blue mage roulettes? your thoughts

last week I was running CT raids for log and I suggested maybe SE should do roulettes for just blue mages. the response I got was very positive. what if they added duty roulettes just for blue; levelling, 567, raids and alliance? maybe even a duty finder too?

I would settle for just being able to use the duty finder system to find groups for the blue mage log dungeons etc, having to use the party finder is .. eh ..

im not a big fan for the party finder either, id appreciate been able to use the duty finder

I'd be down for it, maybe give level 80 tomestones for it for a greater incentive. Maybe:

- Blue Mage Dungeon Roulette
- Blue Mage Trials Roulette

People can use them as part of their daily grind and people can queue to learn spells. Meaning there needs to be the means to queue duty roulette as Blue Mage but only pair with other Blue Mages.

I feel right now the biggest flaw with BLU content is longevity. I feel a long term incentive is needed because the content tapers off quickly when people move onto other things.

If we had Blue Mage Roulettes, I'd probably play Blue Mage :)

I DEFINITELY approve.

Make it happen. It'd encourage and give more people a reason to engage with Blue Mage if they aren't shafted by only being able to use the Party Finder.

I don't even go here, but...
There are enough BLUs in my FC that we don't really need the party finder, but things still suck and people get frustrated. Even if your friends enjoy doing BLU together, it can kinda become the only way to do BLU so you can't unless everyone is on and free.
And then it ends up causing problems because, well... we planned on doing Savage tonight (for example), but now we can't cuz it's their chance to do BLU so enough of the FC is doing that instead where we can't even run maps.

Giving BLUs more agency and freedom with how and when they run content is needed and I hope as SQEX keeps expanding and adding to BLU that something like this isn't too far away.

I think the main issue keeping BLU out of roulettes and Duty Finder in general is that, since you have so much freedom with the spells you can assign yourself, you would end up getting BLUs with very few spells, or BLUs with spells that are not helpful or relevant to the task. I'm not sure what the best way to make it work and not be frustrating would be. But I definitely agree that it's a bummer to be locked to PF.

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Originally Posted by Hexie

I think the main issue keeping BLU out of roulettes and Duty Finder in general is that, since you have so much freedom with the spells you can assign yourself, you would end up getting BLUs with very few spells, or BLUs with spells that are not helpful or relevant to the task. I'm not sure what the best way to make it work and not be frustrating would be. But I definitely agree that it's a bummer to be locked to PF.

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I think the way around this would be to have a minimal spell requirement and specify spells needed to fulfill each role.

Sure it's no guarantee people will map their skills efficiently but it's a risk I think you accept. These same risks exist in PF parties. I think keeping them Limited Jobs specific roulettes means everybody going in knows and accepts this risk.

It would be unfair and problematic if it was a regular Roulette.

I think a roulette would be great. Give me a reason to play my BLU regularly.
I am just not sure what good rewards would be. I guess I would be fine with some allied seals.

Of course it would be a risk when it comes to learned spell, but it is also the whole point of a roulette: you don't know what you are going to get.

I like the idea of roulettes for blue mages... but I do think it would be tricky for them to actually implement. While it's fine to go in as multiple heals/tanks since you can mimicry onto other players in the instance, others want you to have a set healer or a set tank, and with no one to target inside the instance, then you could just end up screwed (imagine trying to do TG Cid with no one on a dedicated healer mimicry. You'd die to the doom) And since the current duty finder system doesn't seem to be able to check buffs, I don't see a way they could mandate you be on certain mimicries if you queue in, especially if you're trying to do content as part of the roulette that's below level 60.

They could fix this if athereal mimicry just cycled you through roles rather than requiring a target... but you'd also have to sit and wait while people reset their skills and hotbars. And let's be honest, no one will do that.

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Originally Posted by wereotter

They could fix this if athereal mimicry just cycled you through roles rather than requiring a target... but you'd also have to sit and wait while people reset their skills and hotbars. And let's be honest, no one will do that.

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I'm not sure how possible it would be with the code but it would be nice to have "load outs" for spell sets so you can have one a the ready. Then change Athereal Mimicry to a cycle and then be able to change sets on the fly.

I'm down for more ways/excuses to play blue mage but I feel like duty roulette wouldn't have tank/healer/dps roles, it's gonna be 1st ultravibe/2nd ultravibe etc roles

I'd be interested in some kind of way for blue mages to like, self-limit so as to be able to queue for normal duties... like DBZ style weighted clothing or something, something to keep us from going super saiyan 3 so the normal jobs still feel like they're contributing.

Just make more rouletts, even if its just for glam or another khloe npc.... blue is so wasted until youre die hard into savage.

If they added a BLU roulette I would actually play it. As it stands now, being a 'limited' job, there's just no purpose for it. I can't use it in normal duties, there's no relics, etc. it's just if you really like the concept or running duties over and over for a spell to uh... go use in FATEs?

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Originally Posted by Doozer

... for a spell to uh... go use in FATEs?

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You say that like it's a bad thing. Having a blue mage with the good spells significantly sped up all of the multiple fate grinding steps for my relic weapons.

I enjoy blue mage regardless, though.

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Originally Posted by gilmorej

You say that like it's a bad thing. Having a blue mage with the good spells significantly sped up all of the multiple fate grinding steps for my relic weapons.

I enjoy blue mage regardless, though.

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They're still good for relics. Syrcus with a group of blue mages is under 10 minutes, assuming enough have a decent set of skills unlocked plus moon flute and all that.

Though castrum has other incentives now so there's maybe slightly less people blue mage grinding.

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Originally Posted by gilmorej

You say that like it's a bad thing. Having a blue mage with the good spells significantly sped up all of the multiple fate grinding steps for my relic weapons.

I enjoy blue mage regardless, though.

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And you say that like it's more than just a single thing you can do with it. If you're not grinding for relics, then what? My point was that I can do any duty with my other jobs but unless you have a full party of blue mages to do certain things, it's really only good for FATEs. My point still stands.

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Originally Posted by Doozer

And you say that like it's more than just a single thing you can do with it. If you're not grinding for relics, then what? My point was that I can do any duty with my other jobs but unless you have a full party of blue mages to do certain things, it's really only good for FATEs. My point still stands.

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What do you mean "then what?" Blue mage can do any content that any class up to lv 70 can do, except for PoTD and Eureka. Just because you can't use duty finder, and have to interact with people to set things up and have fun with it doesn't mean it's "really only good for FATES."

Have some imagination, man. Boiling the argument all the way down to "I can run all old content as many times as I want in duty finder with any other class" is really boring.

Blue Mage can even solo a lot of things now.

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Originally Posted by wereotter

I like the idea of roulettes for blue mages... but I do think it would be tricky for them to actually implement. While it's fine to go in as multiple heals/tanks since you can mimicry onto other players in the instance, others want you to have a set healer or a set tank, and with no one to target inside the instance, then you could just end up screwed (imagine trying to do TG Cid with no one on a dedicated healer mimicry. You'd die to the doom) And since the current duty finder system doesn't seem to be able to check buffs, I don't see a way they could mandate you be on certain mimicries if you queue in, especially if you're trying to do content as part of the roulette that's below level 60.

They could fix this if athereal mimicry just cycled you through roles rather than requiring a target... but you'd also have to sit and wait while people reset their skills and hotbars. And let's be honest, no one will do that.

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Depends what kind of roulette. If it's a dungeon roulette, then you don't really need a tank or healer mimicry. You'd just need to play it a bit safe. As long as someone has might guard and white wind, it would be fine.
If it's a raid roulette, it would probably be another story...

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Blue Mage can even solo a lot of things now.

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Part of that relies on some above average play, or very extended play, some of what I've seen reminds me of Red Mage solo in FFXI lol, and or having obtained certain spells already. Like I see people post "look I can do this dungeon solo" and I'm looking that they've a bunch of other harder to get spells first from PF, so.. kind of.

I do think if they boosted the basic instinct a bit more it would be much more manageable though. Like I suggested primal instinct later, perhaps level 50 or 60, that activates all the mimicry at once (even if you don't have mimicry, buff can just be primal mimicry- at that point with that you could probably then go get it lol). Since just having mimicry greatly improves your solo ability. Or perhaps add a learning bonus to basic instinct it so blue mage runs the roulette unsynced. . (and not have to do it 20 times for an instance, which is a bit soul crushing lol). I think keeping the sync concept but a boost would be better though.

Or perhaps by having instinct you unlock some new features to other spells, like Angel Whisper now applies to self as an auto raise (cooldown doesn't activate until the auto-raise triggers). Helping with some of those one shot mechanics. To not mess up the AI too much it'd probably have to raise you instantly without any pop-up though with a short invlun.

In general to the thread though, an actual DF-like roulette would be neat-- may help a lot for the non-extreme spells (extreme being content that requires people to have certain load outs). It's going to be a wild mess for the content that does need a load out though lol (unless they force something, but at that point that they're forcing you into loadouts it's getting awfully close to "why didn't you just make that a normal job then" :P).

Wish SE would just bring BLU up to the level cap with each expansion's X.5.5 patch. At that point it's just catch up and waiting for the next expansion, why not let BLU players have some fun in content that's still at least a little relevant?

An interesting idea... but I can think of a couple of twists on it.

Option #1 - Dedicated Blue Mage Roulettes
This is grouping BLUs with other BLUs to run content... which could be interesting, but may suffer from low participation. Still, it would probably make it easier for a lot of BLUs to join in and have some fun; along with making the acquisition of some spells a lot more reasonable.

Option #2 - Allowing Blue Mages into Roulettes
This is the riskier option... but could be worth the risk if handled well. The catch is how to implement this, simply because BLUs are like rolling the dice for what you'll get; you may end up with someone with a really bad set-up, or you may end up with someone who knows how to break the game as BLU. Luckily roulettes are restricted to normal-difficulty content, so the tuning may be lax enough to allow them entry. Just to throw out a few ideas:

• Limit of one BLU per party, in a DPS slot; this translates to 3 BLU for . This should keep the clearing of content possible in the event the BLU ends up being dead weight.
• Not allowed into current content... though the level restriction on BLU may suffice for that already. This also keeps them out of Mentor Roulette if I'm not mistaken.
• Disabling certain spells for lower level content... looking at 1k needles specifically here.
• Minimum number of spells equipped to access content, based on content level. So stuff like needing 10 spells for Satasha, 20 spells for level 50 content, and all 24 spells for 60+ content. No guarantee to be dead weight, but a minor safeguard.
• More for dungeons specifically, where BLU could have an outsize effect, but not partied with players who haven't cleared the content before. Mostly to keep the first-time experience "genuine". This one is probably flexible.

The hypothesis is that you may find yourself in the situation where the BLU has to be carried, nor having them instantly break the experience (especially for first-timers)... so it's just finding the right safeguards.

Still, that would be a lot of fun.

I wish blue could use the roulette system. It would be fun, but I don't think SE has plans to ever add it and i wouldn't hold my breath it'll be added. It would really encourage more often playing as blue if it had a roulette. SE don't want to risk blues trolling with either lack of spells or overpowered spells.

The simplest option is to do absolutely nothing now that blu has the ability to solo dungeons.

You can join/create a pf group for something specific or just go solo it yourself.

There’s simply no need for a roulette anymore on blu. Even things like leveling are vastly faster outside of the dungeon system for them.

I'd definitely appreciate it for 24 man and 8 man content. It's a lot easier to find a group of Blue Mages for dungeons - or just clear them solo style - but when it comes to getting the log completion, finding people to tackle 8 man and 24 man content with is tough. A lot of people don't want to do it a second time once they've completed it themselves, too, so anybody who doesn't do such challenges immediately is often left stuck.

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Originally Posted by Garnix

Depends what kind of roulette. If it's a dungeon roulette, then you don't really need a tank or healer mimicry. You'd just need to play it a bit safe. As long as someone has might guard and white wind, it would be fine.
If it's a raid roulette, it would probably be another story...

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That's why I specifically called out TG Cid, first mechanic of the fight is you have to be healed to 100% health from single digit. You can't do that with White Wind, you need an actual healer. Any of those charybdis style effects, really, you can't get out of just using White Wind. That's why I would say that there are a couple stumbling blocks they would need to address before a blue mage roulette would be viable.

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Originally Posted by Infindox

I'm not sure how possible it would be with the code but it would be nice to have "load outs" for spell sets so you can have one a the ready. Then change Athereal Mimicry to a cycle and then be able to change sets on the fly.

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They do already let you save spell loadouts in the spellbook... but you also can't load them while under a mimicry (I feel like if mimicry is in both spell sets, it really should let you swap them over)

So really the easiest way to fix that would be to save hotbars to a gear set. Then you can have a gear set saved for tank/healer/DPS depending on the roles you're comfortable playing, and just load that up in the instance (since you're not changing jobs, the game will let you load up a different gearset) and it could potentially just load up that set's hotbar along with it.

I'm own for anything that makes BLU easier to use. I love playing it and loved collecting all the spells, but I hate having to create a damned PF for every group related thing I wanted to do.

BLU roulette would be great.

I do not play a blue mage but I would be all for it being able to choose either a dps/tank/healer role and lock the other abilities out except the role-based abilities and somewhat normalize the class. I was actually hoping an expanded blue mage role would have been part of the expansion presentation.

Absolutely! I actually think they should turn the Blue Mage log into an actual duty finder while still keeping the party finder option.

And adding a daily roulette with good rewards would surely give incentive to have people running content as blue mages.

Would absolutely love a "BLU-ty Finder"

fantastic comments off everyone <3 come on SE give Blue some more loving! :D

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Originally Posted by Hexie

I think the main issue keeping BLU out of roulettes and Duty Finder in general is that, since you have so much freedom with the spells you can assign yourself, you would end up getting BLUs with very few spells, or BLUs with spells that are not helpful or relevant to the task. I'm not sure what the best way to make it work and not be frustrating would be. But I definitely agree that it's a bummer to be locked to PF.

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Yeah, I had a BLU tank that had no idea what he was doing in Doma Castle/Castrum Abania the other day. It was dreadful. No Mighty Guard, spamming Basic Instinct, using Blood Drain for damage, etc.

I couldn't imagine having a roulette full of people like that. It's already frustrating enough having people wanting to coast through leveling dungeons using only two buttons on regular jobs.

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Originally Posted by wereotter

That's why I specifically called out TG Cid, first mechanic of the fight is you have to be healed to 100% health from single digit. You can't do that with White Wind, you need an actual healer.

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With 8 BLUs in each party, assuming they all have Exuviation, even without Healer Mimicry, 8 Exuviations would still get everyone up high enough that one or two White Winds would cap HP. They already give us content like Delubnum Reginae that has no role restrictions and it works, so 8x BLU, the most powerful job in the game, could work out in any content. The BLUs just have to have the spells.

Plus, if people were smart, they'd all just load in with Healer Mimcry, since the other two mimicries are far less powerful overall.

A little bit beyond what I ever expect, but I wouldn’t mind an “explore” mode for dungeon where it has monsters you can kill but no overall objective.

That is to say, you start the Dungeon with all checkpoints/doors/switches open as if the dungeon was cleared...except mobs are present. Also a shortcut from each boss room back to the entrance. Also Also, some kind of switch that respawns bosses.

So, you could just go to the final boss.