Question about the 2.0 zones in Endwalker

Considering the trailer recently has this been addressed? Are the 2.0 areas going to have copies of these zones, but more like chaotic battlefields?

Or is the 2.0 areas going to have new extensions like a new La Noscea zone?

I was curious how Yoshi. P is going to go about this considering the threat level.

What do you mean?

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Originally Posted by Sotaris

What do you mean?

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Trailer suggested the 2.0 zones are going to hell in a handbasket, I was wondering if there is going to be a major change to reflect that?

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Originally Posted by Kaliesto

Trailer suggested the 2.0 zones are going to hell in a handbasket, I was wondering if there is going to be a major change to reflect that?

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Probably not, at least, nothing substantial, and what there is will almost definetely be instanced. As the existing zones have to remain as they are for new players just joining (this is why the Foundation of Ishgard has remained in ruins permenantly and was completely ignored by the Reconstruction effort - it needs to be so for the benefit of players just arrived that from their perspective have just arrived after the Horde ransacked the place).

Basically, never trust a trailer, they usually stylized at the very least.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Probably not, at least, nothing substantial, and what there is will almost definetely be instanced. As the existing zones have to remain as they are for new players just joining (this is why the Foundation of Ishgard has remained in ruins permenantly and was completely ignored by the Reconstruction effort - it needs to be so for the benefit of players just arrived that from their perspective have just arrived after the Horde ransacked the place).

Basically, never trust a trailer, they usually stylized at the very least.

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Doman Enclave?

I highly doubt they went through the trouble of adding flying to the zones in 5.3 if they were planning on substnatially changing anything in those zones in 6.0. So don't expect a Cataclysm style shakeup. Or even much content in them.

It'll more likely be that lore wise bad stuff is happening but the grand companies etc hold their ground while we're off stopping the end of the world. Kind of like in WoW how Legion was a big world invasion but you didn't really see changes to old world zones and the focus was on the new zones and putting an end to said invasion.

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Originally Posted by Bright-Flower

I highly doubt they went through the trouble of adding flying to the zones in 5.3 if they were planning on substnatially changing anything in those zones in 6.0. So don't expect a Cataclysm style shakeup. Or even much content in them.

It'll more likely be that lore wise bad stuff is happening but the grand companies etc hold their ground while we're off stopping the end of the world. Kind of like in WoW how Legion was a big world invasion but you didn't really see changes to old world zones and the focus was on the new zones and putting an end to said invasion.

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^This. It's pretty telling all you see in the trailer is the Eorzea Map on fire, with the only actual areas shown being devestated - as an entirelly new zone in Thavnair, and... the Floating City of Nym, which is a ruin in a far off part of the La Noscea map anyway and thus could easily be instanced as battle content (And Garlemald, which we've never even been to and only seen brief snippets of during the game so they can afford to obliterate it and replace it with Zenos's crazy tower of evil anyway).

I'm pretty confident to say that those hoping or expecting something like the 'Seventh Umbral Era' events in FFXIV 1.0 in EW... will most likely end up disappointed.

If the event from the trailer happens it will either be in a new area that resembles La Noscea, in an instance like how it was done when Rhalgr's Reach was on fire, or just some phasing that only you can see.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

If the event from the trailer happens it will either be in a new area that resembles La Noscea, in an instance like how it was done when Rhalgr's Reach was on fire, or just some phasing that only you can see.

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This seems most likely to me.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

If the event from the trailer happens it will either be in a new area that resembles La Noscea, in an instance like how it was done when Rhalgr's Reach was on fire, or just some phasing that only you can see.

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In a way they've already done with adding the towers after a certain point in the MSQ. If anything I agree with you it will be solo duties, just like in HW when we went through Halatali too. For Nym, well we already have a map they could use in the Leap of Faith map.

We might see skybox changes and background details like the towers, but actual changes to the old zones I don't expect to see.

Honestly I'm not even expecting the scene with the WOL/Alisae/Alph at the wanderer's palace to literally happen in the msq.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Probably not, at least, nothing substantial, and what there is will almost definetely be instanced. As the existing zones have to remain as they are for new players just joining (this is why the Foundation of Ishgard has remained in ruins permenantly and was completely ignored by the Reconstruction effort - it needs to be so for the benefit of players just arrived that from their perspective have just arrived after the Horde ransacked the place).

Basically, never trust a trailer, they usually stylized at the very least.

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They've already shown they can make adjustments to zones that are based off story or tasks you've completed, so this isn't entirely correct. For example when playing with my ex a few years back, his version of the Churning Mists was different from mine because he hadn't done the moogle beast tribe quests to rebuild the plaza while I had. Also they can do things like changing skyboxes, like how after Baelsar's Wall there's a different sky than before which lasts for a patch or two, and how even right now there are new elements in the distance that people who haven't reached the end of the current story line won't see.

Even just the shadowbringers zones have changes every time you defeat a light warden that change the zones for those who have progressed the story that far and those who have not.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

If the event from the trailer happens it will either be in a new area that resembles La Noscea, in an instance like how it was done when Rhalgr's Reach was on fire, or just some phasing that only you can see.

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Pretty sure this is the area around Nym and could just be Upper La Noscea. There already has been an undead-dragon type monster in the area (albeit they are not red and part of an event...), so I think it's safe to assume we'll see instanced bits..likely where the Coeurl are.

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Originally Posted by kaynide

Pretty sure this is the area around Nym and could just be Upper La Noscea. There already has been an undead-dragon type monster in the area (albeit they are not red and part of an event...), so I think it's safe to assume we'll see instanced bits..likely where the Coeurl are.

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I think that it's Outer La Noscea, but there is in fact a part of it that we can't access where the tower is. I think we already know where all of the new areas are though, so it would most likely be just some battle instance.

I'm with those saying the extent of what we'll likely see is at most sky box changes (as per Shadowbringers and the everlasting light as well as the meteor showers in 5.3), off map scenery changes (like the towers) and maybe a solo duty running through Floating city of Nym or the like).

But it's also possible most of the story will assume you're sticking to the new areas until you're done so won't see it. Sure it means if (for example) you go fishing in Lower La Nocsea you'll see a world that is noticeably not ending but at that point you're already putting your quest to stop the imminent apocalypse on pause to go fishing so, whatever.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Probably not, at least, nothing substantial, and what there is will almost definetely be instanced. As the existing zones have to remain as they are for new players just joining (this is why the Foundation of Ishgard has remained in ruins permenantly and was completely ignored by the Reconstruction effort - it needs to be so for the benefit of players just arrived that from their perspective have just arrived after the Horde ransacked the place).

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Not necessarily. Note Alexander, for instance. I could have sworn new players will not see him in Dravidian Hinterlands until they reach that part in their questline, regardless of how the zone appears to those who've already reached that part in the story. Foundation could have done much the same.

I don't think we'll be spending enough time in the La Noscea/Thanalan/Black Shroud zones for SE to remake them for 6.0. At most, we might have a solo instanced duty with the zones being instanced to handle the heavy traffic at launch.

If there was going to be an entirely new La Noscea zone, I would imagine it would have been unveiled at the Fan Fest.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Not necessarily. Note Alexander, for instance. I could have sworn new players will not see him in Dravidian Hinterlands until they reach that part in their questline, regardless of how the zone appears to those who've already reached that part in the story. Foundation could have done much the same.

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Right. The bubble is there but appears to be empty at first. Parts of Alexander don't appear until the 3.0 MSQ is completed and then another change when the player continues deeper into the raid quests. But most of the change occurs inside the bubble where players can't go (the spots where the "hands" appear for the raid portals being exceptions).

We do see changes to parts of zones for many of the beast tribes and Doman Enclave but other than Doman Enclave, those specific locations aren't part of MSQ or you're past the point where the location is relevant to the MSQ before you can unlock the beast tribe.

What changes we've seen that are directly related to MSQ have tended to be backdrop/skybox. It's likely to avoid continuity issues if friends are helping friends. It's still a problem in a few spots (the Magitek Shield Wall in Yanxia is an example) but I'm sure SE would prefer to limit those problem places.

Those spots that change were also created with that intent in mind, I don't know if they could so easily make it apply retroactively to areas built without that in mind.

Nor would it necessarily be worth it when the focus of the expansion will be on new zones.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Right. The bubble is there but appears to be empty at first. Parts of Alexander don't appear until the 3.0 MSQ is completed and then another change when the player continues deeper into the raid quests. But most of the change occurs inside the bubble where players can't go (the spots where the "hands" appear for the raid portals being exceptions).

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Ahh, shoot, yeah that makes the visuals largely irrelevant then, unless they could maintain the very same collision boxes (which, actually, could probably occur for most of the Foundation's mess).

Though I have to wonder why one of the newest MMOs has managed so little in regards to phasing that even far older MMOs have long since been capable of...

Heck, it's not like we couldn't greatly benefit from our quests being more than just "run from shiny right-click circle to purple punch-punch circle to shiny right-click circle" regardless...

In the Shadowbringers trailer we saw Y'shtola and Urianger watching Rak'tika Greatwood being destroyed like it's burning everywhere too, can't remember seeing that in the game later though. Perhaps things in the trailers don't necessarily exactly happen in the game.

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Originally Posted by TheVigilant

In the Shadowbringers trailer we saw Y'shtola and Urianger watching Rak'tika Greatwood being destroyed like it's burning everywhere too, can't remember seeing that in the game later though. Perhaps things in the trailers don't necessarily exactly happen in the game.

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We see the aftermath of that fire, it's that burnt out town at the start of the zone when you enter from Lakeland. So the events of the Shadowbringers trailer were in the time between the Scions arriving and the WoL arriving.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Ahh, shoot, yeah that makes the visuals largely irrelevant then, unless they could maintain the very same collision boxes (which, actually, could probably occur for most of the Foundation's mess).

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They can maintain the collision boxes. If you looked at the bubble between 3.0 and 3.3 there were a bunch of rocks jutting out that you could land and walk on, these rocks were removed and replaced by the external bits of Alexander after the cutscene where he stands up in 3.4.

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Originally Posted by Xiomara

We see the aftermath of that fire, it's that burnt out town at the start of the zone when you enter from Lakeland. So the events of the Shadowbringers trailer were in the time between the Scions arriving and the WoL arriving.

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Great, thanks for clarifying.

I'm not really expecting any of the zones to be drastically changed by the Final Days.

Even in the case of Thravnair which does actually fall victim to it judging from one of dungeon artworks and the opening, they could dodge around the issue by making the related dungeon take place on the side of the island that isn't visible from the zone.

Again, Doman Enclave. And the weird area in the Pixies' quest. Both areas you access that aren't instanced specifically for you and they change physically, down to not having the same collision boxes.

I don't think they will do it. But the fact is they can do it if they want to.

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Originally Posted by Xiomara

They can maintain the collision boxes. If you looked at the bubble between 3.0 and 3.3 there were a bunch of rocks jutting out that you could land and walk on, these rocks were removed and replaced by the external bits of Alexander after the cutscene where he stands up in 3.4.

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I didn't mean it in a technical sense, but rather a question of whether, say, fixing up Ishgard could be done effectively even when limited to just reskinning the sides of buildings, rubble piles, etc. Such would be a pretty large design constraint if, no matter the skins, the collision boxes must remain consistent for everyone.

They will likely get subtle transformations like the zones in Norvrandt, and how they sky and lighting changed based on story progression.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Though I have to wonder why one of the newest MMOs has managed so little in regards to phasing that even far older MMOs have long since been capable of...

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Might originally have been a PS3 issue. By now it's probably a design choice.

Playing through Icecrown during Wrath of the Lich King absolutely sucked due to phasing. You couldn't help friends unless you were both on the same quest. You couldn't help friends if had completed the quest already. There were multiple other phasing issues in WoW even after that ("sorry you feel to your death as we crossed over a zone where we weren't on the the same phase"). They did some tweaking on the worst of the problems but still it was generally a poor experience when what you can see and what your friends can see are 2 different things.

I'd rather not see it become a prominent feature. It's better left to single player games where it's only affecting you.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

Again, Doman Enclave. And the weird area in the Pixies' quest. Both areas you access that aren't instanced specifically for you and they change physically, down to not having the same collision boxes.

I don't think they will do it. But the fact is they can do it if they want to.

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But Doman Enclave only had you running around talking to NPCs and the foundations of all the buildings that changed were there all along. There was very little in the way of Interactive (for lack of a better word) MSQ content there. And while it was interesting to see the changes going on at first, it got rather boring simply because all we were doing was walking around to see the change without those changes impacting game play.

I imagine it would be a lot more difficult to pull off in areas where players need to fight creatures, and especially when players farther along in the story are trying to help friends who aren't.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

I didn't mean it in a technical sense, but rather a question of whether, say, fixing up Ishgard could be done effectively even when limited to just reskinning the sides of buildings, rubble piles, etc. Such would be a pretty large design constraint if, no matter the skins, the collision boxes must remain consistent for everyone.

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We've got example of where collision boxes aren't the same for everyone - Antithesis and the shield wall in Yanxia.

So it is possible, but we don't know how much work it would entail on a larger scale or how it would impact our ability to play with others. As I said above, I don't want to be experience the problems that phasing caused in Icecrown.

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Originally Posted by TheVigilant

In the Shadowbringers trailer we saw Y'shtola and Urianger watching Rak'tika Greatwood being destroyed like it's burning everywhere too, can't remember seeing that in the game later though. Perhaps things in the trailers don't necessarily exactly happen in the game.

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Good point but if I’m not mistaken for the SHB trailer in particular I’m pretty sure all those events happened some time before the WoL was brought to the first because Thancred at some point references the scene of him with then Minfilia in Eulmore, and when we get to Rak’Tika there’s still smoke seen coming out of that first camp that we enter, which I’m pretty sure is where that scene took place.

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Originally Posted by TheVigilant

In the Shadowbringers trailer we saw Y'shtola and Urianger watching Rak'tika Greatwood being destroyed like it's burning everywhere too, can't remember seeing that in the game later though. Perhaps things in the trailers don't necessarily exactly happen in the game.

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That is seen in the game. You come across the remains of a burned area in the Rak'tika Greatwood and then you meet Y'shtola, who doesn't recognise you.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

I didn't mean it in a technical sense, but rather a question of whether, say, fixing up Ishgard could be done effectively even when limited to just reskinning the sides of buildings, rubble piles, etc. Such would be a pretty large design constraint if, no matter the skins, the collision boxes must remain consistent for everyone.

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I think it could be achievable if they turned the rubble piles into something like street stalls or planter boxes. Rearrange the rubble version if they have to.

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Originally Posted by Serenno

...and when we get to Rak’Tika there’s still smoke seen coming out of that first camp that we enter, which I’m pretty sure is where that scene took place.

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I don't recall any smoke, and I'm pretty sure they said the fire had happened months ago, prompting the villagers to move to Slitherbough. They certainly don't seem like they just escaped.

At a minimum they could add new, unique weather to the old zones that is cataclysmic as well as new fates. I wouldn't really expect the new fates, but the weather is certainly doable. See, the Light weather and Starshowers weather from SHB.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Playing through Icecrown during Wrath of the Lich King absolutely sucked due to phasing. You couldn't help friends unless you were both on the same quest. You couldn't help friends if had completed the quest already. There were multiple other phasing issues in WoW even after that ("sorry you feel to your death as we crossed over a zone where we weren't on the the same phase"). They did some tweaking on the worst of the problems but still it was generally a poor experience when what you can see and what your friends can see are 2 different things.

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Don't forget "can't help summon the raid because phasing".

It got better later but Icecrown was terrible.