Esuna - Feedback and Discussion

Hiya folks,

If you could make an adjustment to the White Mage's Esuna spell, which one would you make? Or would you change the situation in which Esuna would be a more attractive choice? If one of the following adjustments were made, I think I would like Esuna more than I do now (not to say that I don't like it now, but I think I could like it more).

1) Esuna is instant cast.
2) Esuna has minimal to no recast time.
3) Esuna targets multiple allies without using Sacred Prism.
4) Esuna removes multiple enfeebling effects.
5) Enfeebling effects last longer.
6) Enfeebling effects have a greater impact.

Reasoning:

When using Esuna, it removes one enfeebling effect and has a recast time of about 10 seconds. Many enfeebling effects don't seem to last more than 20 seconds. This may let you remove an enfeebling effect off of two party members without using Presence of Mind or Sacred Prism. Or remove two effects from one party member. Then the enfeebling effect is gone.

This is short(er) than expected for a hidden box. Pause.

Hi Fiosha,

Definitely some good suggestions that would make Esuna much more potent and useful, but I'd also say that it might be balanced the way it is to allow *some* usefulness for Alchemists & Potions.

If Esuna was Instant Cast and/or hit Multiple Allies, I think it would diminish Alchemists & Potions even more than they are already.

I think out of your list, I'd choose #5: "Enfeebling effects last longer," but only for certain effects. For example, Petrification lasts for 30 sec IIRC, which is more than enough of a "time out" if you get hit by it.

Some Poisons are pretty brutal (like Chimera's), but I understand it's pretty rare in the game right now.

I've been finding it really useful in specific situations, namely, in case the other healer gets hit with Silence in the Coincounter fight and to take off status effects from Bad Breath, since those last longer. Looking at these fights I'm guessing we will start to see more potent status effects down the line. It's a very fine line that Esuna is on because it will also end up having to affect status recovery medications, and I'm sure most of us would rather see Esuna be used regularly with the meds in emergencies rather than the other way around.

As was said, status effects are pretty powerful in this game (Poison consistently surprises me). I could see status effects lasting a bit longer in future encounters, but battles in this game are a lot quicker than they were in FF11 so status effects lasting for 20 seconds takes you out of the fight for a comparatively long time, and I personally never want to have a status effect for 20 minutes like I one had in that game. You don't need to Esuna everything, as much as your healer OCD might demand. It's up to you to pick and choose whether it is safe or necessary to use it, and making it risky makes battles fun, and making it so you can't always 100% clear status effects makes it so these status effects can provide the challenge necessary for interesting battles.

Also, just try to get more practice with it. If you see an enfeebling skill being prepared, you can preemptively begin casting Esuna and it will fell like the status effect was never there.

Did something change for Esuna since 1.21 first came out? If so, I missed it.

The 1.20 patch notes say: "Removes all enfeebling effects from target. Recast Time: 10 sec."
... so it doesn't just remove a single enfeebling effect?

Mayhaps, I have been only viewing it toward the old world stuff (where Silence is a deal breaker versus say Blind where melees are still finishing battle sans sight).

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Originally Posted by Mikita

Did something change for Esuna since 1.21 first came out? If so, I missed it.

The 1.20 patch notes say: "Removes all enfeebling effects from target. Recast Time: 10 sec."
... so it doesn't just remove a single enfeebling effect?

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It removes one enfeebling effect. And if this would continue, I guess I was also hoping that it would have a shorter cast time.

The only thing i would change is to remove 2 enfeebling, the rest will stay the same. Also add the poisona,blindna and all those spells would be great. Trying to remove a Morbol poison with all those enfeebling can be a pain.

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4) Esuna removes multiple enfeebling effects.

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This one would be great.
I hate it when the tank gets hit with 8 different kinds of enfeebling magic, I cast Esuna to get rid of a problematic one, and the one vanishing is the most unimportant one of all of them-.-

I'd also be fine with being able to pick which debuff I want removed, but that would add another menu in the middle of the fight which would take too long and make things overly complicated so it would be nicer if Esuna just removed ALL debuffs from one single target, even at the cost of a longer cooldown or higher MP consumption.

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Originally Posted by Myrhn

The only thing i would change is to remove 2 enfeebling, the rest will stay the same. Also add the poisona,blindna and all those spells would be great. Trying to remove a Morbol poison with all those enfeebling can be a pain.

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You should be removing all status effects from the tank, anyway. If other people are getting hit by Bad Breath really often they need to... not get hit by it lol. Blood Drops are also really cheap at the Grand Companies (20 drops for 5 seals I think) so they can be used in emergencies or if someone gets hit by the breath on occasion.

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Did something change for Esuna since 1.21 first came out? If so, I missed it.

The 1.20 patch notes say: "Removes all enfeebling effects from target. Recast Time: 10 sec."
... so it doesn't just remove a single enfeebling effect?

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It's just poor wording. It removes ALL status effects but it only removes one at a time. Removing all at once would be a bit much.

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Mayhaps, I have been only viewing it toward the old world stuff (where Silence is a deal breaker versus say Blind where melees are still finishing battle sans sight).

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The thing I've noticed about this game is that most of the worst status are either single target or avoidable somehow except for maybe the tank, and even then there are a great deal of moves non-tanks can avoid through moving or positioning. It's not like FF11 where there were a lot of enemies whose AOE silence or paralyze ranges were much larger than casting range or a bunch of unavoidable AOE for melees. Since with practice and positioning or otherwise proper playing you can avoid a good deal of status effects, I don't think Esuna needs to be boosted but players need to get better at avoiding moves, staying out of AOE range, and just using better tactics.

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Originally Posted by Estellios

It's just poor wording. It removes ALL status effects but it only removes one at a time. Removing all at once would be a bit much.

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I see now. Thank you for the clarification!

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

1) Esuna is instant cast.

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Wouldn't hurt any balance imho and you could remove the poison from Morbols Bad Breath somehow >< (Atm the Poison wears off before i can cast Esuna a third or fourth time to remove it :P )

Edit: To keep the balance for other enfeebs, SE could make it so that you have to cast it twice for some strong enfeebs of enemies that only use one or two enfeebs.

Personally I'm finding Esuna to be way too slow to be viable compared to debuff duration (which is balanced because of the fast paced gameplay). Just last night I was tanking and I had my WHM friend on ventrillo healing me. I would say petrify, and he would respond almost immediately but by the time he finished casting the debuff only ever had 5 seconds left on it.

Also, I don't understand why it can only remove one effect. If it's capable of removing the enfeeble at all, it should remove it. It's not like we can pick which one we want to remove, and the way it stands now makes it pretty useless.

If I had to go with your options, I'd go with 1,2,4 with a light combination of 5 and 6 - the last two augmented by dLVL (no random eye should be able to petrify someone for 5 minutes).

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

Hiya folks,

If you could make an adjustment to the White Mage's Esuna spell, which one would you make? Or would you change the situation in which Esuna would be a more attractive choice? If one of the following adjustments were made, I think I would like Esuna more than I do now (not to say that I don't like it now, but I think I could like it more).

1) Esuna is instant cast.
2) Esuna has minimal to no recast time.
3) Esuna targets multiple allies without using Sacred Prism.
4) Esuna removes multiple enfeebling effects.
5) Enfeebling effects last longer.
6) Enfeebling effects have a greater impact.

Reasoning:

When using Esuna, it removes one enfeebling effect and has a recast time of about 10 seconds. Many enfeebling effects don't seem to last more than 20 seconds. This may let you remove an enfeebling effect off of two party members without using Presence of Mind or Sacred Prism. Or remove two effects from one party member. Then the enfeebling effect is gone.

This is short(er) than expected for a hidden box. Pause.

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Instant cast.

insta cast and spammable would make me happy to use it more.

I've been thinking about Esuna for a while and have thought of some suggestions.

The number of enfeebling effects it removes could scale with healing/enhancement magic skill?

The target of Esuna could get a large resistance boost to the removed enfeeb for a short duration?

Esuna could last for a short duration, removing one enfeeb every tick over a certain time period ? (Think like Regen)

These are just some fun ideas I thought of that might make Esuna more desirable

Ive personally found this spell to be ALMOST useless. The recast time on it is what kills it, especially since there are no poisona, stona, paralyna, etc :(

I'd go with allowing it to remove all status effects simultaneously.

To balance, up the MP cost, making the very fact of needing to use it eat into your MP-management plans.

I would have to say that of all the suggestions you've made, number 4 would be the best by far.
Esuna's timer and purpose of being is very good. The only problem is when you usually use it (boss/raids/hamlet) more then one debuff stacks onto your teammates...and usually more then one teammate at that. Ideally you can get two whm's to use AoE Esuna to get two debuffs gone, but in say...mistresses case, it feels like there is 2 more debuffs you got to get. And again, thats Ideally.

I'm in favor for making Esuna get rid of several debuffs at a time, or wiping a player completely clean. Its a useful spell and again, the timer is completely fine...it's just the several stacks and enemy aoe debuffs that are the issue.

At there should be a level after obtaining Esuna where it removes more then one stat...although I doubt it cause its a jobs spell.

I hope they change this, at least slightly.

Either...

A) Give it a lower 'recast' time... or,
B) Let us choose which enfeebling effect it removes (MUCH less likely)

I currently approve of needing 'sacred prism' for making it an AoE. It seems fair and balanced considering there are already several spells you must 'choose' between when considering which AoE move you will cycle.

Sometimes, I do the end of Aurum Vale (Miser's Mistress) as the only healer. When the tank gets hit with bad breath, it takes me FOREVER to take off all of the enfeebles, and I can't choose which one will be removed. Most of the time, I can't even get them all off before the tank is enfeebled again.

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

1) Esuna is instant cast.
2) Esuna has minimal to no recast time.
4) Esuna removes multiple enfeebling effects.

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These three should kinda be non-negotiable. If the developers decide to start using debuffs as part of encounter mechanics, Esuna's cast time will very much act against the players (between danger of said debuffs and movement to avoid any hazzards/attacks). Likewise, Esuna having a recast is not that great because then you play russian roulette with who you think will end up needing it more (again, assuming debuffs are used as part of encounter design). Lastly, the potential for multiple debuffs is there, which again puts Esuna at a disadvantage.

Personally, Esuna should be instant-cast, have no cooldown and remove at the most two effects. In rare cases where you have a status that has to be removed from everyone ASAP, then you can use Sacred Prism.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

Sometimes, I do the end of Aurum Vale (Miser's Mistress) as the only healer. When the tank gets hit with bad breath, it takes me FOREVER to take off all of the enfeebles, and I can't choose which one will be removed. Most of the time, I can't even get them all off before the tank is enfeebled again.

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People keep bringing up Aurumn Vale, but that's entirely the whole point of Bad Breath and a Malboro boss. Bad Breath is supposed to be a pain in the ass and part of the difficulty of it is that it sticks so much status on your tank (and if it's not only your tank getting hit, then it is your DD's own fault). There are medicines that are perfect for anyone getting hit by Bad Breath that they can use in emergencies, either Lung Drops (remove poison + silence) or Heart drops (remove poison + paralysis). I don't think I've done anything besides Malboros and Soulgazer that put a large amount of long-lasting debuffs and that's their gimmick. If you make Esuna too easy to use you will not only neuter those encounters just for having a WHM around you trivialize any kind of fight with enfeebles so much that enfeebles might not even exist.

Don't forget that now most enfeebles get reduced durations and outright resists if they continuously land on the same target, too. It's the same rules for players as it is for enemies.

Hell, you can avoid almost every debuff WS in the game with proper positioning. Level 5 Petrify, for example, has a really long windup time and you can easily run out of range if you are paying even the slightest attention.

I know being a healer it may drive you crazy to have any negative icon on anybody but sometimes you just gotta learn to deal with it and pick and choose who to prioritize. It keeps healing challenging and takes practice and learning encounters to know how to deal with it.

Esuna is fine the way it is, IMO.

I like this idea.

Just wait til we get the upgraded version i.e. Erase

I miss having my "blindna, cursna, paralyna, etc" from ffxi, i understand having less skills since we only have 3 bars but at least have a "stona" so i can specifically remove petrify

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Originally Posted by WinnipegJet

Esuna is fine the way it is, IMO.

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this/10char

I would be interested in perhaps leaving it the way it is, but enabling Cure Combos. (I know cure combos have been mentioned by players in the past)

This would be a cool way to turn Esuna into an AoE off a combo, or make it hit all debuffs on the target off a combo.

Would be a great way to do increase its efficiency without allowing you to spam it on the whole party over and over.

Change Esuna to an AoE with 20 second recast, and make a single-targeted Erase with a fast recast (<2 seconds).
At the moment everyone keeps saying to not waste mp on Esuna but instead to focus on AoE stoneskin and/or regen, to me, that's like wasting a whole spell rendering it useless.