs and the like, but this has gone WAY beyond that.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

I'm going to use this to make another of my unpopular opinions. I wish FFXIV would stop dragging things in from other FF games. It makes me, and I assume at least some others who this as the only FF game they have played feel a little "left out". Even if content is good, you still get that feeling because "oh this is a reference to FF ## and means blah blah blah". Well I could never get into old FF games and didn't play FF ##.

It's also annoying when you hear someone spout some lore point and ask where that's from and you get "oh it was that way in FF YY". Take Male Viera as an example, so many people spouting all this lore about them "oh it was this way in [whatever previous game they were in], so it's going to be that way in FFXIV"

It really does start pissing me off to hear that about half the content it seems like.

Make more original stuff, and less transplanted stuff so we all experience together without the people who have played every FF since the beginning of time knowing half the story.

I mean, SE has at least some awareness of it when they actually made a big deal about the new raids being FFXIV original. I mean think about that, they had to make an issue of that, in every other MMO that would be a given.

And this as an issue is going to grow as more non long time FF players are coming to the game.

Now I'm not against easter eggs and the like, but this has gone WAY beyond that.

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That's kind of part of the point. It's a form of encouraging people to buy their other games and play them.

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Originally Posted by MiaShino

Praise cthulhu! Everything that writer touches turns to boring. I have not started the save the queen stuffs yet but holy cannoli were the Ivilace raid quests ARR levels of awful. Character after character just.. talking. Blah blah blah talk talk talk mrt fields blah blah my play blah blah some royalty and the plight of my people blah blah. First off! I do not know who the heck you even are! How about we talk pay first, I am from this little place called Ul'Dah and time is Gil.

Then in comes the dargon lady with her technobabble who like most of that writer's characters treats the WoL like they are dumb dumb. Yeah yeah yeah I know what auracite is and you could have just stated the crystal reflects ones desires and makes them reality. Simple. It did not take fifteen paragraphs and a research thesis. Has he never heard of the words "exposition dump" before? Also why is this man obsessed with banquets and wine? Not everything medieval is banquets and wine and nobles squabbling..

One more thing. The Dramathurge. He can go find the nearest primal and let it devour his soul or leap from the nearest airship. If I had any control over my warrior of light I would have turned that man inside out then used cure spells to keep him alive and in perpetual agony.

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While a lot of this post was really harsh IMO, I agree that Matsuno relies a lot on exposition dump and "tell, not show". And frankly I think that's bad writing.
The worst aspect of XII, for instance, is that everything remotely interesting after the escape from Rabanastre happens off-screen and is only told to us rather than shown.

You can introduce other FF stuffs or Neir things into FF14 without writing up two hundred page info dump. The build up for copied factory was lighthearted and most amusing! I enjoyed my interactions with the dwarves and how they called me a "fall guy patsy". Those two were amazing!

It did not require a synopsis of the events of Neir for me to understand what automata were or what was going on with 2B. Show do not tell is a thing.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

That's kind of part of the point. It's a form of encouraging people to buy their other games and play them.

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Except it's not going to work on most people. People who have no nostalgia for the old games aren't going to feel a need to go buy dated games. Also, many people just don't like the gameplay in older FF games, they don't like turn based combat, and they aren't interested in dated graphics.


EDIT: If anything, I'd say it's a cheap ploy to use nostalgia to make people like the content. Also, transposing existing content is easier than making completely original stuff.

There are so many interesting side stories they could create to expand on the world we have already experienced . Perhaps make them beast tribes related , give them some screen time , explain some of their existence and show some of the leaders , reasons for why the feel so desperate, rather than just being cannon fodder for WoL at certain plot points .

There are even human pirate factions we never see again once arr/arr job quests are done , one of which plotted to and nearly destroyed Limsa during one of the job quest chains . Factions large enough to be able to try and pull that off arent just goons on a map stood still waiting for a WoL.exe clicker to comer along and kill them for xyz quest to kill xyz pirates.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

I'm going to use this to make another of my unpopular opinions. I wish FFXIV would stop dragging things in from other FF games. It makes me, and I assume at least some others who this as the only FF game they have played feel a little "left out". Even if content is good, you still get that feeling because "oh this is a reference to FF ## and means blah blah blah". Well I could never get into old FF games and didn't play FF ##.

It's also annoying when you hear someone spout some lore point and ask where that's from and you get "oh it was that way in FF YY". Take Male Viera as an example, so many people spouting all this lore about them "oh it was this way in [whatever previous game they were in], so it's going to be that way in FFXIV"

It really does start pissing me off to hear that about half the content it seems like.

Make more original stuff, and less transplanted stuff so we all experience together without the people who have played every FF since the beginning of time knowing half the story.

I mean, SE has at least some awareness of it when they actually made a big deal about the new raids being FFXIV original. I mean think about that, they had to make an issue of that, in every other MMO that would be a given.

And this as an issue is going to grow as more non long time FF players are coming to the game.

Now I'm not against easter eggs and the like, but this has gone WAY beyond that.

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It's a little ironic considering you are playing FF "14". A game series that has always been about constant themes. Crystals, Summons, moogles, chocobos, Cid, airships, warrior of light..

I understand the frustration, but knowing or not, it's part of what makes FF, FF.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

But then again they might have had more planned that ended up gutted due to covid and that they couldn't fit into the rest of their future content.

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I agree the pandemic didn't help, for sure. And I was totally okay with the development team delaying patchs to maintain the overall game quality at a good level without them having to endure crazy crunch hours.

But delaying patchs, and cutting the ending of a story like this, without facing its main antagonist, who has been teased for 2 years. I don't know... I don't buy it.

To me, it would've been better to just leave us with that last cutscene after the Dalriada raid, and keep the door open for a potential sequel after Endwalker (1, 2, 5 years later, I don't mind).
Gabranth's legion is no longer affiliated with Garlemald, so it was still possible for him to continue his crusade, even with the fall of the empire.
I don't know, it feels there were better ways to end this story aside from the fieldnote "conclusion". Even an optional 1v1 boss fight against Gabranth (like the one against Varis) in a single sidequest would've been better than this.



But well... it is what it is.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

Except it's not going to work on most people. People who have no nostalgia for the old games aren't going to feel a need to go buy dated games. Also, many people just don't like the gameplay in older FF games, they don't like turn based combat, and they aren't interested in dated graphics.

Also, saying it's basically just an ad for their older stuff is actually pretty insulting to the devs.

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Um, no. I'm sure the devs don't have that thin of a skin.
Besides, that's exactly how it works. It's a common tactic, and it's been done for decades. Yeah they do it out of passion for the franchise (most of the time) but it doesn't change the fact it's also done to incite interest in their other products. Same reason why FE took off in the west right after people got curious about who this Ike guy in Smash Bros Melee was.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

It's a little ironic considering you are playing FF "14". A game series that has always been about constant themes. Crystals, Summons, moogles, chocobos, Cid, airships, warrior of light..

I understand the frustration, but knowing or not, it's part of what makes FF, FF.

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None of those are the same as copying story elements whole sale.

Also, something FF fans are always quick to say is FF games are unrelated unless they are numbered XX-Y.

It's a real shame. I thought the Save the Queen story was some of the best storytelling present in FFXIV to date.

Matsuno handled Gabranth and his followers exceptionally well and the case of characters intrigued me far more than the Scions. That there were actually stakes and consequences present - as should be in the case in war - further appealed to me.

It's definitely dampened my enthusiasm for what the future may bring. I'm already a little wary that the current main story arc is due to end in 6.0.

I really enjoyed it so I think it's kind of a bummer that it won't continue. Anyone else feel they really waste interesting garlean characters?

This entire thing just felt so sad but also extremely frustrated me. The Ivalice story series was probably the most invested story i’ve been in for this mmo. Yes, even more than the msq. I’ve been looking forward since SB to get to have a 1 on 1 with Gabranth and either get to talk with him or at least have a trial with him. Instead, we get absolutely nothing in that regard, the bozja story is rushed and 90% of the actual plot line is thrown away off screen. It’s just extremely extremely lazy to me. Maybe if we didn’t have the horrible nier story and epilogue taking away resources we could’ve at least gotten an ending scene. This honestly doesn’t give me much hope for 6.0. The fact that they had to rush so much to try and fit everything in for this storyline and still weren’t able to fit 90% of it in is scary, considering we’re kind of dealing with the same stuff in 6.0 It was supposed to extend to 7.0 but they now made it 6.0 with no post patches to tie up the story. They’re just shoving it into 6.0 and that’s it. At this point if i see the same thing happen in 6.0 to the msq i’m done with this game.

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Originally Posted by hobostew

I really enjoyed it so I think it's kind of a bummer that it won't continue. Anyone else feel they really waste interesting garlean characters?

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It always felt to me the vast majority of Garlemald is treated with certain disdain. As if it's a "necessary plot device" they borrowed from the 1.X lore they hate so much. Which is why we're not even getting a proper wrap-up by actually going there to finish what we started. Instead they just have it implode off-screen...

Base 5.0, some of 5.3 and the Ivalice content have been the highlights so far of the game's story telling, so it is most unfortunate that it won't be continuing.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

It always felt to me the vast majority of Garlemald is treated with certain disdain. As if it's a "necessary plot device" they borrowed from the 1.X lore they hate so much. Which is why we're not even getting a proper wrap-up by actually going there to finish what we started. Instead they just have it implode off-screen...

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I suspect a part of the playerbase plays a role in this tbh. There were hints to it in SB when Ramza had mentioned how not all of Garlemald was bad, or rotten. A good amount of the playerbase absolutely lost their shit over that and was questioning SE lmao. People can’t stand Garlemald and just see it as such an evil thing so anything that even hints that there’s some good in it, they hate. I’ve given my thoughts in other threads but i don’t think Garlemald was ever meant to be destroyed or at least not this early. Since the arc was supposed to extend to 7.0, who knows how different the story would’ve been. Destroying Garlemald just seems like their lazy way to ease writing and tie up plot threads without putting actual work into it because who even knows. I feel for Matsuno because you can tell he isn’t happy about the news and it makes me wonder if they put insane limitations on him in Bozja since he tends to like darker stories and sacrifice. Two things SE doesn’t really like when it comes to the protagonist side of things.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

It's a little ironic considering you are playing FF "14". A game series that has always been about constant themes. Crystals, Summons, moogles, chocobos, Cid, airships, warrior of light.

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A game series that has also told a new story with each main game.

You haven't needed to know what happened in any previous main FF games to follow the plot of a new one, that should still be the case in XIV too.


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Originally Posted by KuroMaboroshi

Also, what a dark timeline to live in where Matsuno moves on from XIV without any fanfare and farewell, while Yoko Taro who gave us some of the worst writing in XIV in years is invited on for the next Live Letter.

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Despite my previous comments I do broadly agree with this.

As I said, I think Bozja was pretty decent, and while I wasn't personally a fan of the Ivalice raids I still wouldn't go so far as to say they were terrible or anything, at least the fans of XII and its spin-offs seem to really like the XIV stuff so it has that going for it.

The writing for the Nier raid was disappointing though, and I really like Automata. Even fans further down the rabbit-hole of the whole Nier series didn't really seem that enamored with the raids beyond enjoying getting the references.

Sure, Matsuno's contributions were exposition-heavy, but they added so much to the worldbuilding of XIV in fleshing out the IVth Legion and basically the entirety of southeastern Ilsabard and western Orthard. The non-lore story and character writing was nothing spectacular, but competent enough to be on par with the writing of other side quest and not stand out negatively. And concepts like the Field Notes I would absolutely love for the developers to also carry over to other content. While it is just an exposition dump, it is a great way to supplement information that's usually reserved for the Encyclopedias into the actual game.
Overall, I think his contribution has been a net positive for the game and as I was very much looking forward to the Dalmascan liberation they hinted at at the end of Bozja as involving the Warrior of Light. I will miss Matsuno's work for XIV. :(

Also, what a dark timeline to live in where Matsuno moves on from XIV without any fanfare and farewell, while Yoko Taro who gave us some of the worst writing in XIV in years is invited on for the next Live Letter.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

It always felt to me the vast majority of Garlemald is treated with certain disdain. As if it's a "necessary plot device" they borrowed from the 1.X lore they hate so much. Which is why we're not even getting a proper wrap-up by actually going there to finish what we started. Instead they just have it implode off-screen...

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I get the same impression to an extent, though I do not think it is intentional so much as a grim realisation from the development team that no matter what they do with Garlemald there's a sizeable portion of unhinged FFXIV players who spend a significant amount of time and energy attacking anyone who likes Garlemald on Twitter, Reddit and this site's very own lore forum.

More than once I've seen a simple compliment of Varis, Gaius or Regula turn into accusations of supporting 'fascism', 'genocide' and 'murder'. I've even had death threats sent my way over it from time to time.

It isn't so much the case that Garlemald is unpopular, though. It has a lot of fans - though many of them are less vocal due to the above reasoning. When I role-played on Balmung, I encountered roughly a hundred different Garlean characters in either direct contact or passing.

To a similar degree, you see the same questionable attacks aimed at players who voice a fondness for the Ascians, especially Emet-Selch.

Ultimately, Yoshi-P claims to be a huge fan of the Ivalice games. Though I'd be lying if I said I was disappointed that the fondness apparently didn't extent to the point of making FFXIV's Empire go in a similar direction to FFXII's Empire. I always thought that game handled the 'Empire' trope exceptionally well, since it didn't destroy it - it reformed it.

I'm willing to wait and see what FFXIV does when it has a completely clean slate to work with, though I'd be lying if I said I wasn't already eyeing some of the upcoming MMO's as potential options to hop over to if they're good. Pretty much everything I liked about the game's lore is due to wrap up with 6.0 and the push to have every in-game nation and race conform to the same set of ideals makes for a rather dull and predictable low stakes story in my opinion.

For example, I really want to explore more of Hingashi but I don't want to see the Hingans lectured for daring to keep 'Ijin' at bay. So far, pretty much every nation we have visited has effectively been defanged and any grit eroded away almost completely.

Ishgard and Ala Mhigo included.

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Originally Posted by KuroMaboroshi

Sure, Matsuno's contributions were exposition-heavy, but they added so much to the worldbuilding of XIV in fleshing out the IVth Legion and basically the entirety of southeastern Ilsabard and western Orthard. The non-lore story and character writing was nothing spectacular, but competent enough to be on par with the writing of other side quest and not stand out negatively. And concepts like the Field Notes I would absolutely love for the developers to also carry over to other content. While it is just an exposition dump, it is a great way to supplement information that's usually reserved for the Encyclopedias into the actual game.
Overall, I think his contribution has been a net positive for the game and as I was very much looking forward to the Dalmascan liberation they hinted at at the end of Bozja as involving the Warrior of Light. I will miss Matsuno's work for XIV. :(

Also, what a dark timeline to live in where Matsuno moves on from XIV without any fanfare and farewell, while Yoko Taro who gave us some of the worst writing in XIV in years is invited on for the next Live Letter.

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I agree 100% with this post. With the latter, i didn’t even know he was invited...this is a dark timeline indeed. People can bash bozja all they want for incorporating 12 and tactics story into it and being exposition heavy, but at least it made sense and you were given the story in this game. That can’t be said for the Nier series, which is literal 100% fanservice. That raid series was honestly just a constant disappointment between the glams, the bosses, the storyline. The fact they’re having Yoko Taro of all people on there instead of one of their long time writers is tragic.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

I'm going to use this to make another of my unpopular opinions. I wish FFXIV would stop dragging things in from other FF games. It makes me, and I assume at least some others who this as the only FF game they have played feel a little "left out". Even if content is good, you still get that feeling because "oh this is a reference to FF ## and means blah blah blah". Well I could never get into old FF games and didn't play FF ##.

It's also annoying when you hear someone spout some lore point and ask where that's from and you get "oh it was that way in FF YY". Take Male Viera as an example, so many people spouting all this lore about them "oh it was this way in [whatever previous game they were in], so it's going to be that way in FFXIV"

It really does start pissing me off to hear that about half the content it seems like.

Make more original stuff, and less transplanted stuff so we all experience together without the people who have played every FF since the beginning of time knowing half the story.

I mean, SE has at least some awareness of it when they actually made a big deal about the new raids being FFXIV original. I mean think about that, they had to make an issue of that, in every other MMO that would be a given.

And this as an issue is going to grow as more non long time FF players are coming to the game.

Now I'm not against easter eggs and the like, but this has gone WAY beyond that.

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Unfortunately (for you), dragging in stuff from other FF games is what helped save FFXIV (1.x had none of those), and helped lead to the game being as big as it is today. Ivalice helped me drag in several of my friends who love FFT, Eden dragged in a friend who loves FF8, the Weapons helped convince a few friends who love FF7. Those references you hate so much help get people interested into this game, so there's no way in hell they'll ever stop.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I get the same impression to an extent, though I do not think it is intentional so much as a grim realisation from the development team that no matter what they do with Garlemald there's a sizeable portion of unhinged FFXIV players who spend a significant amount of time and energy attacking anyone who likes Garlemald on Twitter, Reddit and this site's very own lore forum.

More than once I've seen a simple compliment of Varis, Gaius or Regula turn into accusations of supporting 'fascism', 'genocide' and 'murder'. I've even had death threats sent my way over it from time to time.

It isn't so much the case that Garlemald is unpopular, though. It has a lot of fans - though many of them are less vocal due to the above reasoning. When I role-played on Balmung, I encountered roughly a hundred different Garlean characters in either direct contact or passing.

To a similar degree, you see the same questionable attacks aimed at players who voice a fondness for the Ascians, especially Emet-Selch.

Ultimately, Yoshi-P claims to be a huge fan of the Ivalice games. Though I'd be lying if I said I was disappointed that the fondness apparently didn't extent to the point of making FFXIV's Empire go in a similar direction to FFXII's Empire. I always thought that game handled the 'Empire' trope exceptionally well, since it didn't destroy it - it reformed it.

I'm willing to wait and see what FFXIV does when it has a completely clean slate to work with, though I'd be lying if I said I wasn't already eyeing some of the upcoming MMO's as potential options to hop over to if they're good. Pretty much everything I liked about the game's lore is due to wrap up with 6.0 and the push to have every in-game nation and race conform to the same set of ideals makes for a rather dull and predictable low stakes story in my opinion.

For example, I really want to explore more of Hingashi but I don't want to see the Hingans lectured for daring to keep 'Ijin' at bay. So far, pretty much every nation we have visited has effectively been defanged and any grit eroded away almost completely.

Ishgard and Ala Mhigo included.

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That's part of why I plan to leave after I finish 6.0.
Aside from gameplay changes that have not sat well with me, the points I care about in the main story are either getting wrapped up or never being revisited or expanded upon again (including a lot of stuff teased in 1.X and 2.X).

I criticised Matsuno's way of dumping exposition but I'm not trying to discredit the stories he makes themselves. I just don't like the means he does it sometimes.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

That's part of why I plan to leave after I finish 6.0.
Aside from gameplay changes that have not sat well with me, the points I care about in the main story are either getting wrapped up or never being revisited or expanded upon again (including a lot of stuff teased in 1.X and 2.X).

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I think this is the case for many people, myself and friends included. The stories we find interesting and well written are getting dropped in favor of the more popular yet dull plot lines and story elements like the constant amount of fluff in the game. After 6.0 there will be more interesting mmo’s out anyways, so i’m just biding time until then. This and 5.3 was the last straw for me personally.

Good. Ivalice was basically just a rehashed Tactics with a bare minimum of effort put in to fit into XIV, not to mention the fact they retconned Dalmasca's location from Ilsabard to Othard rubs me the wrong way. And Bozja's story was asinine. Stopped paying attention to it after the whole Misja or however you spell her name thing, not to mention the shit with Mikoto.

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Originally Posted by KuroMaboroshi

Also, what a dark timeline to live in where Matsuno moves on from XIV without any fanfare and farewell, while Yoko Taro who gave us some of the worst writing in XIV in years is invited on for the next Live Letter.

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While I don't care for either of their writing, it's pretty bad that we're going to have to suffer through yet more Yoko Taro before finally (hopefully) being done with him. Guy's probably going to drop some Just As Planned BS during the Live Letter that'll have his fanboys frothing harder at the mouth with their nonsense.

I thought Matsuno did a pretty excellent job at making everything that he brought to the table fit into FFXIV. It didn't just fit into the game world, it actively expanded on existing plot elements in a way that I found to be very intriguing.

Given that we hadn't even visited Othard until Stormblood, I didn't see the 'retcon' of Dalmasca's location to be that big of a deal. I'm reminded of the claim by some in regards to male viera where they supposedly should not have been added because of the 'integrity' of the lore. (Putting aside the fact that this supposed 'integrity' is rarely, if ever, applied fairly across the board.)

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Originally Posted by Wyssahtyn

Good. Ivalice was basically just a rehashed Tactics with a bare minimum of effort put in to fit into XIV, not to mention the fact they retconned Dalmasca's location from Ilsabard to Othard rubs me the wrong way.

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Sorry but i respectfully heavily disagree with this. The story was very obviously not the bare minimum. The man took the time to slowly world build and add lore of various types and regions within his own story, not to mention with Bozja he literally basically gave us a mini eorzea encyclopedia for free. He basically did a better job than most of the main story writers have done. As for the retconning, this is something constantly done in msq. They’ve already done it multiple times in ShB alone yet people seem to ignore that because the story is just “so amazing.” Ivalice isn’t any different if anything the retcon is less of a thing since there were many unknowns to begin with.

I feel like Ivalice was just half A$$ed.

The story of Ivalice should have been a full on expansion with the 24 man raids being a part of it. It would have been way better with voice acting. The problem is the content was trying to tell an engaging story with 0 voice acting and multiple cutscenes.

I did enjoy the content just because of nostalgia. But from a new player perspective who hasnt played FF12 I can see how the entire storyline could seem as a waste and very boring.

If they do decide to have us go save Dalmasca, please SE put it in an expansion and not behind relic. The Ivalice and Bozja storylines have suffered greatly because they are side content and not mainstream.

Maybe Matsuno should make the next FF MMORPG lol

Despite my opinions about his way of explaining things I'd be down.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

Maybe Matsuno should make the next FF MMORPG lol

Despite my opinions about his way of explaining things I'd be down.

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Honestly i’d love this option. He’d be less likely to give in to pandering to the community as well, He likes to write his own stories and doesn’t like to let anyone influence the outcome unlike what we’ve seen with msq over and over. I personally love his story themes and ideals so i’d be willing to give it a fair chance if it ever happened in the future for sure.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

Except it's not going to work on most people. People who have no nostalgia for the old games aren't going to feel a need to go buy dated games. Also, many people just don't like the gameplay in older FF games, they don't like turn based combat, and they aren't interested in dated graphics.

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It convinced me to go play FF3 to see how much of the Crystal Tower stuff was worked in and what was original to FFXIV.

On the other hand I have no desire to play the Ivalice games due to this. They don't feel integrated like CT, which wove into concepts introduced earlier in the story like the Allagan Empire. Ivalice feels like it comes in, sets up every bit of its history and geography brand new from scratch and wants you to absorb all of it before you can appreciate what's going on.

I very much enjoyed the Ivalice storyline and raids, so it's surprising to see how unpopular they were. Especially things like "half assed" when there's definitely more work put into it than Eureka or some of the older raids. It feels like it's one of those things that's trendy to hate because it's "not true to the original", but I could be wrong. Either way I enjoyed it.

I'm personally not a fan of unfinished storylines though. Bozja was clearly set up to continue with further story development. We had Hildebrand scrapped too when that was clearly set up to have a ShB arc and the United Beast tribe quest was scrapped. It's not a good sign. Story is meant to be the selling point of the game.

It's a matter of personal taste, really.

The Crystal Tower raids did nothing for me since I always found G'raha Tia to be a terrible character. I would have strongly preferred to work alongside Doga and Unei to a greater degree instead of seeing them unceremoniously cast aside to make way for this:

https://i.imgur.com/ZHlAmbK.gif

Matsuno's contributions to the story, however, greatly fleshed out Garlemald and allowed us to see much more of its better side than the MSQ's showed us - so I'm struggling to see where the claim of the Ivalice content having no connection to the main story elements is coming from. There's also a fair few links to other important lore elements, such as how Ultima can be tied to Hydaelyn, Mikoto giving us another look at what the Echo is capable of and much more.